Big Star

he is deluded about what he's aware of. The guy is a film blogger (actually, an awards blogger) and didn't have any use for Abbas Kiarostami til his last film. The last week he is his own parody...

first place i heard about big star was in an obscure music magazine called rolling stone, about 20 years ago now.

I love how " I would have at least picked up on a fragment of their lore, their sound…" is followed up by the barrage of "That 70s Show? Replacements? Bangles?" comments, like multiple hits to the head.

but Manuel Göttsching and Arvo Part aren't Big Star, right?

― clemenza, Monday, July 1, 2013 9:50 AM (16 seconds ago)

well, they are (part is arguably more influential & well-known), but only their respective certain circles/streams. i'm not surprised, even at my advanced age, to so frequently stumble across "important" artists of whom i've never heard. then again, i don't claim to catch wind of culture's every butterfly wingbeat...

Alex started playing transcriptions he'd done of Nina Simone solos and then, mind-blowingly, of Wagner's overtures

So when Alex shouted out, during a particularly rambunctious take of "Take Me Home and Make Me Like It" on the "Bach's Bottom" album, it was more than just a funny aside?

What I knew and didn't know growing up had less to do with relative obscurity than with four books: Christgau's '70s guide, the red Rolling Stone guide, Lillian Roxon's encyclopedia, and Logan & Woffinden's encyclopedia. If they weren't in one of those, like Göttsching and Part, then I likely didn't find out about them until my 30s or 40s. If, as with Big Star's prominence in Christgau's book, they were, then I knew about them, though sometimes I wouldn't actually hear them until later. (I just checked, and Big Star aren't in either the red or blue Rolling Stone guide, I guess because their albums weren't in print.)

So when Alex shouted out, during a particularly rambunctious take of "Take Me Home and Make Me Like It" on the "Bach's Bottom" album, it was more than just a funny aside?

LOL I forgot to put in what he shouted out which was, of course, in his delicious accent, "IT'S GETTING LIKE WAGNER"

I've never heard of REM, the Byrds, Beach Boys, or Beatles, and I know a lot about music. For instance, did you know a band called Black Sabbath recently reunited? I think one of the Beastie Boys used to be in that band. Ever heard of the Beastie Boys? They're really good, though I liked them better before they went rock. I wonder when they'll put out a new record?

Thing about that asshat Wells is his stubborn ignorance in the face of ample evidence, his refusal to admit wrong and instance on doubling down on the most ridiculous stuff.

So, I guess a Doobie Brothers documentary would be more up your alley, Wells?

nice Artforum piece on the doc

http://www.artforum.com/film/id=41722

New York opening is today !

also VOD

Elliott Smith's name spelled wrong in the iTunes listing. Will rent this ASAP regardless.

Will have to get it via VOD/iTunes since it's not playing anywhere even close to me.

new dn anyway

Alex Chilton actually did what some people probably thought the Velvet Underground were trying do—but wouldn't have collectively had the stomach for anyway—which is to present a vaguely and pervasively frightening vision, the world ending with a whimper not a bang, the looming horror of the madness yet to come. etc. etc.

The Velvet Underground ends as a grotesque Archie comic on Loaded, but there's so much about Big Star that really, really scares me because of Third/Sister Lovers and makes me want to go to the dentist and get my teeth fixed and so forth.

I actually only got into Big Star three to four months ago because I was looking to buy a compressor pedal for my electric guitar. People kept saying, "If you want to know how a compressor works, listen to Big Star." And then I heard "September Gurls."

The Velvet Underground ends as a grotesque Archie comic on Loaded

Fucking great album you mean

"13" is about as "grotesque Archie comic" as you can get. in a good way.

The guys were trading songs and riffs in a gentlemanly way, but the aural dance floor cleared when Alex started playing transcriptions he'd done of Nina Simone solos and then, mind-blowingly, of Wagner's overtures.

The Cliches album wasn't a guitar showcase, exactly, but it did include his take on J.S. Bach's Gavotte.

People kept saying, "If you want to know how a compressor works, listen to Big Star."

Yeah, man, they learned so much about everything from the Beatles. Think of the guitar solo in "Nowhere Man" ...

The doc was OK, not great. They maybe did as well as they could considering how little footage exists, or how few photos or, you know, how many living members of Big Star. They used a lot of photos and images multiple times, and there was a bit where I thought a TGI Fridays doc would be a cooler use of time, but there was some neat stuff in this.

So is Big Star the closest any major rock band has come to losing all its members? What other bands (of, say, three or more) are down to one?

Ramones are down to their drummers (and CJ), only Michelle's left of the Mamas & Papas

Oh, that's right, re: Ramones!

Skynyrd getting there.

Jimi Hendrix Experience completely gone.

How quickly we (I) forget.

Badfinger? I just looked at their wiki page to check and apparently, there were like 26 Badfinger line-ups.

the band's just garth and robbie now, right?

^Yeah, and Ronnie Hawkins too (if he counts).

MC5's just Wayne Kramer and Dennis Thompson.

Then there's lonely old RIngo....

Only one of the mid-'60s Temptations still living. (Dennis Edwards, who replaced David Ruffin in 1968 is also still alive)

Then there's lonely old RIngo....

Erm . . .

Paul died in 1968 as any fule kno

Yeah, seriously. Did no one tell you? They replaced him in the studio with the guy from Badfinger.

Just wanted to post on some of the Chris Bell comments above. First, I was prepared to judge the film based on how much time they spent on Bell, and am happy to report it's a ton. He's so fascinating, and sadly, just as this thread has become obsessed with AC's MJ covers, overlooked. The Jovanovic Big Star bio which came out in 2005 noted that it was quite possible he was struggling with being gay (I don't have the bio sitting around with me, but it's pretty well sourced IIRC).

Much more importantly, the bio & film documented that Bell in fact had a pretty decent hand in writing Radio City as well. perhaps someone can jump in with more info, but given that there isn't a bad song on that record, but it seems like I have read it's more than just 'Back of a Car' which is more than enough.

Bonus awesomeness-a John Jeremiah Sullivan piece on Chris Bell: http://www.oxfordamerican.org/articles/2010/apr/05/john-Jeremiah-sullivan-chris-bell-big-stars-other-/

My fave part in the entire documentary is when folks hear "I Am the Cosmos," and exclaim "so this is where Big Star went!!!!"

The doc claims they wrote a lot in the studio, so I imagine it's a lot like early Beatles: maybe one guy wrote more, but they made each other better. I'm not sure the first album is better than the second, but it's more ... pure. Less restless. Man, when my teacher and I went through the first two albums on guitar, "O My Soul" took at least twice as many pages to chart out than anything else!

link above not working for me; try this:

http://www.oxfordamerican.org/articles/2010/apr/05/john-Jeremiah-sullivan-chris-bell-big-stars-other-/

and I agree; Chris Bell as important as Alex Chilton was on Big Star's first album, and yes he did make several uncredited contributions to Radio City as well, though it's unclear exactly what and how much from what i've read.

My fave part in the entire documentary is when folks hear "I Am the Cosmos," and exclaim "so this is where Big Star went!!!!"

there were people interviewed for a documentary about this band who had never heard that album?! did they just grab random ppl off the street?

the interviewees mean "this is where some of the spirit of big star went" more or less
i liked the doc, not a big fan of the band or the tour. Thinking i should try third again though.

Yeah, it meant "there was this band I loved that changed its sound, and I just realized that sound had disappeared with its founder Chris Bell, who reappeared picking up right where he left off." Back then, barely anyone knew anything about Big Star, let alone that its founder had departed for Europe and practically disappeared. If you were one of the few who bought the records as they came out, you'd probably think Chilton was the mastermind, too. And if you followed Chilton post Big Star, you'd probably also have wondered, huh, what happened to that guy? Solo Chris Bell underscored his contributions better than they could be heard in Big Star, I think.

i liked the doc, not a big fan of the band or the tour.

What tour are you talking about?

I can't imagine anyone not liking the bulk of those first two records. They should have been '70s dorm-room standards.

http://www.cityparksfoundation.org/calendar/big-stars-third/
not so much a tour as an ongoing tribute performance
I'm likely showing my age but "70's dorm room standards" kind of explains why i don't care much for big star

chris' original is fine but i prefer this cover version
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aAsubglfwGQ

I really enjoyed this movie. It was disjointed a bit, but generally very moving.

Much more importantly, the bio & film documented that Bell in fact had a pretty decent hand in writing Radio City as well. perhaps someone can jump in with more info, but given that there isn't a bad song on that record, but it seems like I have read it's more than just 'Back of a Car' which is more than enough.

In the Rick Clark notes on the old cd twofer, John Fry is quoted that "There somewhere between two and four tracks on Radio City that Chris had a hand in writing, where he said, 'Well I'l get rid of my interest in those.' "Back of A Car" was certainly one...You can probably figure the rest out by listening..."

My guesses: "Back of A Car", "What's Going Ahn" (demoed right after he quit), "You Get What You Deserve" and "Daisy Glaze" (ambitious structure I don't quite see coming all from Alex, although Stephens & Hummel are also credited so who knows...). it also should be mentioned that in that first post-Bell demo session, the band tackled both "I got Kinda Lost" and "There Was A Light"--both solo Bell compositions, possibly suggesting Fry's memory was fuzzy regarding what was recorded and what actually went on the lp.

huh, to me the keepers on the Bell album are Cosmos, Sister, & those two, "I Got Kinda Lost" & "There Was a Light". & those I've gone back to again & again since I got the Ryko v in the early 90s. but the rest of that album has never really sunk in.

I've always felt that "Daisy Glaze" (my favorite Big Star song, most days) felt more like Bell than Chilton.

huh, to me the keepers on the Bell album are Cosmos, Sister, & those two, "I Got Kinda Lost" & "There Was a Light". & those I've gone back to again & again since I got the Ryko v in the early 90s. but the rest of that album has never really sunk in.