Lester Bangs - Classic or Carburetor Dung?

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julio should go play with mark and his v.big bag of dicks and leave vm circa aw alone or i will cry and then hurt you all

― J (Jay), Thursday, 31 July 2003 19:33 (twenty years ago) link

crackle! pop!!!

― Julio Desouza (jdesouza), Thursday, 31 July 2003 19:40 (twenty years ago) link

i thought we established that "eat a bag of dicks" was a reward not a punishment?

― mark s (mark s), Thursday, 31 July 2003 19:57 (twenty years ago) link

Mark S? Sutherland?

― David. (Cozen), Thursday, 31 July 2003 19:58 (twenty years ago) link

we did? i must have missed that.

― J (Jay), Thursday, 31 July 2003 20:04 (twenty years ago) link

I've read that quote carefully several times and it doesn't make me want to hear Astral Weeks or read more of Lester Bangs.
Put crassly, some old guy liked some other old guy's music. So?
What's it to me?

-- mei (meirion.lewi...), July 31st, 2003.

Then why give a shit about anything?

― David Allen, Friday, 1 August 2003 01:28 (twenty years ago) link

stupid pointless story: a friend of mine was being bugged by this crazy pseudo-stalker chick last year, and he asked me to do something weird to annoy her. so i IMed her the entirety of lester bangs's "astral weeks" review, with no explanation.

― Justyn Dillingham (Justyn Dillingham), Friday, 1 August 2003 04:21 (twenty years ago) link

unfortunately she turned out to be a VM fan so it didn't work as well as i'd planned. i followed up with long excerpts from "concrete, so as to self-destruct," and that worked a lot better.

― Justyn Dillingham (Justyn Dillingham), Friday, 1 August 2003 04:22 (twenty years ago) link

Because he has such an ENGAGING style of writing....Because it's impossible to not relate to him on some level, and want to love it just as much as he does, even if you've never heard it.

-- David Allen (en@senbm), July 30th, 2003.

Many reasons to give a damn, but LB doesn't convince me to.

― mei (mei), Friday, 1 August 2003 06:33 (twenty years ago) link

er there is more to that piece than just the first paragraph yknow.

― Justyn Dillingham (Justyn Dillingham), Friday, 1 August 2003 06:51 (twenty years ago) link

No, I didn't know.

― mei (mei), Friday, 1 August 2003 06:52 (twenty years ago) link

time to go pick up a book then innit?

― Justyn Dillingham (Justyn Dillingham), Friday, 1 August 2003 06:57 (twenty years ago) link

or: http://www.harbour.sfu.ca/~hayward/van/reviews/astral.html

― Justyn Dillingham (Justyn Dillingham), Friday, 1 August 2003 06:58 (twenty years ago) link

I like bang's aw piece, but only cuz I know and like his other stuff alot more - it's good to see him get gushy, astral weeks is like his hailey mathers. I like the father (meltzer) and the holy ghost (tosches) alot more than lb, but I still love lb plenty, enough that it pisses me off that jim derogatis his the officially sanctioned keeper of the flame now; bangs cronies should spend alot more time bitching about let it blurt (particularly since it's gonna be the lester bangs bio) than continuing to harp on about griel marcus' agenda pushing in psychotic reactions....

― nnnh oh oh nnnh nnnh oh (James Blount), Friday, 1 August 2003 07:01 (twenty years ago) link

yeah, it's not really his best, but it's the one that first made me realize how good a writer he was. my favorite's probably "i saw god and/or tangerine dream."

greil marcus's agenda pushing amounted to including two pieces on elvis and nothing on black sabbath. that and calling bangs "the best writer in america." gee, what a rotten guy. let it blurt, meanwhile, includes about a million "wow, what a slob lester was" anecdotes and next to nothing about his actual writing. conclusion: jim derogatis is a twat.

― Justyn Dillingham (Justyn Dillingham), Friday, 1 August 2003 07:16 (twenty years ago) link

to be fair, lester bangs' elvis obit is probably pretty easily his most quoted piece (I remember seeing jane pauley quote it on something about elvis)

― nnnh oh oh nnnh nnnh oh (James Blount), Friday, 1 August 2003 07:26 (twenty years ago) link

and I think it's the inclusion of 'the white noise supremacists' that really rankles the ranks

― nnnh oh oh nnnh nnnh oh (James Blount), Friday, 1 August 2003 07:27 (twenty years ago) link

haha justyn i kill you with gun

― mark s (mark s), Friday, 1 August 2003 07:42 (twenty years ago) link

well I agree with justyn. what's the 'agenda' here? Lester was a good writer (loads of US ILXORS may not agree bcz of the copyists but that's not my problem).

I still kill him with gun tho'.

― Julio Desouza (jdesouza), Friday, 1 August 2003 09:02 (twenty years ago) link

time to go pick up a book then innit?

I'm not going to read more just to check I'm as uninterested in it as I am in what I've already read.

I _am_ intrigued as to why he's so revered though.

― mei (mei), Friday, 1 August 2003 10:58 (twenty years ago) link

I'm not going to read more just to check I'm as uninterested in it as I am in what I've already read.

I _am_ intrigued as to why he's so revered though.

Gee, so I guess you just want someone to explain it to you? If you're not interested enough to try and find out for yourself . . .

― J (Jay), Friday, 1 August 2003 11:05 (twenty years ago) link

You're right in a way, I've read enough of him to know he's not for me, but I still don't know why he's so well liked.

I don't want someone to explian LB to me, but rather why they like him. In fact there are a few good answers like that above, so I think my question's answered.

While we're on the subject can someone explain the appeal of REM or U2?

― mei (mei), Friday, 1 August 2003 11:10 (twenty years ago) link

three years pass...

Interesting mechanism at work whereby the Count Five were, in part, great precisely because of their inconsequentiality and yet:

"Paul McCartney makes lovely boutique tapes, resolute upon being as inconsequential as the Carpenters...You could hardly call him burnt out--Band on the Run was, in its rather vapid way, a masterful album. Muzak's finest hour. Of course he is about as committed to the notion of subject matter as Hanna-Barbera."

― Tim Ellison, Tuesday, 17 April 2007 17:05 (seventeen years ago) link

Lester Bangs was an overrated drug-addled Mark Prindle-wannabe. He wrote maybe three good articles.

― Mr. Snrub, Tuesday, 17 April 2007 17:20 (seventeen years ago) link

BUT WHAT ARTICLES THEY WERE

― Edward III, Tuesday, 17 April 2007 17:54 (seventeen years ago) link

and I think it's the inclusion of 'the white noise supremacists' that really rankles the ranks

-- nnnh oh oh nnnh nnnh oh (James Blount), Friday, 1 August 2003 07:27

Why did it rankle?

― BIG HOOS aka the steendriver, Tuesday, 17 April 2007 17:56 (seventeen years ago) link

all blount's saying is that that article is what people have in mind when they accuse marcus of editing the bangs' collection with an agenda in mind.

― Edward III, Tuesday, 17 April 2007 18:05 (seventeen years ago) link

i.e. if you expected the book to be a representative sample you might come away thinking he engaged politics overtly more often than he did?

― BIG HOOS aka the steendriver, Tuesday, 17 April 2007 18:07 (seventeen years ago) link

or that marcus is more interested in politics, even politics as banal as those in the white noise supremacist piece, than music?

― Tim Ellison, Tuesday, 17 April 2007 18:11 (seventeen years ago) link

sorta, probably closer is that the book is more reflective of marcus' interests than bangs'.

or what tim said.

― Edward III, Tuesday, 17 April 2007 18:13 (seventeen years ago) link

it's not the same anthology of lester's writings that richard meltzer would have put together, let's say that.

― Tim Ellison, Tuesday, 17 April 2007 18:15 (seventeen years ago) link

not that meltzer's book would have been better! in fact, given a whore like the rest, there's perhaps reason to think it might have been worse.

― Tim Ellison, Tuesday, 17 April 2007 18:19 (seventeen years ago) link

With time I've realized I actually like Mainlines, Blood Feasts & Bad Taste better.

― BIG HOOS aka the steendriver, Tuesday, 17 April 2007 18:20 (seventeen years ago) link

"Paul McCartney makes lovely boutique tapes, resolute upon being as inconsequential as the Carpenters...You could hardly call him burnt out--Band on the Run was, in its rather vapid way, a masterful album. Muzak's finest hour. Of course he is about as committed to the notion of subject matter as Hanna-Barbera."

I don't think this is a pan.

― Alfred, Lord Sotosyn, Tuesday, 17 April 2007 18:22 (seventeen years ago) link

How can you tell?

― BIG HOOS aka the steendriver, Tuesday, 17 April 2007 18:23 (seventeen years ago) link

If I'm interpreting that piece right, Bangs does put McCartney on top of his list of the four Beatles in terms of descending credibility - meaning, I think, that he was the least offender at the time ('73-ish).

Whether it's an official pan or not, he makes particular criticisms. (Another is "If he was a little more gutsy, he might almost be Elton John." Lester must have written off Ram too easily.)

― Tim Ellison, Tuesday, 17 April 2007 18:31 (seventeen years ago) link

(Because you can't hear "Monkberry Moon Delight" and say that, I don't think.)

― Tim Ellison, Tuesday, 17 April 2007 18:32 (seventeen years ago) link

Or jeez, how about the vocal on "Let Me Roll It," which was on the then-current album?

― Tim Ellison, Tuesday, 17 April 2007 18:36 (seventeen years ago) link

lester bangs is great if only for getting me interested in the stooges, the godz, velvets, tangerine dream and van morrison at the same time when i was 15.

― ian, Tuesday, 17 April 2007 18:40 (seventeen years ago) link

"if only?"

― Tim Ellison, Tuesday, 17 April 2007 18:41 (seventeen years ago) link

How can you tell?

You can't! The ambiguity's the most interesting element.

― Alfred, Lord Sotosyn, Tuesday, 17 April 2007 18:45 (seventeen years ago) link

Right, I was being jokey.

― BIG HOOS aka the steendriver, Tuesday, 17 April 2007 18:50 (seventeen years ago) link

lester bangs is great if only for getting me interested in the stooges, the godz, velvets, tangerine dream and van morrison at the same time when i was 15.

-- ian, Tuesday, 17 April 2007 18:40

Me too! plus Black Oak Arkansas and Sir Lord Baltimore

― Stormy Davis, Tuesday, 17 April 2007 18:54 (seventeen years ago) link

shouldn't you guys be thanking GREIL MARCUS

― Edward III, Tuesday, 17 April 2007 19:04 (seventeen years ago) link

http://www.galaade.com/img/auteur/liste/greil-marcus-174x112-NB.jpg

"You're Welcome!"

― C. Grisso/McCain, Tuesday, 17 April 2007 19:09 (seventeen years ago) link

http://fumettidicarta.interfree.it/Farenheit451/LESTER_BANGS/bangsles.jpg

"Whadda 'bout me? I WROTE the stuff!"

― C. Grisso/McCain, Tuesday, 17 April 2007 19:13 (seventeen years ago) link

He got too depressingly moralistic and fogeyish in his Village Voice daze (too much booze, not enough speed), but EVERY article/review/profile/whatever he wrote for Creem had at least memorable (or unforgettable) turn of phrase or cracked simile or (yes) dope-addled pronouncement, or even the occasional bit of insight for those who value that sort of thing. Plus he was damned funny (always a good thing in my view), even if not as consistently hilarious as Meltzer or (especially) Rick Johnson. Basically I just plain liked how the guy's prose looked on the page, more than I can say for his hero Jack Kerouac. And finally, it was Bangs who (from beyond the grave!) turned me onto the Stooges/Velvets/Beefheart, not to mention Mingus and the rest of those cats, for which I thank him. Doesn't matter that he'd certainly hate 40% of the music on my personal shelves and hard drive, or how immature and self-destructive an asshole he probably was. I never let such trivialities concern me.

― Myonga Vön Bontee, Tuesday, 17 April 2007 19:14 (seventeen years ago) link

http://www.galaade.com/img/auteur/liste/greil-marcus-174x112-NB.jpg

"Quiet you!"

(x-post)

― C. Grisso/McCain, Tuesday, 17 April 2007 19:14 (seventeen years ago) link

racism's "banal," huh?

― Matos W.K., Tuesday, 17 April 2007 19:21 (seventeen years ago) link

uh oh

― Edward III, Tuesday, 17 April 2007 19:23 (seventeen years ago) link

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