Let's talk about Trayvon Martin, George Zimmerman, and how unbelievably fucked up this all is

Na, it's shit that takes lack of evidence for a proposition as proof of its opposite. You may want to consider that amount of respect you accord this person in future.

somehow i missed the late great's bold quote earlier. just...foul. IMO R0bert Zimmerman is the biggest P.O.S. in the entire Zimm clan. the sad a close second.

maybe there were witnesses that saw George starting the fight and he killed them all too.

And I say this as somebody who thinks that a Zimmerman acquittal was inevitable due to the police misconduct at the beginning of the case. x-post

there's a lot of the "well since the State didn't prove the case, it means Zimm's story is the true story" going around, but you expect that from an idiot layman, not someone positing a legal argument in a blog.

Its just a fucoin blog will u hush

http://gawker.com/the-zimmerman-jury-told-young-black-men-what-we-already-770650992

― k3vin k., Sunday, 14 July 2013 11:45 (7 hours ago) Permalink

Not to say this particular incident wasn't racially motivated, but this happened to me when I was in college. Parked after hours in a park with my then gf (we are both white ppl) and a cop rolled up. Told her to step out of the car and asked her if she was "safe" right now. Made me feel pretty good.

The prospect dot org article (Alfred's link) is otm

Its just a fucoin blog will u hush

― dub job deems (darraghmac), Sunday, July 14, 2013 3:27 PM Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

http://www.cringely.com/wp-content/uploads/MIDDLE-FINGER-CHILD.jpg

...Told her to step out of the car and asked her if she was "safe" right now.

I think cops are also checking for prostitution when they do this. They don't want to start out with "Are you giving BJs in cars?" in case it's not that, but having the woman get out and talk to them gives them more of an opportunity to size up the situation.

(Not an apologist for cop behavior!)

"Sir, let me see your penis."

"Mr. Johnson, I'm going to need to smell yo dick."

Really dislike tnc's response. Utterly quietist

ALEC needs to be a household name, recognized and repulsive. not just for their influence on Florida's "Stand Your Ground" law, but for the multitudes of other awful things they do every single day.
--Z S
thisthisthisthisthisthjsthis

― BIG HOOS aka the denigrated boogeyman (BIG HOOS aka the steendriver), Sunday, July 14, 2013 10:21 AM (5 hours ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

yeah pretty much everything that has happened in Wisconsin since Walker's election is a bunch of harebrained conservatives passing page after page of ALEC-written "model legislation," often with minimal changes to make it fit the state.

the state senator from waukesha, whose name I forget at the moment, is in particular idiot who can't even _explain_ or understand, let alone justify, half of the recent legislation she's (co-) sponsored. some ALEC dude suggests it, a few industry folks push her a little bit (perhaps waving some cash for good measure), and she just signs off.

i guess the word "ideologues" should have been in my last post somewhere

also as I recall the NRA is/was pushing pretty hard for "stand your ground"/castle doctrine-type legislation in every state. they passed a slightly milder version of it in Wisconsin over the objections of several moderate republicans

and every police organization ever

...which brings me to wonder... what do the police think about this verdict, or just the whole situation? zimmerman openly defied the strongly-worded advice of the police when he got out of his vehicle and approached TM. so now--in florida at least--are people just going to disregard what the police recommend? or are they not going to bother to call the police in the first place?

whatever your opinions of "the police" (as opposed to specific police forces/specific police members), I do think they tried to exert some kind of constraining force (as much as possible over the phone) before the killing happened, and had GZ followed their advice TM would be alive.

I only know one cop (and 'know' is a stretch, he's more an acquaintance), but from my recollection, his reaction was that the general public 'didn't know' all the details, and he also rushed to the defense of Sanford police, wanting to blame the D.A. for why charges weren't filed.

I don't think he's from that particular PD though.

I'd like to point out that 911 dispatchers aren't "police" by any stretch of the imagination. My sister worked at that for a while and she's definately not cop material.

(Again, nNot an apologist for cop behavior!)

not recent, but a similar case from last year, though he was actually arrested and charged with murder (I think this is actually on trial now as well):

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/national/man-shoots-teen-loud-music-article-1.1209345

I heard about this when it happened. I think even FL can't fuck this case up, as it's pretty clear that his defense is much weaker. but *knock on wood*

this happened to my 16 year old sister while she was driving her black classmate to school--*she* took offense and argued with the cop

never have i seen someone so small go so FTP so fast

xp

zimmerman openly defied the strongly-worded advice of the police when he got out of his vehicle and approached TM.
― flesh, the devil, and a wolf (wolf) (amateurist), Sunday, July 14, 2013 9:16 PM (1 hour ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

it wasn't strongly worded. "We don't need you to do that."

nor was he in his vehicle when the advice was issued.

thank fuck for armchair lawyers on the internet

they are technically correct tho

and you know this because you're another armchair lawyer on the internet? i'm glad y'all are on this thread being voices of reason. just tremendous work here guys. kudos.

no, I know it cuz I listened to the audio files a year ago.

what exactly is the compulsion here? what greater good are these assurances serving? i'm curious, because so many seem so desperate to explain the "law" as though this is a thing that they have read and know, and find it cathartic to explain the nuances of florida law which apparently everyone is an expert in. does it feel good to think you know things? is that the purpose of this demonstrative smugness in the face of tragedy?

oh the audio files a year ago. perry mason on the case!

lol why you bein so needlessly aggro, bro

are protesters smashing windows and fucking shit up in other parts of the country in response to this, or is it just where I live?

the fact that "Fruitvale Station" the movie about Oscar Grant opened this weekend definitely provided folks here with some "perspective"

lol why you bein so needlessly aggro, bro

― staff rules everything around Mi (Neanderthal), Sunday, July 14, 2013 7:52 PM Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

i'm sort of worked up about a verdict in this case. i don't know if you've been following it...

Concern-athon 2013 now taking your donations

i thonk everyone itt is worked up. it's not a competition

*think

oops

Concern-athon 2013 now taking your donations

― set the controls for the heart of the sun (VegemiteGrrl), Sunday, July 14, 2013 8:13 PM Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

how mad do i have to be to get the tote? totes are boss.

So what's next? What's going to come after/because of this?

I've been out all day -- do any smart ppl think the DOJ is going to bring civil rights violation charges?

clover isn't your problem w/ him that he has been following it while you can't be bothered enough to concern yrself w/ trivial details, who needs facts, burden of proof, presumption of innocence, etc when you have yr gut amirite. you can think zimmerman is a scumbag and murderer and that america is fucked up and the laws and culture that led to this are disgusting and that the way it's played out in the media (be it mass or social) are horrifying as well and still at the same time think that prosecution failed to make its case or even if prosecution had done a better job that the presentable facts may not have been enough to convict a man of murder beyond a reasonable doubt. george zimmerman is hardly the first murderer to walk cuz our justice system is flawed. are you gonna go bronson on us?

if we've got to the point that "love your neighbor as yourself and love god above all things" = "liberal" i just i just i just...

meh, worked for MLK and Dorothy Day

Maybe if some of you unbelievers realized that "God", for most people of thoughtful faith, represents the ties between humans, you could cease your seething kneejerk loathing for all religious practices and people.

judge not, my friend

I had no idea people of thoughtful faith used those adjectives, Morbs.

don't look at me, I've semi-lost religion in the last few years. If God created man, he made a mistake.

i'm sort of worked up about a verdict in this case. i don't know if you've been following it...

― stefon taylor swiftboat (s.clover), Sunday, July 14, 2013 8:08 PM Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

VegemiteGrrl is on the money. All of us are worked up about it. This thread wouldn't be this fat if none of us gave a shit - and most of us have been reading up on it for the last 1.5 years, too. We all seem to share the same opinion on how fucked up this all is.

Matt and Freud just made a minor correction to one of amateurist's statements - that's all.

Maybe if some of you unbelievers realized that "God", for most people of thoughtful faith, represents the ties between humans, you could cease your seething kneejerk loathing for all religious practices and people.

― playwright Greg Marlowe, secretly in love with Mary (Dr Morbius), Sunday, July 14, 2013 8:34 PM Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

I said fuck "God" because I hate the concept of God and religion in general. Whatever imaginary deity people want to believe in is their own right, I don't begrudge anybody for it and I would wager most of my friends believe in some form of God. w/e.

are protesters smashing windows and fucking shit up in other parts of the country in response to this, or is it just where I live?

― Gregory Bateson is always appropriate (sarahell), Sunday, July 14, 2013 11:54 PM (Yesterday) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

i've only seen the fucking up of shit from your neck of the woods, though tbh its where i expected it first

nothing happening here.

haha it's the only thing i've said on this whole thread & i get blasted. it's just that "he ignored direction to stay in his car" is such a pervasive media trope that it rubs me the wrong way when i see it. you can make the case that an injustice occurred even without phony facts.