Jimmy Webb's Immortal "Wichita Lineman"

it is, isn't it? he didn't write it but i'm reasonably sure his was the first recording.

I just realized that Bobby Lyle's "Magic Carpet Ride", a rare-groove r&B song from the 70's, totally cops that part.

You must hear it if you are a fan of Johnny Cash or of the song. I'm just sayin.

Bullshit. Anyway, since you're so concerned with how many *different* words are in the song, how many *different* words do you think Dylan used? Probably not 3 and a half billion. "It Takes a Lot To Laugh, It Takes a Train to Cry" (despite the long title) is approximately as laconic as this song and is at least as effective, as far as I'm concerned.

Campbell's version was pretty ubiquitous on even top 40 radio circa 1979.

To be honest, this line kind of bugs me. If he "needs" her more than "wants" her, then why in the very next line does he say "and I want you for all time" - there's the "want" again - didn't he just say he "needs" her more than "wants" her? - so why doesn't he say he "needs" her for all time? Because it would sound weird, I guess. How could you "need" someone for all time? But still, it's clumsy.

and you're seriously saying that a song needs to be specific to be good? because that would leave a lot of dylan, esp. 'visions of johanna,' right out on the doorstep.

i never said this was THE greatest song of all time. but it must be considered. 'visions' is good but not on the same level methinks.

xpost

I like "Galveston" almost as much. Campbell's vocal on "WL" is very subtle, actually, listen to the inflection on the word "still." That's great singing, it sounds so simple but it's not.

Many people complain about the Al De Lory strings on this song and others. I think "WL" just about defines good countrypolitan music, myself, it's incredibly listenable, smooth yet it's real. Glen's country--the way he says "want" as "wont." I have no trouble with anyone who says this is one the finest songs of all time, none at all.

I'm not, Amateur(ist) — it's crap. And believe me: I wanted to like that record more than you can possibly imagine. Or maybe you can.

are you supposed to revere something in an irreverent tone?

i do have a distaste for hyperbole. it's nice to read something like o. nate's post, then. since this board is so full of hyperbole.

hmmm...this is interesting, because webb has a problem with writing really abstract love lyrics with overly fussy metaphors. in fact i would even say that some of his lyrics verge on the sort of mushy pop-psychological stuff that really turns me off. (as in the "reunion" record which i can't dismiss so easily.)

i think it's this song's specificity, its occasional rendering of concrete detail, that lifts it above a lot of other webb compositions.

Yes.

OK, fine, but something typed in haste on a message board should necessarily be held to the same level of literary standards as a song, especially if it's claimed to be the greatest of all time.

Maybe the line means what people are saying it means: I x more than y, and I y a lot. But if so, this doesn't strike me as a particularly clever or poetic construction - it's almost childish, really. For a more grown-up, complex, and sexy take on the whole "need vs. want" thing, see Smokey Robinson's "You Really Got a Hold On Me".

That was a favorite theme of Motown and vintage R&B. See also Marvin Gaye's "Ain't that Peculiar" ("you do me wrong but still I'm crazy bout you"), Martha and the Vandellas' "Nowhere to Run" ("I know you're no good for me, but you've become a part of me").

As far as "need vs. want" - "You Really Got a Hold On Me" is a great song, especially in the Beatles version, but its razor's edge approach/avoid take on love is actually easier to pull off successfully than the infinite corridor of want that is evoked in "Wichita Lineman."

xpost

That is, I'm lonely and cold and I'm holding on alone here, doing all the work, but I'm still at it--because I need and want you so much, I have no choice but to keep working at the relationship.

i like this about the song.

That said, I agree with Kenny L that your arguments are good and your perspective is perfectly fine. I enjoy not-agreeing just as much as agreeing, provided that no one is an asshole about it.

I'm old enough to remember when the song was first out, I was a Glen Campbell fan as a tyke. I never understood what it was about at all for years, but I got it, he was lonely, driving the main road and searching in the sun for another overload, which is such a brilliant line.

Webb's songs are strange--I remember also being puzzled by this Fifth Dimension tune of his, "Carpet Man," I guess the guy was getting walked on or was walking on a woman, so to speak? It's really weird and if I hear it right there's a line "and then the coroner will have a dance on you."

It absolutely is. Webb was also going through a hideous and prolonged breakup around that time, which almost certainly contributed to the tone of the song, if not the metaphor itself.

http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=1668844

turns out, he's quite dissatisfied with that "need you more than want you" chorus for a pretty funny reason (they start discussing it around the 7:00 minute mark if you want to skip ahead)

I guess this goes back to the essential ambiguity of the lyrics that I wrote about upthread. We don't really know what his relationship is to the person he's singing to. So you can read it this way if you want to - but for me to read it that way, I think I'd feel like I was basically rewriting the song in my own mind to conform to what I think the most engaging scenario would be. I like to be given a bit more to go on, I think.

Anyway, a related thought that occurred to me is that maybe this is one of those songs that is going to become a victim of the march of progress. I mean as we all live in an increasingly wireless and omni-connected cyber-verse - the thought of some guy being out there tending to these wires and not being able to connect himself may become an increasingly archaic metaphor. Future generations may not be able to understand why he doesn't just pick up his cell-phone and call her.

inasmuch as current generations can understand why paul revere had to ride a horse, i'm pretty sure future generations will be able to figure out what a telephone wire was.