Star Trek: Classic or Dud?

although it's a very inconsistent show

seasons 3-5 are probably the peak imo, but some decent episodes before and after. q who one of the best.

IIRC arguments about the best season usually revolve around the season that ends with "The Best of Both Worlds, Part 1."

Nobody thinks S2 of TNG is the best one

who you callin nobody

You really rate S2 that highly? Against 3? I'd even take the best of S4 over the whole of S2.

I think it's highs are better than any other seasons. I think quality varied really widely with this show from episode to episode, regardless of season. As the show went on I got progressively tired of it. Sometimes I'll try to rewatch random episodes (since this show is *always on* somewhere) but most of the time I find it a slog. Season 2 is the season I have fond memories of initially watching as a teen, and it's best episodes stand out to me more than other subsequent high points.

Not sure if it's come up earlier in the thread, but scripts for much of season 2 were badly affected by the 1988 WGA strike.

Agreed that TNG became a bit of a slog through later seasons. Granted the highs could be very high, but a lot of episodes were quite dull. Kooky S1-S2 over dull S7 for me.

This is fun:
http://graphtv.kevinformatics.com/tt0092455

Personally I'd say season 5 is the best. It includes two of the absolute best high-concept sci-fi episodes in all of Star Trek ("Darmok" and "The Inner Light"), several other good episodes with a neat Star Trekky concept ("I Borg", "Cause and Effect", "The Next Phase", "Conundrum"), the introduction of the best supporting character in the whole series (Ensign Ro, though sadly she didn't become a regular, this is the only season where she features prominently), episodes that play around with the genre of the show ("Disaster" is essentially a disaster movie set on the the Enterprise, "Ethics" is a medical drama, "Power Play" is Die Hard style action), and even the mythical Good Wesley Episode ("The First Duty").

Sure, season 5 has some clunkers (the worst one being "The Outcast", which was actually meant to be a story that criticizes homophobia via a sci-fi metaphor, but due to some bad choices in the execution of the script, it actually comes off as sexist and anti-gay), but so does every season of TNG. That's just a fact you got to accept with the series, with its episodic nature and rolling crew of writers: you never know whether the next ep you watch will be smart and thought-provoking, or a ham-fisted and preachy. Thankfully the main cast remains solid and reliably entertaining throughout the series, so there's always at least something to enjoy in every episode.

Thanks to this thread I've started watching the show. I saw an episode here and there when I was a boy, but I was never a superfan. I'm halfway through season two, which is supposed to suck but I'm really enjoying it! Biggest takeaway so far is that Patrick Stewart absolutely kills it in every scene. What an amazing actor. He is the fucking Captain. But Pulaski is absolutely horrible. There is no heart to the character at all, and a role like that needs heart. Haven't gotten to the Q Who ep yet, but favorite one so far is probably the one where they revive the frozen 20th century people. Lots of laughs in that one. Love how most of the crew couldn't care less that there's revived four-hundred-year-old humans onboard. Second favorite probably Contagion.

This is fun:
http://graphtv.kevinformatics.com/tt0092455

I'm surprised that the highest rated s7 episode is "Parallels", the one that started worf/troi and had riker killing another evil riker. "Lower Decks" ftw.

i like pulaski cuz i'd have a bad attitude on that ship too, and because she was in that tos episode where ancient power-hungry aliens possess the crew and spock keeps grinning impishly

Snrub is that the episode where the one guy keeps insisting on accessing his bank account and Picard is just "lol money"?

Yep!

I also liked Pulaski because she was so mean! Fuck having a heart, she was a great contrast to every other human in the series. Also, I think she's the only doctor in the whole franchise (this might've happened in TOS too, I haven't seen it in years?) who actually was gonna use the doctor's prerogative to deem the captain mentally unfit and give him mandatory sick leave. Considering all the reckless stuff Picard did throughout the series, this should've happened more often, but of course Crusher (with her special relationship to Jean-Luc) was never gonna do it. (Her lenience goes to ridiculous extremes in the future scenes of the series finale, though I guess it's kinda mitigated by the fact that they'd been married by then.)

'Time Squared' is one of my favourite TNG episodes, but it's also the least TNG-like because it's so focused on Picard and his reaction to the situation. But that's also what makes it such a great episode.

http://www.startrek.com/legacy_media/images/200506/tng-152-fento/320x240.jpg

Ray Wise cameo in season 4

eh, season 3 ep 4

we've all wanted to at some point:
http://www.slapkirk.com/play

Should also note:

Star Trek Beyond

merry fuckin Xmas btw:
https://www.flickr.com/photos/princessparkle/24022375842

I've just finished watching every season of DS9. On reflection seasons 1-4 are really good and it was just commitment that kept me going through 5-7. I nearly gave up when Odo and Kira got it together (bleugh most awkward couple ever) and when the new Dax appeared I nearly stopped watching altogether (cutesy omg I'm a simbient host was nauseating) Also what's the whole Vic Fontaine thing about? Very weird.
High five to Gul Dukat, best consistant character in every season, also Garrick, maybe it's a Cardassion thing? Shout out to the Ferenghi, they held the whole thing together.

I'm now off to tackle the entire Voyager boxset now, everyone needs a hobby right?

All of Voyager? Dear God, why would you want to do that to yourself?

I missed only one episode of Voyager in its first six seasons, I would warn off anybody trying to do the same.

it's certainly been a long road getting from there to here

there was a canadian sci-fi show called deepwater black on YTV (kids' channel) that starred ezri dax before she was ezri dax (and also starred the first host of video and arcade top 10, a canadian video game playing game show lol) and i had the hugest crush on her so when she was on DS9 i was like whaaaaaaaaaaaat. so i don't remember finding her character annoying due to my obvious bias.

deepwater black looked like a goshdarn eurodance music video

http://i.stack.imgur.com/mgtc9.jpg

I'm a completist I guess. I also don't know what I'm letting myself in for and perhaps I won't manage all of it. Only time will tell.

Voyager is an abomination, exceeded in crapulence only by Enterprise

I will always crush on Ezri!

I mean...!

Voyager, like every Star Trek series from tng on, starts out lame and becomes awesome by a couple of seasons in. You'll enjoy yourself tremendously.

*yes even Enterprise eventually finds its footing IMO

but... Space Bush

I just can't accept that Bakula's Dubya impression ever became tolerable

When was Voyager ever awesome????

It had its moments.

http://www.seeing-stars.com/Locations/Voyager/PhaserBattleOutsideObservatory2.jpg

lol

Basically once they get around to digital doctor and 7 of 9 being the center of the show, I enjoy the hell out of it.

Somewhere online an autistic adult commented how much 7 of 9 meant to them when they were younger, how much they identified with the character. Reading that was a huge aha moment for me and made me love that character.

I gave up on Voyager about four seasons in as it aired originally. Remember it having some really cool 2-parters and one-off concept episodes but the characters were so weak compared to Next Gen and DS9. Caught reruns of the later seasons much later - the show did get better, not enough to give me any regrets though

the episode that made me give up on voyager was "Threshold" from season 2, where they go to warp 10 and turn into lizards. it's the ultimate Braga episode.

wait, bakula is space dubya? i thought the other guy was space dubya!

now he is, thanks to tom cruise, apparently?
http://i.imgur.com/Z5PbgPf.png

On Halloween, I encountered a drag 7 of 9 attending a party in another section of the dim sum place we were eating dinner. It made my night.

I thought Nicole de Boer did a fine job as Ezri (and she was also awesome hamming it up as the Mirror Universe Goth Ezri), and the concept of the new host trying to come in terms with the life of the previous host, such as the marriage to Worf, did provide some interesting fodder for good sci-fi stories. The main problem was that she came in way too late... One season wasn't enough to really develop the character and her relations with Jadzia's friends, and the final hookup with Bashir was totally artificial and contrived, it felt like the writers just wanted to tie up romantic loose ends by the finale, even ones that that didn't really need tying up.

But objectively there was nothing wrong with de Boer/Ezri, I think people just hated her because she wasn't Terry Farrell/Jadzia. Which I thought was actually a good choice, because bringing in a carbon copy as a replacement character is a lazy solution TV writers often revert to, so it was much more interesting that Ezri was way different from Jadzia both mentally (nervous and self-doubting instead of cocky and relaxed) and physically (small and cute instead of tall and amazonian).

the episode that made me give up on voyager was "Threshold" from season 2, where they go to warp 10 and turn into lizards. it's the ultimate Braga episode.

I've seen this one too, and I think it's usually considered to be the very worst episode in all of Star Trek... With the clip show finale of TNG's second season as a close contender, though that one at least is just lazy instead of actively insulting. Besides Braga's utterly unscientific pet peeve subject of de-evolution, it also pointlessly breaks one of the major rules of ST universe (Warp 10 is a theoretical maximum speed and not really attainable) and ends with an inexplicable loose end: what happened to Janeaway's and Paris's lizard kids? Even though they weren't themselves when the kids were conceived, you'd think they'd have at least some interest in finding them? But apparently not.

"Treshold" is also offensively stupid because it provides the Voyager crew a way to return home that they simply won't use. Okay, going beyond Warp 10 reverts humans to lizards, but the Doctor can cure this, and the Doctor himself obviously isn't affected by this devolution. So why not just go beyond Warp 10, fly the Voyager to Alpha Quadrant, and then have the Doctor cure everyone? Or, if it's too much for one holographic doctor, have him contact Starfleet and tell them how the reverse the devolution process?

Voyager had some great episodes, but I never grew to like any of the characters. Some of the fun sci-fi concept stories were the best - future museum, evolved dinosaurs, guy messing around with timelines, planet moving in fast-forward, and one particularly polarising episode with a sinister clown AI. Love that ep.

But I think the writers could have put more effort into creating new enemies, rather than recycling the Borg to ever-diminishing returns, and could have come up with something better than those shameless Predator rip-offs. A lot of potential in the series was squandered IMO.

I'll echo what Captain Rosie said about DS9 - the recurring characters were the highlight of the show, more so than most of the main cast. The Cardassians, Klingons, Ferangi and even Kai Winn and that smug Vorta. Almost everyone seems to think the show kept getting better as it went along, but I thought seasons 3-5 were the best (much like TNG), and the I remember the last two being pretty disappointing.

Used to edit a Star Trek mag and once went to lunch w/ Nicole de Boer. Very pleasant company, main thing I remember is that she was looking out for a copy of the Dickies first album for her bf/partner/husband. I directed her to the Music and Video Exchange in Notting Hill.

How can I get your job Ward? Imagine hanging out w/Nicole De Boer @ Music and Video Exchange in Notting Hill.

Basically once they get around to digital doctor and 7 of 9 being the center of the show, I enjoy the hell out of it.

otm

What season does this happen in? Because I did try watching Voyager for the first two seasons, hoping it'd get better with time like TNG and DS9 did, but in the end the mediocrity of the plots and the uninteresting characters were too much, I didn't make it to season 3.

Almost everyone seems to think the show kept getting better as it went along, but I thought seasons 3-5 were the best (much like TNG), and the I remember the last two being pretty disappointing.

I don't think anyone really thinks the last two are as good as the middle seasons? The Dominion war arc gets a pretty good closure, but season 6 introduces the stupid supernatural Prophet/Pah-Wraith conflict, and season 7 gives it way more space than it deserves, tying the whole life of Sisko into it, culminating with the awful final battle in the caves that marrs what would otherwise have been a decent series finale. I've never come across any fans who actually like that subplot, I think most people agree this kind of "good vs. evil" fantasy plot has no place in Star Trek.