Nilsson - C or D?

Never thought of Auntie Grizelda as part of that whole business to be honest! More like dressing up as a psychedelic rock band, plus "antics," for the kids. See also important early Doctor Casino release Are there more songs like "Him Or Me (What's It Gonna Be)," "Your Auntie Grizelda," and "My Uncle Used To Love Me But She Died?" And if so, what are they? .

Watching "Midnight Cowboy" and was reminded how classic Nilsson was.

"Spaceman" is better than "Space Oddity" and "Rocket Man" you know

OTM

Picked up the Flash Harry reissue from a few years back and have to say it's better than I was ever led to believe. Lovely sound, some nice songs, Nilsson's pipes aren't in great shape but it's pleasant. People who like Knnillssonn and can tolerate Eric Idle will find this enjoyable.

Just finished "Nilsson: The Life Of A Singer-Songwriter" by Alyn Shipton which I got out of the library. For an artist who died 25 years ago and who kind of flew under the radar in a lot of ways, it’s extremely well-written and researched and ultimately pretty heartbreaking.

There are tons of great stories in here – including a crazy hitchhiking story when he was super young. The drama in his backstory alone—being told by his mother that his dad was dead when he had actually started another family, discovering in his forties that his parents had given birth to another brother—is pretty amazing. It’s not hard to understand what drove his music and self-destructiveness.

There’s also a lot of good detail on the music itself and insight from his various collaborators (Richard Perry, VDP, Perry Botkin) on how (and why) he really sabotaged his own career. It really paints Son of Schmilsson as a pivotal record in him turning his back on stardom – I knew about “You’re Breaking My Heart,” but less about him refusing to write a hit, do second takes and tone down dirty lyrics. Perry tells one story of trying to get him to only release the second, more romantic half of “The Most Beautiful World in the World” but Harry insisted that the cod-reggae first half be included and ending the record with the lines:

And over your shoulder
You look back to see if it's real
Tell her she's beautiful
Roll the world over
And give her a kiss and a feel

Also lots of great detail on his mid-70s party records, Popeye shenanigans in Malta, stage and film work in the 80s. Like most of these things, it’s pretty depressing in parts, but also fascinating in that he was creative, productive and witty to the end, beloved by an enormous group of friends and utterly uncompromised. You want to be sad but as the author notes, it’s hard to think the guy didn’t wrench every minute out of his 52 years.

thanks for sharing that

nilsson sings newman is so fucking good

Some great stuff on that album as well -- going in to how the overdubbing Nilsson does with his voice on that was pretty much without precedent at the time (and may still be). I may even want to go read that passage again, now that I think of it ...

how the overdubbing Nilsson does with his voice on that was pretty much without precedent at the time (and may still be)

slow yr roll there

I mean, this was post-"Smile"

Did Smile have a lot of overdubs? Edits yes, but not aware of it having lots of multi-tracked vocs.

heard some of the Popeye demos on WFMU

Did Smile have a lot of overdubs? Edits yes, but not aware of it having lots of multi-tracked vocs.

is this a joke...

there are tons of multi-tracked vocals all over the Beach Boys work from like '66 on, including demos/early studio versions where Brian would do all the voices himself etc.

and the stuff on Smile is particularly dense

not to take away from Nilsson - who was an incredible singer and vocal arranger - but he was not unique in this regard, or the first (or the last). Certainly post-1970 there's tons of intricately arranged, densely multi-tracked vocals on pop records, from stuff I hate (like Queen, who definitely went up into the high end of numbers of tracks range) to stuff I love (like the Bee Gees).

Personally I'm a little skeptical of the "118 overdubs" claim in 1970, I'd like to see the tracklist for that, given that the first 24-track recorder wasn't even invented until 4 years later. In 1970 putting 118 tracks on a recording (presumably using a 16-track recorder) would probably involve a serious amount of signal degradation due to all the bounce-downs you'd have to do.

Sounds like 118 nilssons tho

I'm with you on hating Queen despite their craftsmanship.

Yeah, there are def. some similarities on this record with Smile (which, mind, was mostly unreleased in 1969). Nilsson def. also had an obsessive quality to getting vocal takes right (which apparently annoyed Newman -- he prob. meant "118 takes"). And there is a Glenn Gould-ish aspect to how tracks on both records are spliced together to create the feeling of a perfect, seamless performance (and of course, Smile/VDP-->Song Cycle/"Vine Street"-->Nilsson Sings Newman/"Vine Street").

But there are some pretty big differences, as well, not least of which is that Smile is a big, maximalist record performed by a studio orchestra and sung by an ensemble and Nilsson Sings Newman is a record where the dude himself is an orchestra. While there are vocal overdubs on Smile, most of the "wow" factor on that album is the arrangements. Also, Nilsson Sings Newman is in stereo, which Nilsson's vocal arrangements use to great effect.

Beyond that tho, is Nilsson's voice, which was more far more versatile than anyone's in the Beach Boys. Don't get me wrong, I love the purity of Brian's voice and Carl's vocals on Wild Honey but no one in the Beach Boys was ever going to pull off something like "Without You" or "Spaceman" (or even "Sail Away" from years later). Even by 1969, the strength of Nilsson's voice lets him explore some pretty sophisticated, witty arrangements, and create different shades to the music (i.e., "I'll Be Home"'s gospel choir -- or "Vine Street," which feels Beach Boys-esque in places but without any trace of the Four Freshman) In general, there is a more seamless feel to his arrangements.

All that said, I don't hear Nilsson Sings Newman as some masterpiece in the way Smile is -- it's a great record but a small one. And what I find most fascinating about it is how he's using someone else's songs as a springboard for his own vocal experiments. And I think a lot of that experimentation is still unique.

yeah that all makes sense. Nilsson def had a better, more versatile voice than any of the Boys

One of my best recent vinyl scores was a nice copy of Son of... w/the poster for only $3.

love that record so much.

Nilsson as a vocal genuis is pretty evident right from the start of his career (see his version of "You Can't Do That"). also good to note there is a difference between singing in a group (a la Beach Boys) vs singing alone. for one rehearsal is a lot more difficult to do!

his cover of many rivers to cross gets a lot of play around here

for one rehearsal is a lot more difficult to do!

I dunno, is it? Maybe this is a funny question that only musicians care about but in some ways one person with a recording device is actually easier - you only have to get it right once, then every time you hear it back it's always the same and you build the next part on top of that, then overdub another one, etc. It's sequential and iterative. Whereas with a group everyone has to learn/write/know their individual parts (have them written out in advance, or have someone like Brian Wilson sing them to you etc.) and each person has to hit it right every time or it sounds bad. So there you have to get everyone in their assigned spot and then just practice it and refine it til it's as good as it can get. They're different approaches, but I'm not sure one is inherently easier (or better) than the other.

and obviously the latter approach is tailored to performing live, the former isn't and is strictly a studio creation

NTI expressed what i was trying to say about Smile, but with much more detail and clarity. They are recordings built around elaborate orchestrations and edits rather than obsessive overdubs.

there are a ton of vocal overdubs!
but sure whatever

when rehearsing in a group you can sit around with 3-4 other guys who all know their parts and rehearse that stuff simultaneously, continuously, tape rolling or not. you can rehearse in the back of the car on the way to the studio.

as a solo performer, i guess you can rehearse with a tape of yourself and build it track by track. you don't see how this is more painstaking than working out harmonies all-at-once with a bunch of singers who have been singing together since they were teenagers? no room for on the spot adjustments of "oh, how about you go low here and i'll go high".

I've done both and they're both a pain in the ass (ok granted I don't have the blood harmony thing at my disposal, that's a pretty big differentiator)

but like I said, the solo recording only has to get each part right once. The group has to rehearse for hundreds of hours.

the solo performer has to rehearse and arrange for hundreds of hours as well. think about how much time Brian Wilson spent arranging that material. we are talking a lot of long days with no breaks. it's not like the singer 1 can go take a break and drink some honey tea while singer 2 does some overdubs. if you are a solo performer you kind of have to be on all the time. this is hard on your throat (keep in mind Nilsson did blow out his voice pushing it too hard).

imo Harry was exceptional because doing this was (seemingly) easy for him. part long hours of hard work part the natural talents of having an incredible singing voice. he can be very smooth, controlled, and on-key, but also really rock n roll, really drunk, loose, silly. his range is vast yet in a real pleasing, pop way. he has powerful command of his own voice. he's a great songwriter as well which always helps.

fwiw he doesn't have to be the sole pioneer of a style or anything, he is just fantastic, his music speaks for itself. it takes a big talent to be able to do this with your voice. i see him as in line with people like Buddy Holly or Brian Eno, the avant pop studio experimenalist. he excels at using overdubs to create a layered voice-as-instrument effect. in the spirit of something like this:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZcuojSU_hOY

I've been non stop listening to Knillssonn for the last week. Arguably one of his best albums.

yeah that all makes sense. Nilsson def had a better, more versatile voice than any of the Boys

Well, I don't know, Brian and Carl are pretty good singers! I get a strong Bobby Darin vibe off (in particular, but not exclusively) Nilsson's first album.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/lifestyle/style/pop-genius-harry-nilsson-left-an-unreleased-record-behind-now-you-can-finally-hear-the-completed-version/2019/09/24/0ae20126-dec7-11e9-b199-f638bf2c340f_story.html

wow, almost didnt recognize his voice on that sample track

UCLA sounds completely in keeping with latter day Nilsson. Title track, agree, sounds like nothing else he did. I would love to hear the demos as well.

https://i.imgur.com/Boy1C5O.png

dude was ahead of his time...

https://open.spotify.com/track/6fvIzrJ6boUDFF19fH4S2s?si=a48JN0ddSVeLd89E0LCCDQ

There are some days where I think that Pussy Cats may be his best album.

It's been reported that Zak Nilsson (Harry's son) has passed away after a long struggle with colon cancer.

I didn't know this, but when Paul McCartney heard he was starting chemo, he sent him this letter.

Confirmed on the Nilsson FB page.e

He appears w/Mom & Dad in the upper corner of the Son of... gatefold.

https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/2176/9085/products/R-682504-1350386714-1971_jpeg_1024x1024.jpg?v=1598380339

Just saw this. RIP.

Recently picked up ... That's the Way it Is as I continue very slowly filling in his post-Pussy Cats records. It's good! STE at Allmusic always gave me the sense this was the nadir of his recorded output, but it's feeling very consistent with Knnillssonn and Sandman, just wayyy more reliant on covers and therefore less compositionally or melodically surprising. If you like 50% or more of those records, you'd probably like 50% or more of this one.

That run of three albums: "Duit on Mon Dei", "Sandman" and "...That's the Way It Is", is pretty dire compared to the rest of his discography, although there's definitely good (even great) stuff on all those albums. "Knnillsson" is different beast entirely.

i hardly ever put them on individually, but there are enough good tracks across all of them to put together a pretty good album-length playlist imo

Yes, you could get one very good album out of the three, shorn of dross like "How to Write a Song" et al.

https://i.imgur.com/utaGNbW.jpg

This came on and I was like “how did I not know that Lennon covered this?”

Interesting to compare Nilsson's "Vine Street" to Van Dyke Parks' version starting off "Song Cycle"...

Or Harpers Bizarre's version.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sEkbPrsoX_c

... and Lulu's version!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=epxh3CetPo8

that Harpers Bizarre version is nice

This came on and I was like “how did I not know that Lennon covered this?”

Because he didn't? Lennon used the same string arrangement for "#9 Dream."

Nilsson's version is a cover tho ... of a Jimmy Cliff song.

Lennon freely admitted he copped it too.