"Born to Run" by Bruce Springsteen -- who really enjoys this overproduced crappy glop?

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everything fcc says I assume to be true because of his ilx id

but sometimes even the truth contains typos.

― fact checking cuz (fcc), Wednesday, 5 January 2005 00:49 (8 years ago) Permalink

again with the truth!

― Riot Gear! (Gear!), Wednesday, 5 January 2005 00:51 (8 years ago) Permalink

I like Grimly Fiendish's Glasgow pub jukebox anecdote. The moment Born To Run (the song) made sense was when I was on the low level train to Finniestoun on my way back from a mate's flat. I'd borrowed a random mixtape to listen to on my walkman. I was pretty drunk on red wine so I liked the idea of being totally surprised. As I headed from High Street to the Argyle St station For Those About To Rock by AC/DC came on. So far so mighty. Fists pumping in the air. As the train trundled beneath the motorway it was some John Spencer tune. Pretty rocking. Then, just as the train pulls in that trem guitar riff comes in "dahh, dah dah dah daaah". The E Street Band pile in as I leap triumphantly onto the platform and race up the stairs. I feel so fucking mighty. A glorious moment. 5 minutes later I was back at my flat feeling awesome. That's the power of The Boss.

The album that got me over my indie Bruce fear was Nebraska. That album gets better with every listen. Just stunning. Darkness would seem to be my next best step. I can get them all cheap on vinyl easy peasy.

― stew, Wednesday, 5 January 2005 00:51 (8 years ago) Permalink

xpost:
Is there in truth no beauty?

well ain't that the pot calling the kettle black!
Precisely.

Search is slow, otherwise I would post the link where Momus hollas for fcc.

Something else readers of this thread might enjoy: Max Weinberg's drummer interview book- The Big Beat.

― Ken L (Ken L), Wednesday, 5 January 2005 00:54 (8 years ago) Permalink

Precisely.

there i go, spouting the truth again.

― fact checking cuz (fcc), Wednesday, 5 January 2005 00:56 (8 years ago) Permalink

An hour before spotting this thread I wondered to myself if the opening lines to the song were possibly the best opening lines for a rock song ever. "At night we ride through mansions of glory in suicide machines" gives me goose pimples, for real. And since I've given up the ghost of boring anti-bombast punk purism (a phase which lasted me more or less the couple months in 1994 between hearing Ramones for the first time and hearing London Calling for the first time), I've come to appreciate how well-structured the track is, going beyond just verse-chorus-verse to a perfectly-contained mini-rock-opera that stays completely focused and builds to a completely immaculate peak (the one around the 3-minute-mark, right before the "1-2-3-4/the highway's jammed with broken heroes..."). 9 times out of 10 this personally, for me, beats some snotty kid plonking on the same chords for 2:30, muttering about boredom. Beats it with a tire iron.

Still, I figure that Darkness on the Edge of Town is his best album overall, with '78-'80 being his peak.

(xp: Bruce LPs on used vinyl are like $3-4 each [The River around $6] and definitely key to the experience.)

― What's this place, Biblevania? (natepatrin), Wednesday, 5 January 2005 00:56 (8 years ago) Permalink

I think with that post and that postee, we can safely lock the thread.

But wait...

― Ken L (Ken L), Wednesday, 5 January 2005 01:00 (8 years ago) Permalink

"poster". WTF is a "postee"?

― Ken L (Ken L), Wednesday, 5 January 2005 01:01 (8 years ago) Permalink

there i go, spouting the truth again.
Every word I type is a lie, including "and" and "butt."

― Ken L (Ken L), Wednesday, 5 January 2005 01:02 (8 years ago) Permalink

It's an acquired taste. New York and Long Island radio in the 70s forced me to acquire it.

Where the hell do you think I was during that time period? Your argument holds less water than a rusty colander.

― Alex in NYC (vassifer), Wednesday, 5 January 2005 01:20 (8 years ago) Permalink

And you never made your peace with Bruce? Then I'm afraid this thread isn't going to help you.

Your argument holds less water than a rusty colander.
I think I was going more for a Sieve of Eratosthenes approach.

― Ken L (Ken L), Wednesday, 5 January 2005 01:25 (8 years ago) Permalink

It's not that I had to "make peace" with him. I've never hated Bruce (in the same manner I hate, say, Destiny's Child or Scout Niblett or Bread or that ass monkey who sang "This is How We Do It!"). I just don't understand why people get their internal organs in a clustered fulsome bundle over this music. Like I said, he's a charismatic, interesting enough guy -- but his music just ain't cuttin' it for me. I liked "Atlantic City", I suppose, but nine tenths of his more celebrated catalog is of the same overblown, over-the-top crappy rote bar band sonic lard as this. Rife with cliche. Ugh. I just don't understand how people get so into this stuff.

― Alex in NYC (vassifer), Wednesday, 5 January 2005 01:30 (8 years ago) Permalink

Sometimes you have to hate before you can love- it's the razor's edge.

― Ken L (Ken L), Wednesday, 5 January 2005 01:36 (8 years ago) Permalink

Our ears must not work! (xp)

― What's this place, Biblevania? (natepatrin), Wednesday, 5 January 2005 01:37 (8 years ago) Permalink

I didn't read all of the posts, but Nedless to say, I knew this would be an Alex thread....

I hated Born to Run for years .. only in the last two or three have I decided that it's a pretty good tune except for that horrible, misplaced sax solo. I'm glad my reflexes made me shut it off over the past 20 years, but I kinda like it now - although I would never put it on intentionally.

xpost.. (Ken L is one of my favorite ILM posters these days...)

― dave225 (Dave225), Wednesday, 5 January 2005 01:40 (8 years ago) Permalink

i agree with alex's opening post. I haven't given his earlier stuff much time, mainly cuz I prefer his '80s synth-pop.

― miccio (miccio), Wednesday, 5 January 2005 01:55 (8 years ago) Permalink

Bruce got it wrong and thought a thousand words was worth a picture

― miccio (miccio), Wednesday, 5 January 2005 01:56 (8 years ago) Permalink

I am under the impression people from Jersey disagree

― miccio (miccio), Wednesday, 5 January 2005 01:56 (8 years ago) Permalink

I love the song. I love all his stuff (except the "Human Tough" album). And x-post (probably): who in world considers Springsteen "stripped down?" "Nebraska," yes, but the rest? "No nonsense," I can see that, but "stripped down?" No way. Also, per the Meatloaf comparison, "Bat Out of Hell" enlists most of the E. Street Band. So does "Total Eclipse of the Heart," another Steinman special.

"Trapped" is awesome. As is everything Springsteen did from '78 to '81. Ever heard the song he wrote for Donna Summer, "Protection?" Great great great.

― Josh in Chicago (Josh in Chicago), Wednesday, 5 January 2005 01:58 (8 years ago) Permalink

Bread is so anti-hate, Alex. Love the Bread. The Bread is good. It is warm, and soft, and smells good. Like . . . well, like bread. And who doesn't like bread? If you like bread, how can you hate Bread?

― J (Jay), Wednesday, 5 January 2005 02:02 (8 years ago) Permalink

I only like "Everything I Own" and "Diary"

― miccio (miccio), Wednesday, 5 January 2005 02:05 (8 years ago) Permalink

Ann Powers once noted that Lou Barlow was a lot like the dude from Bread.

― miccio (miccio), Wednesday, 5 January 2005 02:06 (8 years ago) Permalink

What's "Trapped"? because just this morning, Southside Johnny's "Trapped Again" popped into my head. I miss that song, although if I heard it, it would probably only excite me for about 20 seconds.

― dave225 (Dave225), Wednesday, 5 January 2005 02:13 (8 years ago) Permalink

Wait didn't Matos say it was bad?

no.
Alex asked "who enjoys this overproduced crappy glop" and matos answered by raising his hand (I think).

― deej., Wednesday, 5 January 2005 02:14 (8 years ago) Permalink

Oh. I thought he was raising hand to Gear's post that was prior to his, and then fcc raised his hand which I guess was pro too even if equivocal, and you were there too, and you too...

Everything I say on this thread is a lie, including this.

― Ken L (Ken L), Wednesday, 5 January 2005 02:20 (8 years ago) Permalink

― Riot Gear! (Gear!), Wednesday, 5 January 2005 02:22 (8 years ago) Permalink

Lou Barlow WISHES he had as much going on as David Gates.

― J (Jay), Wednesday, 5 January 2005 02:25 (8 years ago) Permalink

alex, face it: you're surrounded by people who like the bruce. they're everywhere. they're in your home, at your work, serving you your morning coffee, checking your gas meter, giving you an eye exam. everywhere. so my advice is to give in to the bruce. give in, and you will find all kinds of doors opening for you.

― Amateur(ist) (Amateur(ist)), Wednesday, 5 January 2005 02:30 (8 years ago) Permalink

Amateur(ist), he's not gonna buy that. Your argument makes mine look like a solid silver spittoon

― Ken L (Ken L), Wednesday, 5 January 2005 02:33 (8 years ago) Permalink

it's not a real argument. i was being silly.

ilm is so testy lately!!!

― Amateur(ist) (Amateur(ist)), Wednesday, 5 January 2005 02:36 (8 years ago) Permalink

it's not a real argument. i was being silly.
I know. I was just trying to pass it along, sorry. Search: James Joyce's "Counterparts."

ilm is so testy lately!!!
Must be all that post-holiday testosterone.

― Ken L (Ken L), Wednesday, 5 January 2005 02:44 (8 years ago) Permalink

I think Rosalita and Blinded By The Light were precursors to Born To Run. They both contained a lot of that excitement of a great writer on the way up. The last one is what made the masses finally sit up and notice. It landed him on the freekin' covers of Time and Newsweek and then he goes and says:

"I wanted to make a record that would sound like Phil Spector. I wanted to write words like Dylan. I wanted my guitar to sound like Duane Eddy". I hated it. I couldn't stand to listen to it. I thought it was the worst piece of garbage I had ever heard. I told Columbia I wouldn't release it. I told 'em I'd just go to the Bottom Line and do all the new songs and make it a live album".

― jim wentworth (wench), Wednesday, 5 January 2005 03:26 (8 years ago) Permalink

but Nedless to say

What, where?

I love me the Frankie version very much. And that is all I will say.

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Wednesday, 5 January 2005 03:29 (8 years ago) Permalink

Wait, wasn't Rosalita on the second album and Blinded By the Light on the first album?

― Ken L (Ken L), Wednesday, 5 January 2005 03:30 (8 years ago) Permalink

xpost:
Nedless in Jerza

― Ken L (Ken L), Wednesday, 5 January 2005 03:30 (8 years ago) Permalink

I always found the Frankie GTH cover rather boringly faithful.

― Alex in NYC (vassifer), Wednesday, 5 January 2005 03:37 (8 years ago) Permalink

xpost

Well, yeah. That's what makes them precursors.

― jim wentworth (wench), Wednesday, 5 January 2005 03:39 (8 years ago) Permalink

I always found the Frankie GTH cover rather boringly faithful.

Bruce's "1-2-3-4" vs. Holly's orgamzogroans.

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Wednesday, 5 January 2005 03:40 (8 years ago) Permalink

Well, hearing "Born To Run" on the radio as a kid...I'd have to say it was a moving song. But somewhere along the way it became like a cliche over a certain number of plays. I can't remember how the Frankie cover sounded, but then I'm not sure I really want to anyone do the song, so...

As a bit of trivia, John Peel mentioned on more than one occaision that he couldn't stand Springsteen, said he had asked for a Peel session and John turned him down. Although I did buy the single of "Hungry Heart" when I was a kid, I must say today I would not be caught dead buying a Springsteen record or listening to one. Also Fiendish, I marvel at how you can rate Dylan worse than Brooce. Not that I'm a big Dylan fan at all, but it does puzzle me.

― Bimble..., Wednesday, 5 January 2005 03:50 (8 years ago) Permalink

Bruce sucks. I have complied an entire list of suckage. It started one day after hearing the Rolling Stones song "Start Me Up" on the radio for like the millionth time. Check it out!

Burned-out Single songs:

Rolling Stones - Start Me Up, Jumpin' Jack Flash
Jimmy Buffet - Margaritaville
Sister Sledge - We Are family
Van Morrison - Brown-Eyed Girl
The Police - Roxanne
Steppenwolf - Born To Be Wild
Led Zeppelin - Stairway To Heaven, Rock-n-Roll
Kool & the Gang - Celebration
Dexy's Midnight Runners - Come On Eileen
Lynyrd Skynyrd - Free Bird & Sweet Home Alabama
Queen - We Will Rock You/We Are The Champions & Bohemian Rhapsody
Roy Orbison - Pretty Woman
George Thorogood - Bad To The Bone
Jimi Hendrix - Purple Haze, Hey Joe, Foxey Lady
Don Henley - Boys Of Summer
Sister Sledge - We Are Family
Derek & The Dominoes - Layla
Bachman Turner Overdrive - Takin' Care Of Business
The Clash - Should I Stay Or Should I Go
Dire Straits - Sultans Of Swing
All covers and remixes of the above songs

Burned-out Groups:

All Village People songs
All James Brown songs
All Motown songs
All Foreigner songs
All Bob Seger songs
All Beach Boys songs
All Boston songs
All Bee Gees songs
All AC-DC Songs
All Doobie Brothers hit songs
All Eagles songs
All Bad Company songs
All Steve Miller Band songs
All Pat Benatar songs

Songs/"Artists" that just plain SUCK!:

Bette Midler - Wind Beneath My Wings (A close 2nd for worst song ever)
Journey (Steve-I'm-such-a-wimp!-Perry ruined this band)
Chicago (Peter-I'm-a-wimp-too!-Cetera ruined the band)
Stevie Nicks (extremely irritating voice & repetitive lyrics)
Celine Dion (we ALL know why)
Bon Jovi (Bad pop music masquerading as hard rock. Just plain despicable!)
Lionel Ritchie (extreme schmaltziness)
Eddie Money (Was this guy a tard?)
Tom Petty (Bland music with chorus lyrics derived from Bartlett's Quotations)
Bruce Springsteen (Bland music with schmaltzy lyrics sung by a man who just stubbed his toe)
David Bowie (Alot of people like him, he's a "legend". I think he sucks!)
Pearl Jam (Bland Alt Rock with unintelligible gravelly lyrics)
Any song with the word "Jump" in the title
Any song with the name "Jane" in the title (EXCEPT Lou Reed's classic "Sweet Jane")
Any song ever played on any "Adult Contemporary" radio station

Worst song ever:
Labelle - Lady Marmalade (extreme screeching and caterwauling)

― Paul Bass, Wednesday, 5 January 2005 14:13 (8 years ago) Permalink

Bloody hell. What do you like?

― stew, Wednesday, 5 January 2005 14:16 (8 years ago) Permalink

Born To Run? More Like Born To Poop!

― Triomphe, Le Chien Qui Insulte N'Importe Qui (Ken L), Wednesday, 5 January 2005 14:17 (8 years ago) Permalink

James Brown? Did your parents hug you?

― David Allen (David Allen), Wednesday, 5 January 2005 14:47 (8 years ago) Permalink

I love Bruce Springsteen,
although not uncritically,
and I love this song.

Paul Bass, you are PUNK
but misguided, cloth-eared, and
corny to the MAXXX

― Haibun (Begs2Differ), Wednesday, 5 January 2005 14:55 (8 years ago) Permalink

It's not so much the music as it is, as Mark puts it, the "over-the-top romanticism". It's the part of me that likes those cheesy montage sequences in 80s movies and that dreams of an impossible America only wide-eyed non-Americans can dream of. The song itself is just a conduit to my cheesiest feelings about life.

Speaking of montage music, "Bonzo Goes To Bitburg" in "School Of Rock" evokes similar feelings for me (leaving aside the debate about the quality difference between the two songs).

― alex in montreal, Wednesday, 5 January 2005 15:01 (8 years ago) Permalink

Rhetorical question: Was "Born to Run" a cliche when it was first conceived, written, performed? Surely part of what makes it sound cliche now is its own presence in the culture, and its subsequent overgloppy clones. I wonder how it would sound to totally fresh ears.

That said, I've always suspected Bruuuuce of being a genius who works on two levels: he knows he can get your garden-variety classic-rock fan to pump his fist in the air and sing drunkenly along to an anthemic chorus. But he also knows that he has some really quite eloquent and crystal-perfect lyrics--a delicacy that some proportion of his fans are missing in their sweaty frenzy.

I have no proof of this, but I think he knows that he's casting pearls before swine a large part of the time. More like irony than condescension: I think he loves the trucker AND the intellectual in equal measure, but in different ways.

Not too long ago I saw a video of him playing live, and I thought I saw a twinkle in his eye that spoke untold volumes. He sang the line "a close band of happy thieves," then looked as if he were thinking, "You know, I just tossed that line off, and it's really apt and articulate. I'm a fucking poet, and half this audience doesn't notice or care. And I'm at peace with that."

Maybe I'm imagining it. Heck, I probably am imagining it. But that's my theory and I'm sticking to it.

― The Mad Puffin, Wednesday, 5 January 2005 15:28 (8 years ago) Permalink

I have to say, apart from Paul Bass' bash on "Lady Marmalade," he's reasonably on the money.

This morning while feeding the offspring breakfast, I was subjected to another moldy Bruce oldie, fuckin' "Tenth Avenue Freeze-out". WILL THE TORTURE NEVER END?

Q104 must have some iron-clad condicle in its by-laws that prevents the station from playing anything recorded after 1982 with the lone exceptions being Nevermind by Nirvana and Achtung Baby by U2.

Supposedly, "Hungry Heart" was written for the Ramones (and fuckin' imagine that!), but Springsteen was convinced to keep it for himself.

― Alex in NYC (vassifer), Wednesday, 5 January 2005 15:30 (8 years ago) Permalink

Addendum: I can hear "Born to Run" or "Rosalita" only a few times a year.

But the less-over-the-top things, like "Atlantic City" or the totally underrated "I'm on Fire" rank among my favorite pieces of music. Much of Nebraska acts as a counterweight to the saxophonic sludge of the rest of Mr. Springsteen's career.

― The Mad Puffin, Wednesday, 5 January 2005 15:34 (8 years ago) Permalink

Alright....."I'm on Fire" is actually pretty okay too. Mad Puffin OTM.

― Alex in NYC (vassifer), Wednesday, 5 January 2005 15:38 (8 years ago) Permalink

Rhetorical question: Was "Born to Run" a cliche when it was first conceived, written, performed?
Rhetorical answer: Ask Minnie Driver.

― dave225 (Dave225), Wednesday, 5 January 2005 15:39 (8 years ago) Permalink

Skipping 298 messages at this point... Click here if you want to load them all.

bruce's mumbling is the best part for me. i don't think his Romanticism would be palatable if it wasn't blunted by the grizzled weight of experience. that kind of writing needs to be grounded in some way by melancholy.

― Treeship, Tuesday, 11 June 2013 03:50 (1 week ago) Permalink

That Clarke track, which I'd never heard, is fine, but it really splits the difference between Bruce and, dunno, Jackson Browne.

― Josh in Chicago, Tuesday, 11 June 2013 03:55 (1 week ago) Permalink

I think I've kind of always wanted Bruce Springsteen to sound more like Jackson Browne so I am digging this. Also reminding me again of the existence of the Hold Steady who did a pretty decent pastiche on "Stuck Between Stations."

― Doctor Casino, Tuesday, 11 June 2013 13:08 (1 week ago) Permalink

Dude! Enunciate!

― copter (waterface), Tuesday, 11 June 2013 13:19 (1 week ago) Permalink

i always figured that mumbling thing was the product of severe underbite + not opening mouth to speak

― Poliopolice, Tuesday, 11 June 2013 14:12 (1 week ago) Permalink

Also, for a belter, Bruce back then was pretty shy. So maybe it was a form of modesty manifesting itself at the wrong time in the wrong song? He opens up his voice more as the song goes on, though.

― Josh in Chicago, Tuesday, 11 June 2013 14:32 (1 week ago) Permalink

I always figured that mumbling thing was the product of Dylan/Van Morrison emulation (and is really the major thing I DO like about "Born To Run.") Like, enunciation was not the thing that made Rolling Stones records rock.

― New Authentic Everybootsy Collins (Dan Peterson), Tuesday, 11 June 2013 14:33 (1 week ago) Permalink

Bruce back then was pretty shy

Think it's fair to say he's overcome it since

― Bees Against Racism (Tom D.), Tuesday, 11 June 2013 14:50 (1 week ago) Permalink

i like his bad vocals and mumbling on this song

― dyl, Tuesday, 11 June 2013 18:35 (1 week ago) Permalink

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