Black Sabbath: 13

scott the thought that you are not interested in listening to The Seer kinda makes me wanna cry, it is easily as good as any other Swans album.

part of me feels like its a bit of emotional blackmail and it makes me a tad bitter. i loved swans and bought all the albums and very seriously invested myself emotionally with the music for many years and the final tour WAS a way of achieving closure with the group and my life up to that point. that last show in philly was cleansing and cathartic. i felt really GOOD about MG's decision to move on. and in a way i felt like i could move on too! and then years later its on again and i'm supposed to feel what i used to feel or i'm not a good fan. which probably sounds crazy but that's fandom for ya! so, i skipped through the the seer on a soundcloud or whatever and i went right right i know those sounds awesome cool great...and then i forgot about it. but i wish them all well.

and i also think he knew that he could make swans albums in his sleep and could keep doing it forever and that's why he wanted to branch out and i was all for that (even if i kinda found AoL a little tedious) and now he is proving me right cuz he hasn't lost a step. i even unfriended him on facebook cuz the swans talk was bugging me....#worstfanever

i've never been a completist fan though. like if i liked a band i had to buy every side-project, etc. i've never owned an ozzy album. i'm happy to like an album or albums by bands/an artist and then ignore what they do after those albums for decades. i mean black sabbath are a part of me. part of my dna. they are inside me. bill ward is inside me EVERY day. i could never ask anything more from them. and anything they do is okay by me. its hard for me to even think of people who i wish would make one more album. or play live again. there are very few people i feel that way about. they have already blessed me in some way. mark hollis! to be all ilm about it. that's about it. lawrence from felt has embarrassed me with riches. i never ever thought i would hear from him after felt. just didn't seem possible for some reason. and even though i'm his biggest fan on earth i STILL haven't bought the new go kart mozart album. i just don't live near anywhere that would carry it. i'll get it eventually. i told you i was a weird fan. i've got a lot to listen to though...

i've never owned an ozzy album.

I thought I knew you, man

modern-era ozzy is just sadness, there's no reason to put your ears through that

i've HEARD ozzy records. my brother had them all.

I can't do much past Bark At The Moon

first song is out - the 9 minute "God IS Dead"

http://www.factmag.com/2013/04/18/listen-to-black-sabbaths-new-nine-minute-single-god-is-dead/

So far so mediocre.

It stayed mediocre. Only thing that stuck with me was Geezer's loose string noise, and that's not a good thing.

man that is reaaallllllly long....also for no apparent reason, dunno why it couldn't have been 5 mins instead of 9

it is cool in a way, i mean it sounds like sabbath for sure, just the way that geezer and tony play together is inherently good

rage drummer does a good job too

It's actually pretty good.

it earns the length, imo. the lyrics are interesting and obviously the main focus. ozzy's delivery has to be slow enough to suit the ponderous riffing, so sure, it takes him nine minutes to circumnavigate the corpse. thought there isn't much going on, i like the gradual waves of build and release, only finally cresting some six minutes in. reminds me of "halo of flies", this epic metal cri de coeur, wringing some poor sap's soul dry for our decadent amusement (nowhere near so proggy or theatrical of course). seems like it needs a suitably grandiose guitar solo to really nail it down, but geezer cutting up at the end is an acceptable trade. not bad.

inessential though. sounds like a textbook on the subject, a composition in the style. not doomy enough to harrow, spacey enough to seduce, or raw enough to lash. just a pleasant drip down memory drain (srs, couldn't help it).

fwiw, i'm half with scott, in that i think it's okay to decide you've had enough, heard enough, even from your most dearly beloved. our interests change, we change, and sometimes you just wanna be someplace else. i often feel like a "bad fan" for not keeping up, and not all band reunions are as tragic as stooges 2, but it's hard to get super enthusiastic about even a well-executed nostalgia trip. i mean, it was cool to hear van halen jamming like champs on a different kind of truth, but the best material was rehashed, and david lee roth is such a fucking drag. otoh, you do get a real surprise every now and then, something that opens up your ears and gets you back in touch with what you loved and why. voivod's katorz, dino jr.'s recent run, MBV, swans.

probably no coincidence that that bunch are all at least a generation younger...

dylan's career renaissance in the late 90s/early 2000s was a pretty amazing thing. you never know who will surprise you.

jesus this is bad

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1pkmTaT6hhY

you better just describe it because there's no way I'm clicking on that

Bad doesn't really cover it.

whoa ozzy covers pretty much every conceivable key in that. wtf.

iommi sounds great tho

its a horrible universe where consummate showman Dio dies before "singing" animatronic corpse Ozzy

christ that's dreadful, who let michael caine up onstant

onstage

so uh this leaked and i just can't bring myself to listen to it

Its a slog

Leaked? It was in my local record store yesterday. Very easy not to buy. Record store owner said it sounded totally recycled. I am totally not shocked.

was iron maiden the most successful metal reunion ever (cover art aside)?

http://https%3A//encrypted-tbn1.gstatic.com/images%3Fq%3Dtbn%3AANd9GcSLAVfy3xqPbNgoX6SRPc--Z5btRuCC9Lh0L-bGux4fI0igEW-x

^i remember being psyched about this record when it came out.

Your local is breaking street date because it's not supposed to be out till next week.

It's streaming on itunes for free, and I made it 9 minutes in before I wanted to strangle Ozzy. Not going to bother with any more of it. I can't stand the vocals or Geezer's bass tone which is all loose string rattle that detracts from his always excellent lines.

I'm writing a long review for Burning Ambulance. Short version: It was a doomed effort from the start, in part because it's 2013 but also because of metal fans' unreasonable expectations and demands.

I can't stand the vocals or Geezer's bass tone which is all loose string rattle that detracts from his always excellent lines.

Hm. Sound like whoever produced this took what's distinctive and awesome abt Geezer's rubbery, duckfooted sound and exaggerated it to deleterious effect.

It's streaming on iTunes. The first two songs are both over 8 minutes long. I kind of liked "God is Dead?" when I first heard it because it wasn't as horrible as I expected, but I couldn't even get past the first track on 13. I'm honestly just not interested.

In other words, it's not that it sounds awful...it's just Black Sabbath wallpaper. Revisit Never Say Die and Technical Ecstasy. That's time better spent.

Man, it kicks the shit out of Never Say Die/Technical Ecstasy/Born Again! As far as I can tell only one person on this thread has actually listened to the album so far. I think it's pretty great! I saw Dio's final Heaven & Hell tour and it was really good, but I thought Sabbath's performance at Lollapalooza last Aug was even better, even considering that Ozzy obviously never could match Dio's abilities. But then, it's hard to compete with a setlist focusing on their first four albums. I couldn't get into the last Heaven & Hell album (need to go back to that), but I really liked 13 from the first listen.

Iommi's riffs and tones are better than anything I've heard from him since friggin' Sabotage. I was never a fan of Ozzy's solo stuff as he emphasized a more high-pitched, keening style that I find annoying. Seems like Rubin worked hard to get Ozzy back into more lower registers, and I don't know how anyone could expect him to sound any better than this. I don't know how he did it, couldn't detect any autotuning, but it's the closest he's ever sounded to classic Sabbath era.

This is SO not better than Born Again.

Once I can listen track by track I'll give it another go, but the 2 1/2 songs I've heard are hideous crap.

Man, it kicks the shit out of Never Say Die/Technical Ecstasy/Born Again!

literally no way is this possible

i listened to this album on grooveshark fast n bulbous

But is it better than the new Deep Purple record?

no.

okay listened to a couple songs and shut it off, that '09 Heaven & Hell record smokes this not to mention the last couple Ozzy Sabbath records

I'm about to give it a listen.

I honestly like God Is Dead pretty well. I mean, it's about as good as it could possibly be, considering they blew it with the drummer thing. I wish they'd gotten Ginger Baker or Tommy Aldridge or Jason Bonham or literally ANYONE besides the unmentionable.

I'm a pretty big fan of Black Sabbath. I own all their records. The thing I can say going into this one is that there is no possible way it can be as good as the 2009 Heaven & Hell record because that project was thoroughly unselfconscious and honest. Whereas I'm certain in advance that 13 is highly calculated and "safe," which Black Sabbath never was in the 70s.

Back soon...

Ok I listened start to finish (to the 8 song version) and I am impressed. Planning to write a much more extensive version of my first impressions. It's certainly a glass house, but I'm a fan and found a lot to like, considering the context.

I was expecting the worst when I kept up with what people were saying on this thread, yet here I am enjoying this new record... go figure!

Many folks are bringing a whole lotta baggage to the table in their reactions to this album. Are panties twisted because it's not as good as Vol. 4? Why is it such a big deal that Ward isn't on it? He wasn't on The Devil You Know either. From every account I've heard, Bill Ward cannot play like he used to. In an interview Ozzy mentioned that Bill simply was not capable of playing full shows, but they would have been happy to have him do what he can with a backup drummer, but his pride wouldn't allow for it.

"...we all had to ask, 'Can he do an hour-and-a-half, two-hour gig? Can he cope?' My suggestion was that we run through a set and see how he got on because he was so out of condition and the drummer is the most demanding job in the whole band. We looked at Bill and he couldn't remember what the fuck we were doing. But he didn't come clean and say, 'I can't cut this gig but can we work something out, guys, where I'll come on but with another drummer backing me up?' Or, 'I'll come and play a few songs', that would have been cool.

"I get where he's coming from, though. His pride was hurt and I get it. I really do get it. The guy will always be a dear, dear friend and a brother to me, but you either shit or get off the pot."

Ozzy continues: "I get up and I hit the gym most mornings. I vocal exercise and I keep myself going. I sing for a living so if I don't sing for two or five years then I go, Oh I'm going to get back together with Black Sabbath, if I don't make any adjustments to my attitude towards it then I'm not going to get the gig, you know. He can't be surprised that he didn't get the gig. He can't be! (nearly shouting) Fucking hell!"

"You know them yellow fucking stick-on memo notes? HE had them all over his fucking drums. I was like, What the fuck's that for, Bill? He said, 'I can't remember what I'm doing.' I go, how are you doing to remember out of those 500,000 bits of paper stuck all over your kit, which one you're looking at, Bill? 'I'll know' Ah, OK great.' -- MOJO

Chances are high this could be Tony Iommi's last album. Or Ozzy's or Geezer's. I'm enjoying the hell out of the album, and hope to see them play the new songs along with the old in August.

Jesus fucking Christ, I've seen Ozzy three or four times, once with Sabbath, and I'm shocked that guy can play a hour and a half or two hour gig. In fact, by most standards he barely did, and it's hard to believe an extra ten years or whatever has made him better.

The point is, Ward was originally announced as participating, and now he's not. Given Ozzy Inc. is the same crew that replaced the rhythm section of his solo albums over money disputes, and fucked with Iron Maiden for making him look bad, it's hard for me to believe anything that drools out of his mouth.

agreed

I should stress that by "that guy" I meant Ozzy, the water-bucket dumping tool. Not Ward. If Ward literally could not do it, physically, then he wouldn't have lobbied to stay in the band, where he'd have to put up or shut up. No doubt he was just getting the contractual shaft first and foremost, with an excuse retrofitted for his absence.

I've seen Ozzy three times in the 2000s—solo in 2007 and 2010, and with Black Sabbath in 2004—and in 2004 and 2007 he was okay-to-good. In 2010, though, he was much better than either of the two prior times and played a much longer set, two hours plus. He has actually been in better voice the last couple of years than in the years prior, mostly due to giving up booze and drugs and eating better, exercising more, etc.. I don't know how he sounds right now, because he did relapse recently.

It's also worth remembering that Ward suffered a major heart attack 15 years ago, when the group first attempted a reunion. It's entirely within the realm of possibility that he turned out not to be at full physical capacity.

I saw him post heart attack, he was fine.

I mean, it's all moot, because none of them are operating at their peak, by any stretch. This reunion is symbolic at best, and minus Ward totally pointless. Because as I've pointed out repeatedly, Black Sabbath already reunited, with Ward, back in 1997 and 2004. It was fine. The only reason to record a new album was to record with the original line-up.

Ronnie did a better job of it than Ozzy, I'm okay with not having any more Sabbath reunions myself. Especially if Ward isn't part of it, for whatever reason.

So Sabbath last night was just phenomenal.

Let me tell you something, aero, I kinda feel like you are
being a complete jackass about this thing. I mean the very idea. If someone gave you tix to the Zep show at O2, would you have not gone because, "oh well, you know, that's not REALLY Led Zeppelin". pffft. come on

ANYWAY, point being I did see Sab last year at Lollapalooza, and man they sucked real bad. Ozz was clearly done. Didn't remember lyrics, looking at the teleprompter constantly. Doing like the classic pouring buckets of water on his head. It was pretty much a sham, yeah.

Last night, tho: magical. His handlers clearly cleaned him up for this Sabbath tour. Dunno what they did to get him straight; but I gonna be honest, he's kinda back! and it's kinda damn magical!

"Under the Sun"
"Behind the Wall of Sleep"
"Into the Void"
"N.I.B"

performed in fantastic fashion by Ozz, Geez, and Tony. On a beautiful Friday evening. With a shit ton of fellow Sab fans complely losing their mind.

Stormy I'm glad the show was this weekend was great, sorry I missed it, but you totally exaggerate about Lollapalooza. Yes he faltered somewhat in second half of the set, but it wasn't how you described. Having observed him in the last decade, it's amazing he can even walk and talk let alone sing halfway decently. I was near the front, perhaps too busy losing my mind. There's plenty of video footage though, and it was far, far from a sham. It makes sense that they'd be better now though, with that many more gigs under their belts. It sounds like it's too much though, they're getting burned out. Geezer is saying he's too old to be playing every night. Agreed, they're old, well, geezers, and they shouldn't be expected to tour like a bunch of 20-somethings. In Iommi's interviews, however, he says he's having a blast, and has no idea how long he'll be around so he's enjoying it while he can. I'd say that's the main point here. If nothing else, Tony fucking Iommi is putting it out there every night, and the man is sick with cancer. He's probably going to die, maybe in six months, maybe a few years. I really hope he doesn't, but he is NOT in remission as far as we know. So all the bitching about Ozzy not being perfect or missing Ward seems utterly pointless.

Didn't see the show the other night, but have seen Sabbath before a couple of times. To the band's credit, at least it recorded a new album this time, and while decades of Ozzy Inc. doing things mostly for the money definitely eroded whatever reputation he ever had, it's reassuring that Ozzy is being treated almost as an afterthought to this outing, with all eyes on Iommi. But the dif between Sabbath and the Zep reunion is that Zep has reunited sans Bonham, what, three times? All one-off performances. And Bonham was not locked out of the band due to financial feuding, he's dead. But Sabbath has reunited several times already, both with and without Ward, who this time around has been locked out of Sabbath for money reasons, as far as any of us know. A good time can still be had by all, in the band and in the crowd, regardless, and again, I love how the focus has largely been on Iommi and this awesome machine he created. Doesn't mean there's no room to bitch a little about the way this final (?) go-round went down.

Those who feel Sabbath has been underrated in the 2013 polls, this is your chance to make an impact. While unfortunately fewer people are voting, it means your ballot will have more impact.

~~~ ILM METAL POLL 2013 - ALBUMS & TRACKS VOTING & CAMPAIGN THREAD~~~ (VOTING ENDS FRIDAY JANUARY 10th 11.59pm UK time/6.59pm EST) )

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stop it

No.

They might have rehearsed together in the same room (with cameras rolling), but there is no fucking way they made this album with everyone in the same room jamming together, not with everything that's at stake from a label perspective.

Actually they did record this pretty live. When I interviewed Iommi, he said it was the most live studio album they've made since the first one, and that Rubin made him do his leads first take and overdub the rhythm parts. He even wrote a guitar melody line that Rubin threw out. He said Ozzy was in the vocal booth while they were tracking. That none of them had worked like this in decades.

I'm not defending Rubin here, but it does sound like they went through some good effort to do this right.

this still holds up to my ears.

Age of Reason

I played this today and tbqfh, it holds up just fine. in fact, maybe even better, because there's no burden of expectations.

it's not perfect (Geezer's bass sounds weird, "AGe of Reason" has an Audioslave sounding riff), but most of the songs hold up to me. feel like the first three are a solid jump out of the gate.

I'll be playing this again this week I'm sure.

I like this album. Was quite shocked to read the first posts on this thread... Iommi is in great form, Ozzy sounds fine, I've never had problems with the bass sound. Ward is sadly missing, fair enough.

I mentioned upthread that I wrote a review, but I never posted it. Here's a link. I stand by it.