HBO adaptation of Game of Thrones - will this be just for nerds? (NO SPOILERS PLEASE)

http://www.livenation.com/artists/136195/rave-of-thrones

well he certainly puts the prose of dragonlance (not to mention wheel of time, shannara) to shame, no? GRRM is no jack vance-- he's not even my favorite active doorstop fantasy writer-- but IDG this notion that his writing is painfully bad

I prefer JiC's fake GRRM prose tbh

I haven't read the book but p much every excerpt I've seen is just head-smackingly painful, idk how people slog through 1000s of pages of that garbage

for the descriptions of boobs

agree it is both bad and above average for the genre

Hah.

you mean dragon eggs

I guess the badness kind of comes and goes in waves? idk, I'll be chugging along totally fine and then there'll be a series of passages that stop me in my tracks, then I can continue on like no big deal. Definitely better than Dragonlance, but that's just the majority of might & magic style fantasy stuff I've ever read.

GRRM's prose is totally fine and adequate, I mean he's not like "a stylist" or whatever, but I think that's probably good thing considering the vast bulk of this thing.

A lot of people here can slog through all sorts of comics, sitcoms, cartoons, films. Tough bastards.

to be fair there are not a lot of real prose stylists writing high fantasy (even vance only dabbled in that genre for 3 books)-- writers of that bent have tended more toward gray-area lit-fantasy (Wolfe, Crowley, Blaylock, etc)

I haven't read the book but p much every excerpt I've seen is just head-smackingly painful, idk how people slog through 1000s of pages of that garbage

― Οὖτις, Wednesday, July 15, 2015

hmm could it be the passages excerpted are typically the lolsiest?

no, there's all kinds of excerpts all over the net

it's just a story.

no, there's all kinds of excerpts all over the net

― Οὖτις, Wednesday, July 15, 2015 2:01 PM

seems like it would be easier/less time-consuming to read the books vs combing the net for excerpts but chacun à son goût and all that

it's not like this is some obscure piece of work, this is a cultural juggernaut that's all over the place, I don't have to go looking v hard for GoT stuff to be in my face

my opinion of him as a crap writer stands

i take it you haven't read Ready Player One

because seriously given what gets held up as "good" in genre work, GRRM is a titan.

moving goalposts here

why is fantasy writing so bad its def worse than scifi and like way worse than crime right

Pron opened the musty tome, releasing a cloud most foul. "Reminds me of a maiden I once knew," he muttered out loud. Ser Mud of the Bog people merely tilted his head in response. Pron signed. He is a fool, thought Pron, and deaf as an Earless Man. But as long as he held a sword and I am at risk, he remains my fool.

Pron sighed, setting down the book. "The maiden, she smelled terribly," Pron explained, more out of habit than in hopes of reaching the impenetrable Mud. "But not nearly as terribly as I did after a night draining seven flagons. I seem to recall waking in a barn, nestled in a pile of fresh dung. Or was it a pool of my own filth? No matter. It was nothing a warm bath could not remedy. But you wouldn't know about that, would you?" Ser Mud again offered no response. "I am speaking of course of baths, not bedding maidens." Pron paused. "Anyway, the book."

The book had not been opened in a hundred summers, at least, but Pron knew it held clues as to his own lineage. Men had fought and died for knowledge less valuable than what waited between its covers, and for once Pron felt fortunate for all those hours spent learning letters. In fact, were it not for whores and drink, reading would be his greatest love. While his brothers spent their days swinging swords and prodding at reluctant maidens, Pron spent his days and nights engrossed in books, learning of the world while worldly pleasures waited in the wings. Needless to say, he had spent much of his life making up for lost experiences, if not swordplay than most certainly prodding. Perhaps one day someone will write a book about me, thought Pron. Or several, even. Long ones. Really, really long ones. He ran a finger down the center of the page while Ser Mud picked wax out of his ear. Pron shuddered. If only this deaf fool beside me could read, he thought. When we return home I'd gift him several books of hygiene from the royal library.

As if on cue, Ser Mud swallowed whatever it was that stuck to the end of his forefinger. Pron stifled a gag and turned back to the book.

I wouldn't even read GOT cos I'm more into it as a TV show, it seems written well for TV. If I want a medieval fix I will read non-fiction/history.

Josh, which book is that from, ACOK?

ACOCK

My biggest issue with GRRM is that I really do admire his world building and huge family trees and all sorts of other little details that do eventually pay off, or at least reward attention. But at the same time, he has this distinctly by-the-word spin in place style. That may be why the shows work so well, because it really propels the pulpy plot forward, usually intelligently, jettisoning the unnecessary stuff while accenting just the right world-building details. Then again, my understanding is that things the show seems to be getting right may seem wrong to those familiar with the book, and of course, the show has had more than its fair share of unforced errors. Like, let's change this part ... (yay!) ... into THIS part! (boo!)

I finished the first season and the first couple of episodes of 2. WOW so crazy. The Queen Cersei is so amazingly evil. She's so mean to Tyrion in that one scene! Ahhh! So evil!

The King Joffrey is detestable too. They are both so great as villains, they really are. It is fun to see that the larger world of GOT is full of characters that will hopefully fuck them up. I get the feeling they are in over their heads but the Lannisters seem to have a knack for survival.

The Daenerys storyline has taken off even more than I thought it would. I was wondering if something would happen to Drogo and then just a few episodes later she is burning him and the sorceress who failed to save his life. She lost the power that he wielded but it is cool bc she is creating something of her own. With dragons.

The baby dragons scene at the end of season 1 was AWESOME. I am so psyched for the rest of the show.

http://history-behind-game-of-thrones.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/04/daenerys-dragon-birth.jpg

Loving your enthusiasms, keep posting. You're still some way off peak craziness/fuckedupness.

I have always loved pop fantasy it's easily my favorite genre. This show is some great stuff.

I do appreciate the two scheming advisers, they are very Shakespearean. The last episode I saw there was a scene with some people having sex on a chess board. Super writerly. That's the sense of humor this show has.

Cersei is very hard to read, her expression and reaction to anything comes across as perpetually dissatisfied. I get the feeling she has been doing this a long time, ruling in all but name while her husband was off hunting and whoring. She has powers but they are dependent on the whims of the murderous men around her, much like Daenerys.

Cersei makes me think of Hatshepsut (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hatshepsut). Hers is a very interesting story. Queen pharaoah of Egypt for 22 years, married to her half brother, usurped the throne from her step-son and made him her military advisor.

Blowing through season 2. It isn't as good as season 1. I could do without the entire Qarth subplot, really. I liked her Daenerys character arc last season bc she was consistently dealt the most insane and/or horrible circumstances and then powered through on the force of her own will. This season is more kind of pointless, her commanding her tribe or her hosts or anybody in sight to do things for her, them to refuse, and her to quickly sentence them to a firey death from above in the unforeseen future.'

The newer characters and the cast of all the different parties vying for kingship is interesting but the heart of the show remains the cruel and always entertaining Lannisters.

Would watch a buddy cop spin-off with Tyrion and his bodyguard.

Ssn 2 is great but more for Kings Landing stuff
I was having trouble remembering back to when Dany's story was interesting

Don't worry, Dany's story picks up MASSIVELY in s3. Then nose dives a bit, but I still think most people underrate her as a character.

OTM that s1>s2, and that the best bits of s2 revolve around the Lannisters.

The Lannisters are the best house all round really, that's pretty much a fact.

Yes definitely.

Ok the end of season 2 was nice. I guess if you are holding off on showing the dragons until the last episode again you could do worse with a scene where they are all shooting fire through Daenerys and roasting her would-be captors.

The army of the undead....woah. They really nailed the sound when the undead king screeches there. Is it the dead who die beyond the wall that come back, or all of them? Cos there are a lot of corpses showing up all around...

I guess it is good to know they can be killed by fire. Probably should be placing all bets on the fire-proof woman with fire-breathing dragons. Still, Sansa said it best when she predicted Joffrey would survive, "The worst ones always do".

Woah.... just finished S4E2. I did NOT see Joffrey dying, I thought he would be around to torment everyone for the entire series. They did give him a great send-off, it's like a greatest hits of horrible spitefulness. And Cersei grinning off to the side through the whole thing, trying to hold back the laughter. These are some of the most evil characters I have seen portrayed on screen in a long time.

I really liked how the episode was playing w fan assumptions. "Oh who would kill someone at a wedding?", that warrior guy whose kin was killed by Tywin, Shae being as LOUD AND OBNOXIOUS AS POSSIBLY while Tywinn threatens to kill the next whore seen w Tyrion. I half expected that cake to have a dead prostitute in it that he had just sliced in half.

Really hope Shae is gone for good, she was just annoying for most of her screen time by the end. Tbh she really took me out of it. It seemed like the dangerous and violent world of the Lannisters (and her dead fellow prostitutes) was entirely separate from whatever life she had w Tyrion.

Joffrey's eyes turned that pale blue color, the same color as the army of the undead. I'm hoping his body is stolen away before they can do a formal cremation and he becomes an undead Joffrey w 100x the evil of his former self.

think you might be misreading cersei's reaction to her son's grizzly death

Hah no i meant the little play before that, and the gleeful abuse of his uncle.

Tho thank God they shut down his plan on involving Robert Stark's head in the preceedings.

just wait until you get to season 5 and the army of the dead shows up led by Ned Stark riding Dany's dead dragon

Dude save that for the spoiler thread.

Finally finished season 5. Stannis burning his daughter was really painful, and it's a testament to how cruel the show is to its characters that very soon after everything went to complete shit for and he got what was coming to him. Brienne was able to finally keep her oath, but she's kind of a sad case imo, she's obviously super capable but has the extreme misfortune to often be at the wrong place at the wrong time. Either that or the person she is trying to save doesn't want to be saved at that moment. Missing the candle in the window by seconds was gtfo

Dany's story has gotten more and more interesting, I think it took a while to get into the whole leading-sure-is-hard part where she's at, and for a while she was just going from city to city conquering w this super simplistic and reductive way of going about it. Now she's out hanging w her dragon, which I kind of wonder is a first time thing for her, I'm assuming her actually flying on the dragon in the ep was for the first time.

This show keeps getting more and more grim. It is hard for me to watch any scene w Arya because it may erupt in extreme gore. A silly complaint given the show but I tend to watch out the corner of my eye when things get really brutal. Wouldn't have it any other way, all the violence, all the horrible things that are shown in this show, are all things that happened during the dark ages, not the squeaky clean medieval fantasy that I kind of grew up w in pop culture.

On that note the walk of shame was pretty crazy, and I guess something that really happened. I'm still kind of fuzzy on the whole arrangement, how the fanatics were given power that usurps the king and queen, as manipulative and calculating as Cersei is it seems like she would've foreseen that, but maybe not. Was the entire purpose of granting them power to get rid of her new inlaws? I am guessing in the next season she will just have Franken-Mountain chop all fanatics in half.

Jon Snow bleeding out in the snow, was there really any other end to this guy? Like Stannis he was fixated on the big picture and it allowed his growing enemies to sneak up behind him and stab him in the back (or the front, repeatedly). Not gonna hold out for Franken-Jon-Snow but who knows...

Dany's story has gotten more and more interesting

Haha, this really is the reverse of commonly held opinion. I still like her stuff more than most do though.

http://deadline.com/2015/08/ian-mcshane-max-von-sydow-cast-game-of-thrones-season-6-1201491099/

Not gonna hold out for Franken-Jon-Snow but who knows...

yeah, don't think you can run for Veep if not from Earth

Well I really liked her first season arc but once she became a ruler sitting on her throne for most of it, it was kind of dull. Post-Joffrey and post-Tywin the Lannisters are really floundering in King's Landing. Doing what they do best, killing and disgracing other people not named Lannister, but those tactics are starting to wear thin. Now that the small council is gone (and more or less under Dany's wing now) I think it's a less interesting story than it used to be w those two characters. Not that Jonathan Pryce didn't bring a heck of a lot of great acting to that storyline, but w Dany's story you get the feeling she is at least evolving and learning from her mistakes. Stannis, Jon Snow, even Cersei are all victims of their own obsessions while Dany doesn't exactly know what she wants. Plus she has survived 5 seasons relatively unscathed, so she's really in the best position right now than all of them.

I thought Dany's story was looking up when Tyrion showed up. Would have liked to see the two them plotting world domination, but then Dany gets whisked away to hang out with barbarians again. Seems like stalling, but maybe she'll find a magic amulet or something that will be super important.

can't wait for danys to storm kings landing with her dragons and army of dothraki and eunuchs and jorah "clobberin time" mormon and tyrion.

Basically where Tyrion goes I go.

Jorah Mormont more like Borah Moron aren't I correct?

was wondering how Lovejoy hadn't been in this yet