Is this anti-semitism?

I think hatred in and of itself is the basis of all this. I just can't think of many other groups who have been the targets of such specific and prolific propaganda for centuries.

Like, throughout Europe, Russia, America, China, Africa, anti-Semitism looks largely the same, based on the same lies and prejudices. Lots of horrible hatred is regional, or between two groups. Anti-Semitism always seems bigger than that.

Josh I don't think that's actually true. You might superficially find some of the same stereotypes in China, for example, but you wouldn't find the same hostile feeling toward Jewish people as in, say, Tunisia.

Well, the hostility varies, for sure. But the propaganda persists, even in places with virtually no Jews! Or maybe especially in places with no Jews. And it really is global, isn't it? Is there any other minority group consistently maligned this way around the globe?

uh black people

oppression olympics not really necessary is it

skeptical that guy who does know who geert wilders is might not be expert in global racism he thinks he is

Well it's hard to think of such a small minority group that is at the same time so visible and has a presence in so many countries. Like what would even be a comparison point, Bahai? There are persecuted Christian minorities in many places in the world but Christians on the whole are a pretty damn large group worldwide. Muslim minorities are persecuted in many places as well, and there's certainly plenty of anti-Muslim propaganda.

I've never heard of this Chinese anti-semitism personally btw. ime most Asian countries' populations don't even know what Jews are.

xxp

I don't consider myself an expert in anything. I do consider this board more of a discussion, and not a debate. I learn things here all of the time. One of the first things I learned, many years ago, is that some people are just jerks. Including me, sometimes. But not always.

The only thing I've ever read about in China is the flip of that "Asians are good at math" kind of racism, i.e. "Jews are good with money, how can we learn to emulate them." I find it mostly harmless.

http://blogs.wsj.com/chinarealtime/2014/05/14/is-china-anti-semitic-one-jews-reflections/

It seems, yeah, largely based in ignorance, and not overt hatred. But there's still a number that believes the worst of the worst, like "18% thought they were “responsible for most of the world’s wars.”"

This one, from 2009, points out the curious, complicated lack of a religious basis in Asia for Jewish conspiracies:

http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2009/feb/06/judaism-race

(I didn't google their authors, so apologies if they were penned by more right wing politicians I don't know.)

So my mistake.

No problem. The pinning of European anti-Semitism on its Muslim populations just makes me very queasy. I don't know how aware Americans of the line peddled by guys like Wilders and, before him, Pim Fortuyn and now very common amongst Islamophobes about Muslims representing a threat to liberal values - you know, all those hard won freedoms that the precursors to Wilders fought tooth and nail against.

The problem with this "survey of anti-Semitic attitudes" business is that it's without context. If you ask Chinese people a list of targeted questions about attitudes toward Jews, you might get some negative answers, but if you're talking about what preoccupies people, it's going to be low on the list. I think a lot of people with "anti-Jewish" attitudes would probably fall into the category of this commenter:

Teacup

09 February 2009 10:15am

29

Is this from first hand experience? I can't speak for other countries, but Indians spend little time worrying about Jews per se and certainly don't go around spouting anti-Jewish stuff. Anti-Muslim, yes, anti-Jewish, no.. A great many are annoyed with the actions of the state of Israel, but that is like assuming that people were annoyed with the Bush administration because it was Christian.

However, the presence of the self-styled "Jewish state" and its actions, don't make good advertising.

Lets not confuse religion and politics.

Also the kind of questions that are asked often lead the responder to an "attitude."

"Do Jews have too much power?"
"Well, there do seem to be a lot of Jews in power now that you mention it, sure I guess so, why should one group have so much power?"

commenter otm

(a post I never thought I would make about anything lol)

Oh, there are all sorts of ways one can get those results. But the 2009 thing I linked to gets into more detail, and more interesting detail, imo.

Pim Fortuyn

This dude I've heard of.

I don't think I pinned European anti-Semitism on its Muslim population, just saying that it preceded it, as well as Israel, so obviously stems from other stuff as well as the most obvious stuff. Which includes some Muslim anti-Semitism, but I don't think anyone can quantify exactly how much and where it comes from, at least not as easily as one can source Islamophobia, given the number of people in powerful, public positions who are pretty blatant about it.

i own some ellen willis collections but i've never read this piece before - i think it's very good:
http://www.tabletmag.com/jewish-news-and-politics/181449/willis-anti-anti-zionist

http://www.theguardian.com/business/2014/aug/17/sainsburys-removes-kosher-food-anti-israel-protesters

That's my local Sainsburys. The Kosher food was there when I went in 30 minutes ago.

bc they put it back or what?

It said in the article they were putting it back. I think somebody screwed up and they knew they screwed up so they fixed it.

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/08/21/opinion/deborah-e-lipstadt-on-the-rising-anti-semitism-in-europe.html

http://forward.com/articles/204493/jewish-student-at-temple-university-punched-at-pro/
http://forward.com/articles/204487/australian-jewish-school-evacuated-by-bomb-scare/

fuck this shit already

If they don't want to be targeted for being Jewish, maybe they should just stop being Jewish.

temple U! this is my fucking backyard.

I have Jewish family in Philly AND Australia.

that Philly thing doesn't read like a straight-up hate crime to me, a pro-palestinian group confronted by a dude from a right-wing pro-israeli group and the fists/insults flew...? not exactly shocking.

idk how reliable this is. the kid who got punched is a friend of a friend:
http://www.truthrevolt.org/news/temple-univ-jewish-student-punched-face-and-called-kike-anti-semitic-attack

def an objective account there lol

tbc nobody should be resorting to fists/insults. kids are stupid.

He is a member of the Jewish fraternity Alpha Epsilon Pi and a fellow with CAMERA, a right-wing pro-Israel media watchdog.

those guys are the fucking worst, i'm willing to bet that guy provoked his assailant.

of course, it takes two etc.

if he really wanted to provoke a response he should have just kidnapped one of them and set them on fire amirite

hey a link to ben shapiro's website, that's great

ugh Breitbart

http://www.jta.org/2014/08/22/news-opinion/world/vandals-target-jewish-school-in-denmark

Given that the guy was a "CAMERA on Campus fellow" I have to wonder if he was provoking them at least a bit on purpose.

Here's the *thing-I-just-can't-process-of-the-day*

http://972mag.com/nstt_feeditem/israelis-on-facebook-wish-death-for-holocaust-survivors-against-protective-edge/

Is this some kind of Sephardic-ashkenazic thing? Like do Jews from Arab countries more loudly profess their hate for Arabs and do they also have some kind of weird complex about not being of the group who went through the holocaust?

ime, as a stereotype, sephardic jews hate arabs more than ashkenazi jews do

where does that come from? bad relations with their neighbors prior to emigrating? Just a less politically correct/humanistic culture in general?

idk, any explanation i gave would be speculation + it's likely overdetermined but i'm sure it has a lot to do w/ being forced to live as second class citizens in arab countries before immigration + the ultimate expulsion of sephardic jews from middle east countries

http://www.npr.org/blogs/thetwo-way/2014/08/27/343666058/fashion-retailer-zara-pulls-kids-shirt-resembling-concentration-camp-uniform

http://media.npr.org/assets/img/2014/08/27/83b5a826-d7c5-45d4-86d3-24b300cf0665-460x276_custom-8d1b0c0aaf953bfe8116f9fbf1d61285bacaaefb-s40-c85.png

Update 1pm IDT: Zara parent company Inditex told +972 the shirt was inspired by Classical Western films and that it is no longer available. The Israeli chapter of the company apologized more profusely, adding that it was decided to remove the offensive product from the shelves – and “exterminate” it.

idk that looks like a Sherriff's badge to me

why it's on a striped shirt that is clearly not classically western in design is not clear

http://jpupdates.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/12/Jewish-Children-with-Yellow-Star.jpg

http://web.educastur.princast.es/cp/fresneda/colegio/biblioteca/investigamos/TEREZIN/JEWISH%20CHILDREN%20LIBERATED.jpg