Is this anti-semitism?

that may not be exact right 90s subcultural ref fwiw

xp i know it has been discussed. i learned about it mostly from mark s's "noise piece" back in the day!

not wholly unfair conflation of noise rock fandom w/ an infamously shitty "angry white man" zine of the early 90s. there's a brief noize board thread about it's asshole publisher, jim goad, but it's not terribly informative.

Currently, Goad writes a weekly column for Taki's Magazine and is a writer/producer for Thought Catalog. Goad has also contributed to Vice,[9] New York Press,[18] the San Francisco Bay Guardian[18] and Hustler.[11] In 2013 Jim wrote a foreword to a compilation of issues of the 1990s zine Gun Fag Manifesto. He thanked the editor, Hollister Kopp, in his book The Redneck Manifesto.

oh man, his name is really "goad," isn't it?

lol

and thanks for the clarification

"Answer Me!" was just a lot of "I am going to offend you with my aggro transgressiveness!" nonsense. You might find some of their takedowns funny for about 5 minutes before realizing that they were just being bullying assholes - definitely a precursor to internet trolldom

urban dictionary says sonic youth were the most "well known purveyors of this type of rock music"

― F♯ A♯ (∞), Thursday, February 5, 2015 3:39 PM (4 minutes ago)

"pigfuck" is a garbage term no one should use

is steve albini involved in any of this? because i am getting albini vibes.

big black often get lumped in with the pigfuckers, though i dunno that christgau specifically namechecked them when he was throwing the term around. nor do i know whether albini ever contributed anything to answer me! or otherwise commented on the goads. will say that his enthusiasm certainly seemed to fit the basic template: would-be-transgressive spite + (noise+punk+rock) + anticorporate politics + fascination with "lower class" squalor.

haha. steve ruined gybe's production quality imo

xp is a fascination with "lower class" squalor a bad thing?

no, not necessarily. all the angryface redneck-chic filth & depravity wallowing came to seem a bit silly somewhere around the mid 90s tho.

Well, urban dictionary is wrong, but there was a time in the early nineties when some people would consume anything "alternative" or extreme - uncritically. I think some youngsters were later embarrassed by this.

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/02/08/sunday-review/surviving-the-nazis-only-to-be-jailed-by-america.html?action=click&contentCollection=U.S.&module=MostEmailed&version=Full®ion=Marginalia&src=me&pgtype=article

Other evidence emerged revealing not only Patton’s disdain for the Jews in the camps, but an odd admiration for the Nazi prisoners of war under his watch.

Under Patton, Nazis prisoners were not only bunked at times with Jewish survivors, but were even allowed to hold positions of authority, despite orders from Eisenhower to “de-Nazify” the camps.

curmudgeon, are u familiar w/ this somewhat related controversy? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Auschwitz_bombing_debate

Sorta familiar with that.

heidegger's take on the shoah:
http://www.corriere.it/english/15_febbraio_09/heidegger-jews-self-destructed-47cd3930-b03b-11e4-8615-d0fd07eabd28.shtml

http://www.businessinsider.com/anti-defamation-league-calls-on-urban-outfitters-to-stop-selling-holocaust-garb-2015-2

http://tabletmag.com/scroll/188961/israel-boycott-activists-call-for-jews-to-be-expelled-from-south-african-university

can't believe anyone thinks BDS might be antisemitic

disturbing

Man, Heidegger was messed up.

the irony of an SA divestment movement is too much for me

possibly some relevant context for the attack tnite:
http://tabletmag.com/jewish-news-and-politics/128077/hiding-judaism-in-copenhagen

Bibi says Jews in the Diaspora aren't really "home," chief rabbi of Copenhagen fires back.
http://www.irishtimes.com/news/world/europe/chief-rabbi-in-denmark-disappointed-with-netanyahu-comments-1.2104738

i wonder what the chief rabbi of copenhagen says at the end of his pesach seder

Probably the same thing I say, but I don't mean it literally, even as I bang on the table singing it, any more than I want Hashem to pour out his wrath on the nations that know him not.

pouring out the wrath is my fave part tbh lol

for me it's a close second to the stuff with the plagues and the fingers

Reading from the parsha to my kids is pretty interesting, actually, you forget (well, YOU probably don't, but a modern liberal American jew does) how much there is in Shemot about destroying all enemy tribes and how they will flee in weakness and terror before the advance of the Jews, and this is a bit hard to explain to children, if they are being raised in the liberal American Jewish tradition.

what do you use to read the parsha to yr kids? are you just using a translation (JPS or something?) or one of those collections specifically made for children like the little midrash?

JPS translation, supplemented by a kids summary, don't remember the name of that one

I'm all about the diaspora, up the diaspora.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AltyhmrIFgo

no idea about the legitimacy of this, though I've walked through ritzy parts of Paris with an American friend who was wearing full Hasidic dress, and experienced him getting hassled for it.

haha above video def not the ritzy parts of paris

yeah thats what I'm saying

Fucking hell how I hate Netanyahu. I've disliked him vehemently but abstractly for a while, the same way I dislike a bunch of politicians I disagree with, but his bullshit in this case is so fucking disgusting. To go back to the link mordy just posted, the problem in Denmark is to a large extent with people incapable of — or uninterested in — differentiating among the Israeli government, European Zionists, and Danish Jews. Those who confronted Krasnik, he believes, saw him as “symbol of Israel, and to be Israeli and Jewish is just the same.” [..] To differentiate between an ordinary Muslim and a knuckle-dragging Islamist is a distinction frequently underscored in Europe, but such nuance is rarely afforded to Jews. That job isn't really made easier when the prime minister of Israel goes out and says that Danish Jews don't belong, that their true home is Israel. A friend of mine tweeted this response from Lawrence Freedman, which I think is great: Would be grateful if Netanyahu could stop encouraging Islamists to believe that their violence can force Jews to leave Europe.

I have Danish Jewish friends, people who have lived here for generations, and they are obviously hurting. And it doesn't help, in the slightest, to be told that they don't really belong here. And quite honestly, it doesn't really improve their security in the face of fanatic anti-Israel muslim youth, more than willing to blame Danish Jews for Israel's policies. Fuck that guy.

tbf to bibi, for the most part europe is not the home for jews

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/B97JV3UCUAAUtcT.jpg

like this is just talking about reality ^

on the other hand, the danish ppl were exceptionally protective of their jews during ww2 so i could see that as an exception to the general rule. personally speaking tho, and i've said this before on ilx, i would never live in europe, and i don't understand the [much diminished] jewish communities esp in places like hungary, poland, etc.

the truth is that nothing bibi says is going to sway european jewry (at least on a collective level). if europe wants to keep their jews, they will do so by making them feel safe. if they don't feel safe, they will leave, w/ or w/out bibi in office. it doesn't make a lot of sense to get angry at bibi bc jews in europe don't feel safe. that's just more conflation bullshit.

my wife asked me if there was an attack in our neighborhood on one of the synagogues here would we think about moving. i said i thought probably not - but more bc it would be an aberration, we don’t feel threatened every day, i wear a yarmulke on the street etc. but if an attack happened already in the context of feeling threatened and hiding being jewish etc? there was a synagogue attack in chicago some years back but the jewish population didn't emigrate en masse. it's the attack on top of the every day abuses + fear that makes it into a catalyzing moment.

i'm a little concerned that some ppl's response to an antisemitic attack in denmark is to get really angry at bibi. l'havdil but imagine an attack on a black church and al sharpton making a [maybe even inappropriate/self-serving] comment about it. what would you think about the guy who mostly gets angry at sharpton? at the very least it's a misplacement of priority.

people have good reason to get angry at him for using events like this to advance his own political agenda

'oh thanks for reminding us that israel exists, he was just reminding us that israel exists that's all'

looking at long-term risks there is probably no place where you are more likely to be killed for being jewish than israel

Ok fine he's a jerk but is he really the villain of this event? I expect to hear that ppl fucking hate Islamist terrorists, not the PM of Israel.

nobody here doesn't hate islamist terrorists

let me state my objection differently. i've read enough ppl on the internet who claim that this (and the kosher mart attack) were mossad false flags to convince jews to move to israel, or in its more polite wink-wink version say something like 'well, these certainly work to israel's benefit, right?' that i don't want anything to do w/ the argument that somehow bibi is to blame for islamist terrorists confusing diaspora jews w/ israeli jews. (<< btw this last part is particularly odious, as if attacks on jews in synagogues would be okay if it happened in israel. just this entire discourse is so sick and fucked it's not a surprise it's thriving so much in europe.)

as if this were just an innocent mistake. oh they didn't realize all jews weren't israelis but bibi convinced them otherwise. the poor dears, being misled by the tricky jew. like maybe this has nothing to do w/ bibi, or even israel, but rather w/ intense incitement and antisemitism that would persist whether or not there were settlers living in gush etzion.

"it doesn't make a lot of sense to get angry at bibi bc jews in europe don't feel safe. that's just more conflation bullshit."

Yeah, notice I didn't say this at all.

Also, fuck you, mordy. Quite honestly. This happened right where I live, don't imply that it's in any way our fault for not making Jews 'feel safe'. We're doing what we can in a quite honestly pretty chaotic and difficult situation, with thousands and thousands of refugees entering the country, fleeing the chaos in Syria, mostly.

Also, nobody knows if he was islamist yet. I know, it's crazy to hear, but the guy spent the last two years in jail, where he was for unprovokingly stabbing another guy in the leg. He was a psycho. And I fucking hate that guy, of course.

sure let's hold our judgement on whether he was an islamist. in the meanwhile tho, "Omar el-Hussein, suspected in twin Copenhagen attacks, loved to discuss Islam and Israeli-Palestinian conflict, newspaper reports."

well huh:
http://www.channel3000.com/news/police-respond-to-rash-of-derogatory-graffiti-complaints/31272850

i wonder what the chief rabbi of copenhagen says at the end of his pesach seder

― Mordy, Monday, February 16, 2015 8:50 AM (4 hours ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

this is why judaism is as bankrupt as any other world religion

i mean, sure call him out on it, i'm pretty sure bibi is made of more shit than the chief rabbi of copenhagen, but it's all BS.