[ADMIN] Meta bitching - enough.

i dont really get whats so offensive about the meta 77 threads. they werent really meanspirited in any way

im talking specifically about the ones linked, altho in gen. 77 has been pretty good about keepin it positive

What about if some new jack starts an ILM thread with a title to the extent of, I dunno, "Why can't rappers stop talking about guns and bitches and be as socially concious as Bono?"? In that situation, what'd be allowed? Flaming him? Image posts? Zings? Or do we have to sit back and discuss his point?

(Sooooo hard to reply to this without zinging...)

I would suggest not posting on that thread you deem unworthy of discussion.

Meta posts: Dahmeresque when they mix onions and man

I think the mod objection is people should be civil and try to not post anything that would MAKE somebody object to it and ask it to be deleted

BNW that's been the rule for years and it hasn't really stopped the escalation of meta nastiness at any point in ILX's history.

Dom I think the last thing people want is to lose the everyday cut and thrust of ILX exchanges, even heated ones. It's when the 'exchange' element gets removed and it just becomes bitching or mocking off to the side that the problems emerge.

Many people now use site new answers, Dom.

What about if some new jack starts an ILM thread with a title to the extent of, I dunno, "Why can't rappers stop talking about guns and bitches and be as socially concious as Bono?"? In that situation, what'd be allowed? Flaming him? Image posts? Zings? Or do we have to sit back and discuss his point?

Say what the fuck you want to this hypothetical person. Just don't start researching his life, C&Ping stuff he's posted on other fora, that kind of shit.

In an ideal world, such a thread would sink off the new answers board with 0 replies, but when is that ever going to happen, I know. It would be great if it did happen once though.

Just don't start researching his life

My life's work is over.

guys pashmina's statements were pretty clear, i thought that would be the end of it.

loool xp

posting "u mad" after a long rant isn't always funny to everyone, tragic as that may be

LOL

xxpost

hey we could just delete everything that isn't ILE, ILM and some moderator discussion/scrutiny board

To be honest I think Pash has been as clear as he can be about what will be deleted and I'm going to avoid stepping outside those boundaries if at all possible.

poor jaymc

Off topic only somewhat: I still miss aja/dante.

I sure do hate those frat boys

^^^what about a thread like this? Acceptable/not acceptable? It's not targetting a specific poster, it's just "Hey, lots of ILM people use frat boys as strawmen when they can't come up with anything to say about music"

I think it's funny 77 is being called out even though it's generally a pretty nice/non threatening sub board.

the thread about Alex in NYC had a shitty title, but in the contents of the thread there were a lot of people saying he was a rad dude and calling out the thread starter as being a retard.

again, with Tuomas, there are the few standard zings, but overall I think people think he's a swell guy.

I'm also assuming the answer to my original question is "no".

Dom, how many times do you want someone to write "just don't go researching dude's life off-board"?

As someone who has directly been affected by this, repeatedly, in recent months (including ILXors harrasing friends of mine on flickr making VERY CREEPY comments about photos of mine they hosted - and sorry Curtis but that was a 77 doing, so I dont really have too much sympathy), I support this completely.

I tried to email Tom with a complaint/request/suggestion about this last week but I think ilx webmail's playing up and then I realised I just couldnt be bothered to care.

And I suspect a lot more ppl than you'd think also just can't be fucked going through the enourmous hassle of complaining properly about all this - because when they do, they endure months of "did you see what that whiny little bitch said on LJ/facebook/ilx/lol they're such a tightass" gossip afterwards and really who needs that shit?

I'm really disappointed in how this shit's made some people I like and respect change, and I'm fed up with being a topic of rumours, snark, and even worse - off board IM/email harrasment which has in the past actually been of a sexually creepy nature.

I've wanted to say something about this for ages but held off because then (as now) I would get my butt kicked for complaining.

But I just dont care anymore. And the shit I've been copping is REALLY mild compared to some people so what does that say?

lol dom we all kno the thread is about you, quit getting all lawyery about this bs

What are the consequences for doing so? xxp

i dont really get whats so offensive about the meta 77 threads. they werent really meanspirited in any way

imo the Skidmore one was some lame unfunny/uninteresting bullshit

guys pashmina's statements were pretty clear, i thought that would be the end of it.

-- tremendoid, Tuesday, 20 May 2008 22:49 (1 minute ago) Bookmark Link

http://www.number-10.gov.uk/output/Page29.asp

And I suspect a lot more ppl than you'd think also just can't be fucked going through the enourmous hassle of complaining properly about all this

It seems that mods may have come to appreciate this point and may be asserting themselves more. Is that in fact the case? As a matter of mod policy?

blueski:
im talking specifically about the ones linked, altho in gen. 77 has been pretty good about keepin it positive

-- deej, Tuesday, May 20, 2008 4:46 PM (7 minutes ago) Bookmark Link

all due respect, but with no admin log, this apparent new situation in which posters are subject to the whims of what a group of mods (who were made mods due to coding involvement or likeability to current mods) find to be unacceptable behaviour is kind of infuriating

i mean i like pretty much all of you guys, but you can see how this is kind of WTF to some of us, right?

ah fuck it im going to the bar so ignore ill check back later

Hence my suggestion that threads get locked instead of deleted.

Or set up ITR2 to move them to.

(xp) also fuck you for going to the bar, I'm gonna go talk about you on ITR

yeah, can we have some assessments of what it would take to get an adminlog built? i know we talk about this every time some meta issue comes up

it seems to me that the original post in this thread incorporates a lot more than just the creepy shit, but is borderline fun police.

admin log.

If people honestly have a problem with deleting completely zero-content, no intelligence shit like that which Pash has listed, because they think thats what makes ILX great, then I feel sorry for them.

Sorry, my intention wasn't to call out 77. For the most part, it just seems like old noise board to me, IE a bunch of people who know each other shooting the shit.

Forks, there isn't a record of what's been deleted viewable by either mods or non-mods. People raising issues over threads/posts that have been deleted is fine by me. I don't expect, or want this to change.

John, yes, I can.

(I know that wasnt rly JJs point tho this thread is moving too fast)

Tedious rote responses to certain posters, especially the use of repeated image "zings".

tedious image zings are bad, funny image zings are funny

Interesting points raised here: Post Deletion

blueski:
im talking specifically about the ones linked, altho in gen. 77 has been pretty good about keepin it positive

-- deej, Tuesday, May 20, 2008 4:46 PM (7 minutes ago) Bookmark Link

-- jaymc, Tuesday, 20 May 2008 21:54 (3 minutes ago)

thanks jaymc, i read that bit after posting my comment but before reading your one. peace out bruv.

I would love a system where the moderators could hide postings from a thread, but where users could un-hide them selectively. Like a unilateral version of downmodding (see: Slashdot, Digg). For example:

Original Post:

Zing! Nice original thought, jerk!

-- Poster, Tuesday, 20 May 2008 21:49 (5 seconds ago) Link

Modded post:
(Hidden)-- Poster, Tuesday, 20 May 2008 21:49 (5 seconds ago) Click to unhide

Maybe that would just invite even more meta-bullshit, but at least you wouldn't start getting all sorts of "where'd my post go" threads and emails. I guess this would add more code, etc, to the site, though.

The "rote" bit is the most important bit there, Deej. It gets awfully tedious, for a whole bunch of people, to see the exact same image thrown out over and over and over again.

What about the Alice Cooper "lol" gif?

Can we implement thumbs up/thumbs down on people's posts?

^^^^^yes

that would easily halve HOOS' post count tho

^^i haven't even noticed that. maybe an image (like snoop dogg or whatever) will get picked up as a zing response to a bunch of different posters for a couple of days, until it gets old, but i don't see why that's so bad.

XPOST

what an odd thread, which I had not seen. yet I welcome it.

I have no doubt that ilx has gone downhill over years. I respect Raggett's caution on that point, but I think he politely knows it too.

I have never heard of 77 or seen these other boards that are mentioned.

I'm not sure that I've noticed that 'meta' things are the problem; not certain what that means. not have I noticed any of this stuff about researching people's lives (??!).

I think the main problem is too much nastiness. raise an innocent question and get attacked - that's no good. that has happened to me repeatedly since I started posting again a couple of months ago, and I have been quite shocked by it.

I also think a problem is laziness and telegraphic one-word posts - perhaps this is something that Pashmina mentions.

I doubt that ilx could ever be what it was. I doubt that *we* could be what *we* were! but if ilx is going to exist at all, then I think Pashmina's views are correct.

hey, I'm going to meet Pashmina in June, I think.

thumbs down: infuriating

x-post -- No he doesn't.

I still think this thread was pointless. Should have been a closed thread so noone could comment on it. I mean, what did it do? An endless amount of comments and not that much difference in attitude, really. Not that it really should. I mean at the end of the day isn't it a bit DUH if you say that as a mod you have the power to delete/ban or whatever?

If "DON'T BE A DICK" policy refers to super-creepy liable stalker bullshit only, then how come Tombot keeps bringing it up on threads where dudes cry about people being mean and other dudes tell them to harden the fuck up?

because the "other dudes" in question are basically meta troll shitbags 99% of the time

and really tiresome besides

kind of like whatever schtick you're copping

aaaaaaannnnnd