The ILC Favourite Characters Of All Time

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Wow, and Lucy still to come.

Ray (Ray), Tuesday, 24 October 2006 07:43 (seventeen years ago) link

Doh! Sorry, Schroeder. I actually kind of liked him.

Andrew Farrell (afarrell), Tuesday, 24 October 2006 08:31 (seventeen years ago) link

Is Schroeder named after some composer? In the Finnish translation he's called "Amadeus".

Tuomas (Tuomas), Tuesday, 24 October 2006 09:29 (seventeen years ago) link

Chuck shoulda been #1. But I can take the poetry of him being unlucky #13, I guess.

It's the lazy and immoral way to become super hip. (Austin, Still), Tuesday, 24 October 2006 11:09 (seventeen years ago) link

Pig Pen is clearly number one.

Pete (Pete), Tuesday, 24 October 2006 11:51 (seventeen years ago) link

Schroeder is obsessed with Beethoven and Liszt; as far as I know he's not named after a composer at all.

All of the Peanuts characters could have swept this poll had we worked together as a team, I think.

Young Fresh Danny D (Dan Perry), Tuesday, 24 October 2006 12:50 (seventeen years ago) link

Schroeder is named after someone Schulz vaguely knew; he was in the strip for a few years before his piano-playing abilities were revealed.

Casuistry (Chris P), Tuesday, 24 October 2006 14:19 (seventeen years ago) link

first appearance: 30/5/1951
first piano virtuosity: 24/9/1951

occasional schroeder (kit brash), Wednesday, 25 October 2006 02:33 (seventeen years ago) link

Linus, Lucy and Charlie Brown are three of my favorite comics characters ever. I started making a list for a similar poll somewhere or another and gave up when I couldn't pick between them for my #1.

Adrienne Begley (sparklecock), Wednesday, 25 October 2006 02:57 (seventeen years ago) link

My #2 is of course the blonde girl with a cow head from Hepcats

Adrienne Begley (sparklecock), Wednesday, 25 October 2006 02:57 (seventeen years ago) link

Erica!

she looked more horsey to me though.

occasional horse (kit brash), Wednesday, 25 October 2006 07:40 (seventeen years ago) link

12. Doctor Doom (Fantastic Four etc.)

(159 points)

http://comicsmedia.ign.com/comics/image/article/664/664094/doctor-doom-20051103034219446.jpg

A great villain for the Fantastic Four, a haughty European lord and master that everyone can enjoy foiling. But possibly not as foiled as often as he is cajoled - as Justyn says below, he's not that far from a hero, and his sense of honor is an easier way to get around him than brute force. See particularly his final (or is it?) exit in the Ultimate universe.

Best villain in the Marvel Universe. Because he might not be a villain. (okay, he is.) (Pete Baran)

One of the weird, recurring, barely-buried themes of
superhero comics is that supervillains are not so very
different from the "heroes" who fight them. And it's
not that hard to imagine a slightly humbled Dr Doom
working alongside the Fantastic Four, since most of
the Marvel characters, bad or good, tended to be
immature egomaniacs. There was something heroic and
tragic in Doom that made Batman's numerous foes seem
like a pack of bumbling eccentrics.
(Justyn Dillingham)

greatest moment: Doom invades Stan and Jack's office and threatens
them with the sight of his naked face.
(Vic Fluro)

Andrew Farrell (afarrell), Wednesday, 25 October 2006 07:41 (seventeen years ago) link

One of my rare childhood Marvel comics must have been a Fantastic Four, because it featured Dr. Doom. I remember very little about it, aside from that it either had NO Spider-Man (who I knew and liked) or very little Spidey (I think I was expecting more Spidey because all Marvel comics of that era had Spidey in the top left indicia corner), and that I found Doom to be far more menacing than Darth Vader even. I remember that there was a sense of hopelessness among the heroes (whoever they might have been) w/r/t to beating Doom.
In my memory, Doom was the focus of the issue, and quite possibly, its terrifying nature is what kept me out of Marvel comics until She-Hulk.

Huk-L (Huk-L), Wednesday, 25 October 2006 08:10 (seventeen years ago) link

I agree that there is something tragic and heroic about Doom but the great thing about the character is there is ALSO something magnificently preposterous and pompous about Doom, and these things work together rather than pulling the character in two directions. Which isn't to say he's easy to write - lots of good FF writers have ended up with a lacklustre Doom or - worse! - a sentimental one.

One of my favourite Doom stories is Secret Wars, actually, where Doom is the clear standout character by virtue of his intelligence, willpower and determination: as soon as he encounters the Beyonder his every action is focused on trying to get some of his power.

Tom (Groke), Wednesday, 25 October 2006 08:43 (seventeen years ago) link

For my birthday last year my friend got me a novelty coffee mug shaped like Dr. Doom's head which would be basically my favorite thing on earth if it were only microwave and dishwasher-safe

Adrienne Begley (sparklecock), Wednesday, 25 October 2006 09:05 (seventeen years ago) link

Doom would crush you for your laziness.

Huk-L (Huk-L), Wednesday, 25 October 2006 09:12 (seventeen years ago) link

Doctor Doom!

Tom (Groke), Wednesday, 25 October 2006 09:26 (seventeen years ago) link

My favourite ever Doom scene is now the one in awful X-Men miniseries Beauty and the Beast #1 (I think) when Doom is in his Art Room where he surrounds himself with the finest art to show that mankind is worth dominating (or something). Of course it is all absolutely terrible.

Tom (Groke), Wednesday, 25 October 2006 09:28 (seventeen years ago) link

awesome

Huk-L (Huk-L), Wednesday, 25 October 2006 09:34 (seventeen years ago) link

Does he particularly want a goal beyond power? He doesn't have anything like Darkseid's Anti-Life equation - which of course makes it possible to do a great isolationist "Latveria abides alone" version, such as was seen in Black Panther five or six years ago.

Andrew Farrell (afarrell), Wednesday, 25 October 2006 09:55 (seventeen years ago) link

Doom's method seems to be:

1. acquire power
2. work out what to do with it. this will probably involve humiliating the accursed Richards.

Tom (Groke), Wednesday, 25 October 2006 10:02 (seventeen years ago) link

There was an Avengers in which Doom succeeded in taking over the Earth, and things got a whole lot better (as demonstrated by the Commies taking some tanks out of somewhere or other). The Avengers had to go and spoil it all because of freedom and justice and all that rot.

chap who would dare to welcome our new stingray masters (chap), Wednesday, 25 October 2006 11:11 (seventeen years ago) link

Yes, but did he have a dog or a parret?

Daniel_Rf (Daniel_Rf), Wednesday, 25 October 2006 11:38 (seventeen years ago) link

11. The Joker (Batman etc.)

(164 points)

http://www.geocities.com/Hollywood/Hills/7537/joker.jpg

By contrast, you don't know what you're getting with The Joker. Never generally diagnosed beyond 'crazy' (though thankfully no-one that I know of has given him MPD), he tends to range between his two loves - incredibly complicated traps, and just plain killing people. A great combination of the two was his appearance in Gotham Central.

Neither just a comedy crook nor just another psychopath with a fixation (like Clock King or Riddler or whatever), The Joker is best viewed as a sort of R-rated Gremlin. You're not really writing a good Joker story if it isn't made clear that the guy could at any time play hideous mind tricks on random innocent bystanders or kill off one of his own henchmen in some gory fashion for no reason whatsoever; but you're also not doing a good job if he doesn't seem like he could resort to harmless pie-in-the-face or water-squirting flower tricks at any time. It's a very difficult balance of fear and humor to sustain, but when done right it makes The Joker one of the greatest villains of all time. (Daniel Reifferscheid)

Best moment: From Batman: Mask of the Phantasm, when the Phantasm's got him beaten, the whole world (synecdochized as his hideout) burning to hell, the Phantasm's taking him away to who knows what end, and he cackles to his fate. (Leeee)

Andrew Farrell (afarrell), Thursday, 26 October 2006 07:13 (seventeen years ago) link

I want some speculation for the top 10, goddammit.

Andrew Farrell (afarrell), Thursday, 26 October 2006 07:20 (seventeen years ago) link

Well, Tom already revealed that Lucy's in there. Also: Wolverine, Calvin, Batman, Krazy Kat, Captain Haddock, Galactus, Enid from Ghost World. Which leaves two spots up for speculation. I'd be rather surprised if Batman isn't number one or two.

Tuomas (Tuomas), Thursday, 26 October 2006 07:33 (seventeen years ago) link

Actually, I'm not 100% sure Wolverine'll make it, but the other seven surely will.

Tuomas (Tuomas), Thursday, 26 October 2006 07:35 (seventeen years ago) link

MAGGOT !!!

Mark Co (Markco), Thursday, 26 October 2006 07:37 (seventeen years ago) link

Maggot is in there.

Tom (Groke), Thursday, 26 October 2006 07:49 (seventeen years ago) link

I can't remember ever really enjoying a Joker story, FWIW. I should read the "Laughing Fish" or whatever it's called.

Tom (Groke), Thursday, 26 October 2006 07:52 (seventeen years ago) link

Tom skewed the Maggot votes.

The Joker is a funny one. Okay, the point is the Joker isn't a funny one. There has never been a sympathetic Joker story I can think of which paints his usual abject lack of humour into a tough corner. More importantly the - ahem - Clown Prince Of Crime is supposedly the opposite of Batman, the light agin the dark, which never really works for me. Why would anyone, ever want to become a Joker Henchman.

(Oddly, this is where Harley Quinn works, she is much more sympathetic, and in the Animated series capriciously bad: of course playing off as just a mere prankster lacks the "horror" of the Joker. But who wants spine shattering horror.)

Pete (Pete), Thursday, 26 October 2006 08:36 (seventeen years ago) link

Maggot is in there.

STOP BEING A SPOILER!

DV (dirtyvicar), Thursday, 26 October 2006 08:41 (seventeen years ago) link

I think trying desperately to make him Batman's opposite is the sign of a hack writer. He's just the most popular early villain to come down to pike - but for a twist of fate, Batman could be archenemies with the Mad Monk or Adam Lamb.

I imagine signing up for Joker henchery is what you do when you need money desperately and nobody else will let you hench for them.

Vic F (Vic Fluro), Thursday, 26 October 2006 11:09 (seventeen years ago) link

Joker probably recruits on wayneslist.org

Huk-L (Huk-L), Thursday, 26 October 2006 11:32 (seventeen years ago) link

Enid from Ghost World.

Haha, no way.

Jordan (Jordan), Thursday, 26 October 2006 11:37 (seventeen years ago) link

I don't think I voted for Joker, and I'm not sure I've ever understood what the big deal is about him. Cesar Romero was great, of course, but no more so than Burgess Meredith or Frank Gorshin.
The original Joker of Batman #1 at least LOOKED pretty fucking ghoulish in a Todd Browning kind of way, all crude and angular and garish--which makes me wish Matt Wagner would do those stories too.

Huk-L (Huk-L), Thursday, 26 October 2006 11:50 (seventeen years ago) link

Loved the short run the Joker had in the '70s, particularly the issue where he fought the Royal Flush Gang. I haven't read them in a while, but I think he was kind to his henchfolk, unless they messed with him.

He's an interesting duck, with the years' interpretations of murderous, humorous, psychotic, etc. My favorite of Batman's rogues, aside from Ra's Al Ghul & Talia.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/5/54/Joker-1.jpg

lumberingwoodsman (Chris Hill), Thursday, 26 October 2006 13:31 (seventeen years ago) link

Enid from Ghost World.

Haha, no way.

Ghost World was number 10 in the greatest comics of all time poll, I'd be surprised if Enid wouldn't have made the top 10. I bet there are enough ILCors, myself included, who identify with her.

Tuomas (Tuomas), Thursday, 26 October 2006 13:57 (seventeen years ago) link

I have spoiled all I'm going to - sorry Andrew!

(except I wasn't lying about Maggot)

Tom (Groke), Thursday, 26 October 2006 14:06 (seventeen years ago) link

Who the hell is Maggot?

Tuomas (Tuomas), Thursday, 26 October 2006 14:17 (seventeen years ago) link

Info here.

lumberingwoodsman (Chris Hill), Thursday, 26 October 2006 14:21 (seventeen years ago) link

And he's in the top 10?

Tuomas (Tuomas), Thursday, 26 October 2006 17:21 (seventeen years ago) link

oh, tuomaspaws

occasional mongrel (kit brash), Thursday, 26 October 2006 20:18 (seventeen years ago) link

Okay, here's my prediction for the top 10:

10) Lord Fanny
9) Wolverine
8) Enid
7) William Gull
6) Lucy
5) Galactus
4) Krazy Kat
3) Calvin
2) Captain Haddock
1) Batman

Given how much people love the Fantastic Four, I think Mr. Fantastic might be there instead of Lord Fanny or Wolverine, but on the other hand he's rather boring as a character, isn't the?

Tuomas (Tuomas), Friday, 27 October 2006 07:19 (seventeen years ago) link

And I do hope Lord Fanny will the be the one Invisibles character to make it, because she's the only one of the main characters Morrison bothered to flesh out properly (the others where more or less stereotypical emblems/icons, though perhaps decidedly so?).

Tuomas (Tuomas), Friday, 27 October 2006 07:23 (seventeen years ago) link

10. Krazy Kat (Krazy Kat)

(181 points)

http://www.bdoubliees.com/charliemensuel/sfig1/krazykat/a1.jpg

No idea, to be honest.

What exactly IS Krazy Kat? Clearly he/she/it is even less of a cat than Ignatz is a mouse. Krazy's more like an ethereal spirit out of "The Tempest," not quite at home in the prosaic, mundane world of Officer Pupp and Ignatz, with its laws and jailhouses. He/she/it can't understand Ignatz's petty loathing or Officer Pupp's devotion; Krazy sees their deadly thirty-year war as a game between two friends. "The comic delusions of Don Quixote — the sheep and the
windmills — fall away as the narrative progresses, but they are far from mere foolishness," Kenneth Rexroth wrote. "They are misreadings of intent, misunderstandings of the powerful mana, the secret force, with which windmills and sheep and the commonplace life of the country inns and farmhouses of the Spanish highlands are surcharged." So it is with Krazy, who correctly reads Ignatz's demented obsession
with him/her/it as a sort of love. What would any of them do without each other?
(Justyn Dillingham)

Best moment - Every single time Ignatz beaned him with a brick. (David Simpson)

Andrew Farrell (afarrell), Friday, 27 October 2006 08:19 (seventeen years ago) link

In a final attempt to get some discussion, Jack Charlston's list revised:

five comic strips (Calvin, Charlie Brown, Krazy Kat, Pogo, Scrooge), five indies (Buddy, Cerebus, Enid, Hopey, Maggie), five 2000ADs (Crazy Jane, Johnny Alpha, Judge Dredd, Shade, Zenith), five Marvels (Black Panther, Dr Doom, Galactus, JJJ, Mr. Fantastic), and five DC (Batman, Bullseye, Rorschach/The Question, The Joker).

After this, you're on your own.

Andrew Farrell (afarrell), Friday, 27 October 2006 08:40 (seventeen years ago) link

I love "Krazy Kat" but can't really see how Krazy him/herself is that great a character - same goes for Ignatz and Officer Pup too, I guess. I mean, I read it for the bizarre setting and insane wordplay (which pans out in a very balanced way - if anyone gets more jokes than the others it's probably the narrator from the captions.) That said, J.D.'s blurb is a good one.

I don't think we *need* a sympathetic Joker story, tbh.

Daniel_Rf (Daniel_Rf), Friday, 27 October 2006 08:57 (seventeen years ago) link

I think my point about not having a sympathetic Joker story is that without the faintest degree of sympathy, or understanding, The Joker cannot be a character at all. He remains a cipher, a bloke who murders and makes bad jokes for no reasons, which is more akin to a force of nature than a real arch-nemesis. I know we had Batman vs The Earthquake in th 90's, but it doesn't keep coming back.

Pete (Pete), Friday, 27 October 2006 09:04 (seventeen years ago) link

I think when you first read Krazy Kat, at first it and Ignatz and officer Pup feel just like set pieces in this bizarre love triangle, but the more and more you look into it, the deeper they become, and finally you feel that it's not just a set Herriman has built, you understand that this is the only way these characters could ever be, because of what they are.

Tuomas (Tuomas), Friday, 27 October 2006 09:28 (seventeen years ago) link


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