Nick Cave & the Bad Seeds 'Skeleton Tree' (September 2016)

If you told me this album was the result of Cave writing lyrics and then improvising melodies in real time--one take--over some of he and Ellis' soundtrack work, I'd definitely believe you.

― Wimmels, Monday, September 12, 2016 12:01 PM (nine minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

So the impression I get is that for the second Grinderman record and "Push the Sky Away" that the writing process was essentially this, followed by a second longer (? I guessing here I don't really know) writing/recording session with the whole band(s) where everything was shaped a bit more into "songs" and some of the looser qualities were buffed out.

But, this record, with what they've said in the movie and kind of reading between the lines is, that instead of the second session they basically just tweaked what was already recorded, possibly instead of overthinking what they'd already done and maybe cuz it doesn't like they are going to tour anytime soon they didn't have to really worry about "how are we going to play this live?".

Pure speculation.

I liked the movie, I like the record so far, agreed on the vocals/lyrics are great, I've listened to a it few times, might let it marinate for a little bit before I go back to it.

It sounds exactly as you describe. I appreciate the approach, but I'm just not sure it works.

"Rings of Saturn" sounds like Cave's version of "E-Bow the Letter" to me

anyone else feel kind of gross about the existence of this album and movie

not trying to police anyone else's grief and how they deal with it. i can't imagine doing the same thing but i haven't been there. but something about the circumstances around the album investing it with extra meaning feels ... cheap somehow. not saying this was done intentionally or cynically. i guess the solution is to come back to the album/movie in five years and seeing how they hold up out of context.

the only thing that made me go o_O was the decision to show the movie in 3d which just seems so gimmicky. im still stoked to see it.

I didn't see the movie in 3D, but there were a couple shots I could tell were done with that effect in mind (the focus-pulling shot in the stairwell comes to mind, a couple of other spots) and while I think it would have been cool to see in the way Godard's 3d feature was cool to see I don't think it was crucial to my experience of it.

Maybe if I could have seen Warren's beard flying at me that would be sweet though.

As far as the "gross"-ness...the press surrounding the album/movie *cough*Amanda Palmer-thinkpiece*cough*feels a lot grosser that the actual product.

I think on some level it's clear that movie is his way of having to avoid interviews & touring while still doing something for his fan base. The moment in the movie where he talks about realizing he's snapping accidentally at a fan who is saying "we're all with you man" was pretty affecting, even if he immediately inverts it by wondering how he became a figure of pity.

I also I really don't like the millennial whoops on "Rings of Saturn" but I might feel worse knowing that's what they're called.

yep. I liked that song until I followed that stupid hyperlink, now I want to kill myself

My feeling is that while there may be a bit of catharsis, I have to imagine that much of this work was already "in the pipeline" and instead of putting the whole project on the shelf why not go ahead and delve? Look, first and foremost, the guy's a father, and nothing wrong with working through the grief of it all -- secondly, he's an artist, so, why the fuck not throw it out there? It's not like we're talking about some superficial dweeb like Kanye or something, this is Nick-fucking-Cave; and there's no filthy lucre in sight.

Some people need to get back to work as soon as possible after such a traumatic event just in an effort to restore some normalcy to their lives.

yeah, his wife said work was the only thing could keep her mind somewhat off what had happened

It's not as if he's following the Eric Clapton playbook for financializing his child's death.

Wonder if he's ever going to rethink the idea of doing a memoir. Would love to read his take on things.
Could be the being vehemently against doing something like that is something he left behind a while back.

Just hoping also that he's taking care of himself. Hate to hear that after a history of struggling with substance abuse he returned to something negative.

I find the set quite affecting, more than anything he's done since Abattoir Blues, maybe earlier. But yeah, the project as a whole brings out a lot of mixed feelings, which I wrote about over here http://dustedmagazine.tumblr.com/post/150358081791/nick-cave-and-the-bad-seeds-skeleton-tree-bad

D0rian Lynskey on twitter today: "I hope Skeleton Tree doesn't get pinned to its backstory forever. It's so beautiful and compelling even if you come to it knowing nothing."

While I truly, truly sympathise with this, it's probably wishful thinking. A record like this will never be separated from the backstory I think.

Hmm maayyyybe... I got into a lot of albums (can't think of many examples right now but we could do a thread) that are very concepty, Blood on the Tracks for instance, without any clue abt backstory

xpost - I don't know if it was a good idea to bring up Tom Waits as a counterpoint to Cave, not sure he's any less mannered or melodramatic than Cave! if anything his whole cracked hobo thing is more put on imo

Guardian reviewed the lp today
https://www.theguardian.com/music/2016/sep/15/nick-cave-and-the-bad-seeds-skeleton-tree-review-brilliant-music-on-the-verge-of-collapse

Great review

Very good review indeed. I'm not completely sure where he gets his info though. Believe it was mentioned in this thread that album recording was in progress when Cave's son died - but it's not very clear from the movie, is it? So when was the material written? It's true Cave talks a lot about fearfulness wrt artistic premonition, but he also suggests that both music and lyrics for Jesus Alone were improvised. Something that goes well with the director's comment that there's a certain helplessness to the recordings and Cave's discussion of allowing less accomplished, more intuitive lyrics.

I think this is a pretty incredible album, and is hitting me much more than Push the Sky Away ever did. Maybe I need to listen to that one again? Anyway, Cave sounds so ragged and weary on this, not in his usual stylized way but something much more haunted and hurt and hoarse. I'm trying to put my finger on something specific it reminds me of, something similarly incantation-y, but so far the comparison is eluding me. Not Leonard Cohen, not ... Scott Walker? Maybe later Scott Walker. I'll try to dredge it up.

I really love this record. I had to step away from it for a bit and distance myself from the experience of the movie to really let it sink in, but I loved the last one but yeah this one is really amazing, his voice is so good, weirdly the other day I was thinking this is kind of his Tonight's the Night, kind of ragged, sad, loose...at the same time this record kind of defies any easy comparison.

yeah that's a good comparison i think, def feels like it sort of stands apart in his catalog the way TNT does in neil's

TTN is a good call

Totally in love with this now. It gets better with every play.

They usually tour around the time of a record release but I can't see them going out to play this one live, not sure how it would work.

I listened to it once and it sounded fantastic (and devastating) but I need it to get colder and darker before I really immerse myself in it.

Tonight's the Night of course being a kind of "fun" sad record in the way a drunken wake is "fun". This record just feels more like...sitting around the kitchen table after getting home in your funeral clothes and the world moving on and feeling hollow and sad.

I love the way he let's the meter & rhythm of lines spill over the music, like he isn't going to let when the measure ends stop him from getting out this idea he has.

Last night the thing that at dawn on me that makes his performance so striking...this is a Nick Cave record where he has no swagger, no confidence, no Grinderman dick swinging, no Birthday Party nihilism, no Bad Seeds Dylan-cum-Elvis-cum-Cohen he is just barely getting through it, except for one moment in "Distant Sky" where he leans in on the line "call the gas man, cut the power" which is kind of the weirdly heartbreaking moment of the whole record for me.

Great post. So otm

Yeah, and none of the precision or poise of the previous ballad records - even the vocals on really downcast, gloomy songs like "Darker With the Day" never sounded less than elegant and considered.

This is growing on me, and I want to listen to it but I should really not listen to it

One More Time With Feeling is being shown locally again on the 1st of December. So I assume that must mean it's being shown elsewhere on the same night.

I saw a trailer for it the other night. Presumed it's going on general release.

Not sure how general. still seems to be limited. From the website it looks like it's a one off in a lot of places.

Thee was an article on him and the director in the Guardian today
https://www.theguardian.com/film/2016/nov/24/nick-cave-doc-director-andrew-dominik-he-hated-a-third-of-my-movie

So got to see the film tonight and it is very moving.

Wonder if it is going to get a full distribution at any point, since i think tonight was just like September in only being a one off showing in a number fo venues.

Don't know if i've seen Thomas Wydler's drumkit before but it looks a bit weird dunnit? Pretty minimal. Is that what he normally plays?

The Cave/Ellis 'Mars' soundtrack is really lovely stuff

Live sets from the Australian tour are around on torrent sites. Have seen 3 so far.

Arena tour announced for the autumn:

http://www.nickcave.com/

Great that he's able to play arenas now, but I can't imagine how his fire-and-brimstone approach to live performance will translate to a barn like the O2.

Have you seen him live? He'll be fine.

I meant for the audience.

I'm a bit wary of the size of these venues and it isn't what I expected after Skeleton Tree, but I hope they'll make it work. I also fear the price of tickets, but we'll try to go regardless.

seen him open air twice, he had no problems at all

that was before skeleton tree, tho

If it was coming off the back of different kind of album maybe I'd feel less wary, but I'm sure they know what they're doing, so I've faith enough to buy tickets.

i have a review copy of the 3-disc greatest hits "lovely creatures" and it sounds great, everything is taken from the remasters, and actually does work as a representation of his artistic permutations in chronological order. why anyone would get the out-of-order 2 disc box set, tho, is anyone's guess

I saw the movie on an airplane and it was as good as many said, even in 2D. (And on an airplane.) I did wonder, though, how much someone who didn't know Cave at all would get from it. It does tackle some universal themes, however elliptically, and it's quite artistic, but I dunno.

It's funny, I was just thinking of compiling a career overview and this does the trick very nicely. As with any of these I could quibble about a few tracks included or missing but overall it's great. It flows really well and reminded me how fantastic "Abboitior Blues" and "Dig Lazarus" are.

Excellent, wide-ranging new interview:

http://www.gq.com/story/the-love-and-terror-of-nick-cave

yup good stuff, thx

love the Russell Crowe anecdotes that guy seems so hilarious

That is excellent, thank you.