so so i just started doing this paleo diet thing - feels like it should be bullshit. is it?

What all kind of things are nightshades? I'm gearing up for a whole30 in October, but maybe this stricter one is the thing to try this time.

I've been playing with non-almond flour baking substitutes like arrowroot powder and tapioca starch, which has been not too disastrous.

I know for sure that tomatos are in the nightshade family. Beyond that, ignorance is all I can offer.

Did a quick look on wikipedia - tomato, tomatillo, chili peppers, eggplant, potato, and bell peppers. Bell peppers mess with me already; I could drop the others for a month just to see what happens.

I ate pasta today and I wanted to die--as Yerac puts it, it felt like a baby was punching my stomach from the inside. Fuck. This is actually happening, isn't it.

It's true, just thinking about what I used to consume in vast quantities now makes me ill, because eating even a little bit of it now I notice it fucking with me

The thing that's bumming me out is my inability to construct a coffee creamer that I can deal with - the best I've got right now is whisked coconut oil, I gotta start blending that stuff proper

I use canned coconut milk, mixed with some vanilla extract. If the cream/fat has separated, I hit with the stick blender.

I think coconut milk also hurts me! I like some of the non-dairy ice creams that use it but they make me as sick as dairy ice cream. :(

Almond milk is not that bad in coffee. Not that great but not that bad.

I use almond, I think the nuttiness actually complements coffee!

i make my own almond milk and use it in coffee, it's good

io, have you looked at any information on FODMAP (i think that's the acronym) sensitivity? It's a special class of carbohydrate that messes with some people, and coconut is one of the offenders due to fructose malabsorption.

I just stumbled across that the other day, haven't fully investigated yet--but I don't react to those fruits listed, or the alliums, or some of the other things. My list so far seems to be unreacted dairy, wheat in some amounts/combinations but maybe not ALL (still trying to figure this out), lentils/beans, things made from coconut milk.

;_____;

Something to watch out for with coconut milk - some brands have guar gum, which is made from beans

That seems like important information, which I appreciate. The coconut milk ice cream in my freezer does indeed have guar gum in it.

Okay yesterday was day 30 of my autoimmune protocol! Overall I lost 12 lbs, and I feel like I am sleeping way better. My skin is also way insanely clear, and my totally NUTTY heavy periods actually seemed to lighten up a bit.

I actually feel like I am making yummy food, too. Last night I made jam thumbprint cookies (coconut flour, arrowroot flour, honey, cinnamon, coconut oil and jam), apple pudding (apples and coconut milk and cinnamon boiled, then blended, then cooled in the fridge), lamb fillets, sweet potatoes, and green beans. I like to cook a bunch of food at a time for a few days worth of food. I'm spending about $150/week to feed myself. But I am eating only organic, only grassfed beef, etc. Which gets expensive.

Next week I am also getting tested for food allergies, and by mid October my thyroid levels are going to get re-tested, so we'll see if this is even helping.

hsII that is super encouraging! I've been using arrowroot lately to make crepes/wraps (uses eggs though), it's awesome. I also got tapioca starch to make the magic paleo no-nut dough from Tara Grant, hoping to try that this weekend.

i dunno if this is paleo specific but does anyone have experience buying/using guar gum, gelatin/gelatin substitutes for ice cream (dairy/non-dairy)?

Yes - I've found you need both guar and xanthan gum to get the best texture, and now I'm trying to stay away from both so just put up with a little iciness. I use Bob's Red Mill for both. I use Great Lakes gelatin (red container) for non-frozen puddings/custards - haven't tried freezing anything using it though.

Too much guar adds a really unpleasant "beany" flavor and slimy texture, I think. Xanthan improved the mouthfeel/texture without really adding to the flavor.

I'd say just use gelatin - it's way better for your digestion - but I've never made any iced desserts. You could use coconut cream? I found coconut cream in a can at the asian market, with no additives.

the gelatin seems to help keep it from solidifying into ice cube but the texture still didn't resemble ice cream. (probably because I forgot the heavy cream)

If you're not using any actual sugar (honey, maple syrup, etc), you've got to use xanthan and guar to get creaminess vs. solid block of ice.

welp... I am going off the paleo wagon. Not because I don't want to. I love eating paleo! But my dietician ordered the MRT/LEAP food intolerance test for me, and I have TOO MANY food intolerances to eat paleo for a while. I am intolerant to things that have been staples like sweet potatoes and coconut. I am surprisingly not intolerant to a lot of grains and beans, so I am going to be eating those for a while (for a few months).

Boo. Sad.

:(

:( sry homo. but maybe it'll help in the longrun?

There's still going to be a way to get where you want to go. It just might take a fair bit of tinkering to get there. Goof luck.

Starting a whole30 today. No grains, legumes, dairy except ghee, vegetable oils, alcohol, sweeteners, or white potatoes for a month. Which actually is how we eat 80% of the time anyway, but I'm going to miss going out for Thai food lunches and the occasional dark chocolate to get me through the afternoon.

Mandee, how are you doing with the diet change? Is it helping?

I have no idea. I pretty much feel the same.

i have read about and occasionally dabbled in paleo for a while now, and then this weekend all of a sudden my wife announces that she wants to try whole30. i'm not giving up booze or the two pieces of toast i have most mornings, but i'm in otherwise.

Ended this whole30 a few days early due to needing to celebrate. Down 9 lbs and 1.5 waist inches, which is kind of a surprise since it isn't that different from how I usually eat. Less fruit, more veg, fewer restaurant meals. Have discovered baking with arrowroot and tapioca starch, so those made up more of the carb component that sweet potatoes. 2000 calories/day and limited exercise (meant to start with the kettlebells again but never did).

Rather interesting paper this week:

Levene, Morgan E. "Low Protein Intake Is Associated with a Major Reduction in IGF-1, Cancer, and Overall Mortality in the 65 and Younger but Not Older Population." Cell Metabolism 19.3 (2014): 407-417

• High protein intake is linked to increased cancer, diabetes, and overall mortality
• High IGF-1 levels increased the relationship between mortality and high protein
• Higher protein consumption may be protective for older adults
• Plant-derived proteins are associated with lower mortality than animal-derived proteins

Mice and humans with growth hormone receptor/IGF-1 deficiencies display major reductions in age-related diseases. Because protein restriction reduces GHR-IGF-1 activity, we examined links between protein intake and mortality. Respondents aged 50–65 reporting high protein intake had a 75% increase in overall mortality and a 4-fold increase in cancer death risk during the following 18 years. These associations were either abolished or attenuated if the proteins were plant derived. Conversely, high protein intake was associated with reduced cancer and overall mortality in respondents over 65, but a 5-fold increase in diabetes mortality across all ages. Mouse studies confirmed the effect of high protein intake and GHR-IGF-1 signaling on the incidence and progression of breast and melanoma tumors, but also the detrimental effects of a low protein diet in the very old. These results suggest that low protein intake during middle age followed by moderate to high protein consumption in old adults may optimize healthspan and longevity.

Wasn't there something in the China study about this false idea we need so much protein (esp meat protein)? iirc something about high amounts being somewhat toxic

so.. i stopped being paleo and ballooned up.

I gave up being quasi-paleo about six months ago. I put on a few pounds but probably only the water weight that I lost with paleo. Now I'm yo-yoing around 5lbs this way or that. H-II, have you read about this theory that some people who did well on paleo are possibly not carb intolerant but FODMAP intolerant? I haven't read enough to have any idea what to make of it.

Yeah, I've heard about FODMAPS. I am trying to minimize any food restrictions, though, I get way too obsessive and orthorexic about 'health food'

maybe someday!

Same here, and it screws up my social life because if I'm on some food program or diet, while I'll eat whatever food is available, I'll resent it and never want to go out. No more of that. I've been trying instead to normalize certain MUST EAT IT ALL NOW TO GET RID OF IT foods, but that's for another thread.

Here's an account of the study that found all non-Celiac "gluten intolerance" is actually FODMAP indigestion.

Table 1 of this paper offers a guide for those interested in a low FODMAP diet:

Evidence‐based dietary management of functional gastrointestinal symptoms: The FODMAP approach

There's an interesting angle that some of these FODMAPs are also prebiotics that encourage growth of beneficial bifidobacteria and lactobacillus over firmicutes and enterobacteria.

fodmap diet is hardcore, I'm kinda afraid of it

that stuff makes me too ocd, i just need to find my own way without getting crazy

i did discover that chicory does a real number on me after a clif bar gave me horrible cramps, that was new

do we have or do we want a 'food: finding our own way without getting crazy' thread? or are we better off just embedding that everywhere we can?

oh no i would be down with that

i'd like to think there's a lot of restriction exhaustion going around?

FODMAPs and gluten and paleo and no legumes and no meat and don't eat tuna and "my knees hurt if I eat corn-finished beef but not grass-finished" and DHA/EPA balance and etc etc etc

kind of all goes heavily toward Pollan on nutritionism plus the wisdom of "eat food, not too much, mostly plants"

please give me a normal food thread, did we start one? I am on the 'eat whatever I want' diet right now and I actually feel really good

what I'd really like is to have a safe space to discuss food issues, yummy food, without people citing too many studies and etc (sorry Sanpaku but it gives me anxiety) -- like vegemitegrll I have a tendency to go WAY OVERBOARD with restriction and tip into orthorexia

Just join us on the what's cooking thread! I'm pretty sure I've mentioned that this stuff makes me feel neurotic too, so I have avoided this thread until I saw today that there was a request for food talk minus neurosis.

i think the what's cooking thread is perfect for general food discussion - it's always v positive and interesting

I remember you talking about how 'detox' talk (can't remember if that was it exactly?) made you anxious, LL, and at the time I didn't understand, but ever since bouncing the paleo scene, I am subscribed to all these Paleo FB pages, and it all gives me so much anxiety.. plus I have a few militant vegan FB friends who also post a lot about the China Study etc etc and AHHHH THERE IS SO MUCH INFO AND SO MANY 'GURUS' AND ITS JUST... EXHAUSTING. i'll join the cooking thread!

all "detox" claims are 100% bullshit tbh