BIRDMAN MOTHERFUCKAS (2014 film feat. Michael Keaton, Edward Norton, Emma Stone, et al)

i thought the chunks of the play we do see were deliberately clunky and stagy. at the end of the dream sequence, for instance, laura has a line about memory ("there's a distance to it all now, a wistful distance underscored by a gentle breeze") that struck me as a "BAD PLAY" notice in 10-foot neon letters. ymmv.

spoke tonight with a friend who defends the film by saying that every character and interaction is supposed to seem comically cliched, bad in the manner of riggan's play. i'm not sure what i think about this suggestion. it's certainly true in what it observes, but i'm not sure how intentional the film's banality is, or whether there's sufficient animating wit behind the accumulation of dull stereotypes.

Something it captures (speaking as someone who's directed a zillion plays) is that every performance is different, so instead of it being a good or bad play, it shows how whatever's happening is in the present and won't be duplicated. And so Keaton entering the play's final scene from the audience works on that night because he commits to the choice; other nights work when Norton or Keaton's characters fully commit to the choices they're making as actors in the show. It's such a huge difference between stage acting and film acting: in a finished film, there is one performance shown and open to judgement. In a play, it's a series of performances, each one different and, at best, suited for that particular evening.

i'm not sure how intentional the film's banality is, or whether there's sufficient animating wit behind the accumulation of dull stereotypes.

Yeah, that's sort of my prob with it, if it's even really a problem.

All the weird stuff, those were previews, right? But opening night, when people come out at intermission, they all seem to love it! Unless that is a delusion, but I don't think it is in that context.

Per the play dialog we hear, I haven't read Carver in a long time, but before we dismiss is as hacky or stupid or trite for the sake of the movie, are we sure it is not taken verbatim from Carver?

every character and interaction is supposed to seem comically cliched, bad in the manner of riggan's play.

felt this was v obv tbh

shrug. not always the 'stutest of waterfowls over here.

not sure that intentionality helps much (though maybe it makes riggan a better playwright, relative to the reality he inhabits). the problem for me wasn't so much the accumulation of sterotypes and cliches, but the accumulation of dull stereotypes and cliches. it undercut both the drama and the comedy. imo.

hey stuffs often obv to me and 100
% wrong

Per the play dialog we hear, I haven't read Carver in a long time, but before we dismiss is as hacky or stupid or trite for the sake of the movie, are we sure it is not taken verbatim from Carver?

a lot of it is. but what works on the page, etc...

felt this was v obv tbh

Yesss.

but before we dismiss is as hacky or stupid or trite for the sake of the movie, are we sure it is not taken verbatim from Carver?

I assumed it was more the way it was layered, compressed into melodrama. The ending we see so many times is certainly hokey and trite. And it's possible to use even good words badly. Thinking of Branagh's Hamlet here.

But opening night, when people come out at intermission, they all seem to love it!

I think the film is cynical enough to suggest the audience is not necessarily the best judge. I've for sure sat in audiences (even on Broadway!) that didn't seem to know good from bad.

http://www.avclub.com/article/original-birdman-ending-would-have-featured-johnny-214998

2nd rate all that jazz

similar style/tone sure but had different aims

plus no sandahl bergman

and ATJ isn't that great eitiher

Dumb question, maybe addressed: was this movie written for Keaton, or with him specifically in mind?

Because an older, generally off-the-grid former caped crusader superhero franchise anchor is a pretty specific role, and I don't see how it could have worked without the meta layer of the star actually being Keaton. Specifically.

think I read that it was

If this thing had actually ended with Depp the whole movie would have been much improved, and I say this as someone who is underwhelmed by Depp generally now

This needed to be a little more effusive about the immense courage and inner beauty of movie stars.

Christ on a cracker

it took 4 writers to simulate the howling self-absorption of Paddy Chayefsky gone New Age.

Innaritu was married to four writers of shrill, shrieking fraud.

bar scene w/ drama critic was worthy of Jerry Lewis at his worst

did you just watch it?

He's there right now

yeah i was too busy catching up with good movies til now

I've condensed the watchable moments in this movie to Emma Stone on the roof and Edward Norton's first scene.

"2nd rate all that jazz"

That is a pretty good film to be second rate to....

Depp ending sounds far better. Or just ending this movie pre-hospital which is how I basically imagine it ending. Critic scene is probably worst (well except maybe the pointless lesbian kiss) in the entire movie.

didnt see point of Norton-Stone angle except hey, vicarious middle-aged male audience wank

Is it cold atop yr high horse

i feel like Keaton in his BVDs (when he's with yr mom)

My mom's more of a Scotty McCreery woman

@pareene
The worst things about BordMang are the direction and script and the best thing was the acting so good work Academy

and ATJ isn't that great eitiher

It increasingly occurs to me that All About Eve is the exception to your taste levels, not the rule.

found this unwatchable, insufferable. didnt make it to the end

It increasingly occurs to me that All About Eve is the exception to your taste levels, not the rule.

― Eric H.,

I've seen our respective top ten lists. Race to the bottom (or top).

Enough Said

up there with Crash in the Best Film winners this one

How quickly we all forgot The King's Speech.

No, I mean literally, how quickly we all forgot it.

Crash is by several measures worse than Birdman, The King's Speech a somnolent eighties prestige film throwback (remember when those were supposed to make a comeback?).

Big Thinkpiece #2:

As for the big winner: Voters were obviously mad about Birdman, and everyone who was rooting for something else is … you know, mad about Birdman. It is possible to admire the exquisite craft and technical facility with which the movie was made, to be amused and charmed by its droll, darkly comic take on narcissism, artistic aspiration, and the fight of a creative individual to make a mark, and still feel a slight twinge of … This again? Another movie about showbiz and its lovable nutcases? There are stretches in which the Oscars seem to go into hibernation; think of the 1980s, when Chariots of Fire and Gandhi and Amadeus and Out of Africa and The Last Emperor won and it was hard to discern how much curiosity, or much of anything other than a desire to retreat from the world and the country into a kind of pictorial/historical splendor, the Academy had. In retrospect, I think those movies won not because Academy voters didn’t care about what was going on in America, but because they didn’t know what was going on with American movies. The 1980s — post–Raging Bull, pre–indie boom that began with 1989’s Sex, Lies, and Videotape — were a decade of uncertainty and trepidation about what American films were supposed to be, other than blockbusters.

http://grantland.com/hollywood-prospectus/decoding-the-2015-oscars-the-birdman-win-and-what-it-tells-us-about-hollywood/

birdman was great btw anyone who hasn't seen it should watch it instead of reading this outraged tantrum of a thread

totally mcscrotally

i'm sure to love it when i rescreen from my newly enlightened perspective

there's hope for everyone yet thats shat I learnt from watching best picture tm birdman motherfuckers

uh what

Harris, as always and forever, OTM.

His theory about eighties film (borrowing bits from A.O. Scott) makes sense, but nineties commercial filmmaking was just as confused. Look at that decade's BP winners.

If the Academy's definition of "prestige" has drifted away from Out of Africa and Gandhi, it really doesn't matter at all what they've drifted toward IMO.

https://vine.co/v/OQwTawxZhI0

:-(

it could've been a flask

birdman was great btw anyone who hasn't seen it should watch it instead of reading this outraged tantrum of a thread

otm