Britpop : Time For Reevaluation?

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Do you have to be under a certain age though? Do over 40s get help for example?

― Brigadier Lethbridge-Pfunkboy, Friday, 9 March 2007 18:34 (seventeen years ago) link

Subsidising music or musicians wouldn't make a difference to me at my point in life. Subsidising venues and promoters would probably make more of a difference to me, to create more places for my band to play without dealing with awful moneygrubbing promoters. The difference for me would be playing somewhere that has a "get 20 people in the door with flyers" policy vs. someone who has the expertise and time and devotion to actually put together a good club, good bills and actually *promote* - that would be make a difference to me.

I know this may appear to be backwards thinking, as a musician, but honestly, it's not.

I mean, the difference between playing somewhere like the Bull and Gate and playing somewhere like the Windmill really shows this up. Which is a more pleasant -and profitable - experience for bands and fans?

― Masonic Boom, Friday, 9 March 2007 18:35 (seventeen years ago) link

There are lots of musicians of all ages who can easily find gigs, get media exposure, are supported by music fans of all ages.

WHY do you think this is? It's because someone is out there protecting this stuff, and not letting legendary venues be knocked down to build blocks of flats, not letting music papers be sold off to giant media empires who care about nothing but what shifts units, music fans having access to music that stimulates them through radio that actually plays local, independent music, etc. etc. etc.

― Masonic Boom, Friday, 9 March 2007 18:40 (seventeen years ago) link

And would subsidies get spread locally from region to region? That would be one way to keep bands from moving to London I suppose, but then would they still get signed?

― Brigadier Lethbridge-Pfunkboy, Friday, 9 March 2007 18:42 (seventeen years ago) link

xpost. Ha-ha. I WISH. You know, almost every well-known venue in Vancouver has closed it's doors over the last 10 years. Some new places have sprung up, yes, but mostly we have nice shiny condos in what used to be great rock-n-roll clubs. Thing is there are always people willing to try putting gigs on in new venues. All ages shows, cafes, restaurants, weird little pubs etc. People just love live music here.

― everything, Friday, 9 March 2007 18:45 (seventeen years ago) link

"Do you have to be under a certain age though? Do over 40s get help for example?"

Well, the most influential thing is the Can-con requirements and all musicians benefit from that. As for these grants, my understanding is that they are specifically tailored for more experienced musicians who are already professionals.

here: http://www.canadacouncil.ca/grants/music/se127227196662968750.htm

Back in the day in the UK, the indie scene could have been said to have been subsidised by Unemployment Benefits. I know many, many bands spent years on the dole while cutting classic albums for Rough Trade etc.

― everything, Friday, 9 March 2007 18:54 (seventeen years ago) link

"I haven't actually heard any music by The Horrors. That's probably in their favour just now. Are they as bad as I imagine?

Brigadier Lethbridge-Pfunkboy on Friday, 9 March 2007 17:19 (2 hours ago)"

I like them, much better than The Arctic Kooks View.

― zeus, Friday, 9 March 2007 19:51 (seventeen years ago) link

WHY do you think this is? It's because someone is out there protecting this stuff, and not letting legendary venues be knocked down to build blocks of flats

Yeah, who cares about affordable housing, what's important is that Runrig have somewhere to finish their next 25 date tour.

― Dom Passantino, Friday, 9 March 2007 19:58 (seventeen years ago) link

It IS important, actually. And it's not like they're gonna be building council flats where the Hammersmith Palais used to be, is it?

― everything, Friday, 9 March 2007 20:01 (seventeen years ago) link

WHY do you think this is? It's because someone is out there protecting this stuff, and not letting legendary venues be knocked down to build blocks of flats, not letting music papers be sold off to giant media empires who care about nothing but what shifts units, music fans having access to music that stimulates them through radio that actually plays local, independent music, etc. etc. etc.

hahahahahahahahahahaahahahahahah
*breath*
hahahahaahhaa

― JW, Friday, 9 March 2007 20:02 (seventeen years ago) link

Just wait til Rupert Murdoch buys all the music press.

― Brigadier Lethbridge-Pfunkboy, Saturday, 10 March 2007 00:13 (seventeen years ago) link

Who exactly are these "NME indie bands"?? I mean, I know there's the Kaiser Chiefs and Babyshambles, and you guys are mentioning some band called The Horrors (who I've never heard of) but who else is there?

― Mr. Snrub, Saturday, 10 March 2007 20:46 (seventeen years ago) link

oh for fuck's sake snrub, just GET ONE (1) NME and you'll see just a fraction of the bullshit mountain we have to deal with here.

― unfished business, Saturday, 10 March 2007 20:49 (seventeen years ago) link

You can't get an NME here in Ohio. The only place you could ever get them was the local Borders, and they stopped carrying them 'round 2001 or so.

Also, nme.com doesn't put their reviews online anymore :(

Anybody remember nme.com? Back in about 2000-2001 that was the BEST MUSIC SITE EVER. They had loads of shit from all through the 90s.

― Mr. Snrub, Saturday, 10 March 2007 20:54 (seventeen years ago) link

Nothing wrong about the NME these days. Franz Ferdinand are brilliant, for instance.

― Geir Hongro, Saturday, 10 March 2007 20:54 (seventeen years ago) link

Geir is wrong, anyway Franz Ferdinand on the cover of NME was years ago now. Now it's The Fratellis, The Horrors, The Shitehawks*
NME.com was awesome back then. It went to shit in a cost cutting exercise sadly. Shortsighted fuckers.

* May be made up.

― Brigadier Lethbridge-Pfunkboy, Saturday, 10 March 2007 21:03 (seventeen years ago) link

Nothing wrong about the NME these days.

Here, just for you, Geir, is NME's recent review of The Twang's single 'Wide Awake':

"First the Kaisers, then The Automatic and now The Twang. On current form, you'd put a fiver on 'super-indie' B-Unique succeeding even if they announced plans to fly Pennie to Mars fuelled by one of Preston's leftover cappucinos.

At first glance these gnarly Midlands upstarts look unlikely superstars. Their wardrobes are hopelessly bereft of the indie nation's current clobber du jour (mock gothic; Day-Glo rave). Their ever-growing fanclub, meanwhile, led by Noel Gallagher and Tom Meighan, suggests a certain laddishness about their disciples. And yet 'Wide Awake' is still the mightiest, most gloriously life-affirming track you'll hear this month. A filthy, cocksure confessional in the best tradition of Shaun Ryder, it finds Phil Etheridge taking drugs, getting jiggy with someone he shouldn't have and waking up in the morning feeling like death. It's a Mike Skinner concept album packed into three epic minutes. "What was I doing with that MILF?" he booms, as swaggering U2-like guitars shimmer by, all blessed with an unmistakable skunk-rock scuzziness.

If 'Wide Awake''s similarity to Flowered Up's 'It's On' (ask your dribbling, saucer-eyed, flower-headed weirdo of an uncle) will delight wheelchair-bound baggy veterans, The Twang are also bringing more of the pilled-up, anything-goes spirit of rave to the party that all the opposition put together. Sorted!"

LET. ME. COUNT. THE. FUCKING. WAYS.

― unfished business, Saturday, 10 March 2007 21:07 (seventeen years ago) link

I'd rather listen to "it's on".

― Brigadier Lethbridge-Pfunkboy, Saturday, 10 March 2007 21:10 (seventeen years ago) link

"upstarts".

Everyone's a freaking upstart in the NME.

― everything, Saturday, 10 March 2007 21:11 (seventeen years ago) link

Oh, and the best bit? It's a tough call, but THIS is the winner:

swaggering U2-like guitars shimmer by, all blessed with an unmistakable skunk-rock scuzziness.

UUUUUUUUH

― unfished business, Saturday, 10 March 2007 21:14 (seventeen years ago) link

(downloads "Wide Awake"; gives it a couple listens)

This is terrible.

― Mr. Snrub, Saturday, 10 March 2007 21:45 (seventeen years ago) link

So you see. You've only just SCRATCHED THE FUCKING SURFACE, dude.

― unfished business, Saturday, 10 March 2007 21:46 (seventeen years ago) link

But what does GEIR think?!

― Brigadier Lethbridge-Pfunkboy, Saturday, 10 March 2007 22:06 (seventeen years ago) link

I haven't heard The Twang, but from the description they sound great. Guitar based archetypically British pop/rock with a heavy empasis on songwriting and melodies usually is.

― Geir Hongro, Sunday, 11 March 2007 12:47 (seventeen years ago) link

Well, this Twang song is really crap: U2 meets Hard-Fi, at first listen.

― zeus, Sunday, 11 March 2007 13:01 (seventeen years ago) link

Mr Twang - 'Wide Awake'

― Mr. Snrub, Sunday, 11 March 2007 16:57 (seventeen years ago) link

What? You can't post links to YouTube on here?!?!?!?

― Mr. Snrub, Sunday, 11 March 2007 16:57 (seventeen years ago) link

Blur B-Sides still WIPE THE FLOOR with whatever else you care to mention. Throw Oasis and Boo Radleys out with the rubbish. And take Ocean Colour Scene while you're at it.

― Bimble, Sunday, 11 March 2007 17:12 (seventeen years ago) link

"No one can see when they get mace in their eye-eye-eye-eyes!"

Blur rule.

― Bimble, Sunday, 11 March 2007 17:32 (seventeen years ago) link

you better take that back about the boos. in fact i'm surprised you champion blur b-sides and not the boo radleys when really they're practically the same thing.

― the next grozart, Sunday, 11 March 2007 18:18 (seventeen years ago) link

You put my ignorance to shame, Grozart, I've greatly appreciated your posts earlier on this thread.

― Bimble, Sunday, 11 March 2007 19:08 (seventeen years ago) link

bimble, have you heard a boo radleys song that is not a) wake up boo or b) i hang suspended (single version)?

― unfished business, Sunday, 11 March 2007 19:28 (seventeen years ago) link

Throw them ALL out for all I care.

― fandango, Sunday, 11 March 2007 19:30 (seventeen years ago) link

:-) Bimble just promise me you'll give Giant Steps a go - it's pre-Britpop shoegaze-psychdub wonderment from 1993. If you can't be bothered then at least get the song "Blues For George Michael", an 8-minute epic B-side that really should've been an A-side in a perfect world.

Funny you mention "I Hang Suspended" Louis, as I thought it was normally 'It's Lulu', 'C'mon Kids' or even 'Wish I Was Skinny' that get dropped as "the only other Boo song I know". This is a shame as they're all relatively mediocre straight-up pop songs that were released as singles but were never really representative of their more left-leaning stuff.

Sad to see such a great band immortalised as a cheesy second-rate Britpop group with two songs, but I guess that's what you get for releasing boring singles. I say singles, I really mean "A-Sides" as the Boos, along with Blur, had one of the most fun and most eclectic back catalogues of B-sides in all of pop in my opinion.

That said, I did always like I Hang Suspended (not really very adventurous but a nice noise all the same). Lazarus is their only other true anthem single (after Wake Up Boo of course which I understand can leave a bad taste in the mouth but is still classic in my book). 'Ride The Tiger' was good too, despite the slightly dicky lyrics but the version released as a single missed out the cool psychedelic middle-eighth jam with the animal toys and swirly organ which on the album is kind of crucial to it being a wicked song.

― the next grozart, Sunday, 11 March 2007 22:20 (seventeen years ago) link

Argh, I went to their myspace to see if The Twang could possibly be so bad and good lord, they are terrible!
Where on earth is the baggy element or the rave like euphoria? The sub-Edge delay and chorus soaked guitars are horrible and the drums lumpen. And the singing? Dreadful.
Worse still, the picture on the myspace player for Wide Awake is a bunch of pills. Ooh! Controversy! Danger! Opportunistic bullshit.

― Stew, Monday, 12 March 2007 00:55 (seventeen years ago) link

I'm just waiting for the NME to hype a band called The Shitehawks. Someone start it please.

― Brigadier Lethbridge-Pfunkboy, Monday, 12 March 2007 01:40 (seventeen years ago) link

Oh and if only the Britpop bands had the vision to create and album like "Giant Steps".

― Brigadier Lethbridge-Pfunkboy, Monday, 12 March 2007 01:41 (seventeen years ago) link

I can't even see a Verve or Spiritualized coming through from the current lot of NME Carling Rock bands.

― Brigadier Lethbridge-Pfunkboy, Monday, 12 March 2007 01:42 (seventeen years ago) link

Thank feck for that.

― Marcello Carlin, Monday, 12 March 2007 08:49 (seventeen years ago) link

Surely the plodding, pseudo-meaningful balladry of Coldplay, Keane et al owes a lot to the Verve - more than to Radiohead arguably.
After all, didn't Chris Martin introduce Bittersweet Symphony as "the best song ever" (what's he on?) when they performed it with Dickie Ashcroft at Live8?

― Stew, Monday, 12 March 2007 08:59 (seventeen years ago) link

I was more thinking of Early Verve, you know, before they were The verve.

― Brigadier Lethbridge-Pfunkboy, Monday, 12 March 2007 09:23 (seventeen years ago) link

Why did I say Early with a capital E? Anyway none of those bands could lace the boots of any era of them.

― Brigadier Lethbridge-Pfunkboy, Monday, 12 March 2007 09:25 (seventeen years ago) link

Has there ever been a rock group named Early?

"Early" Verve is a good call, however.

― Marcello Carlin, Monday, 12 March 2007 09:40 (seventeen years ago) link

There is a group called Earlies now.

― zeus, Monday, 12 March 2007 13:42 (seventeen years ago) link

Surely the plodding, pseudo-meaningful balladry of Coldplay, Keane et al owes a lot to the Verve - more than to Radiohead arguably. [i]

There were two sides to Verve. Coldplay, Keane and Travis owe a lot to the good side of Verve, the great songwriting side that gave us such great classic songs as "The Drugs Don't Work" and "Sonnet". However, The Verve also had another side, consisting of boring overlong "jams" mostly based on only one chord. And luckily Coldplay etc. haven't paid much attention to that heritage.

Other than that, there [i]is a lot of "The Bends" era Radiohead in their style, but also lots of U2 and a-ha. (Travis and Keane are great a-ha fans)

― Geir Hongro, Monday, 12 March 2007 13:51 (seventeen years ago) link

Oh and if only the Britpop bands had the vision to create and album like "Giant Steps".

Would have been a lot better if Boo Radleys had created more albums like "Wake Up" instead. Lots of screaming and noise just doesn't make good pop music.

― Geir Hongro, Monday, 12 March 2007 13:52 (seventeen years ago) link

This thread goes from strength to strength.

― Dom Passantino, Monday, 12 March 2007 13:54 (seventeen years ago) link

Lots of screaming and noise just doesn't make good pop music.

Beatles to thread.

― Marcello Carlin, Monday, 12 March 2007 13:57 (seventeen years ago) link

Geeeeiiiirrrr...!!!

― the next grozart, Monday, 12 March 2007 14:33 (seventeen years ago) link

Geir excels himself again.

Marcello OTM

― Brigadier Lethbridge-Pfunkboy, Monday, 12 March 2007 14:34 (seventeen years ago) link

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