When someone plays a track I like, I sometimes just pull out my phone and buy it on the spot
― ɥɯ ︵ (°□°) (mh), Wednesday, 3 October 2012 17:51 (7 months ago) Permalink
Must admit I've never thought to buy music on my phone. Dumb question but can you transfer it back to your computer after that?
― This Is... The Police (dog latin), Wednesday, 3 October 2012 17:57 (7 months ago) Permalink
Yup. With iTunes it'll automatically download it, if you want it to.
― ɥɯ ︵ (°□°) (mh), Wednesday, 3 October 2012 17:59 (7 months ago) Permalink
Aye, I've done that with stuff on the radio, stuff people have mentioned irl or on here, a song from the Olympic opening ceremony. I may be a CD fan but I'm not a freak.
― comedy is unnatural and abhorrent (Scik Mouthy), Wednesday, 3 October 2012 18:00 (7 months ago) Permalink
I wouldn't trust iTunes with anything tbh. Does it download in mp3 or rubbish m4a?
― This Is... The Police (dog latin), Wednesday, 3 October 2012 18:00 (7 months ago) Permalink
haha
m4a, which is actually a significantly better codec than mp3 and sold without any drm whatsoever?
― ɥɯ ︵ (°□°) (mh), Wednesday, 3 October 2012 18:01 (7 months ago) Permalink
well, it's a container, I mean aac encoding
― ɥɯ ︵ (°□°) (mh), Wednesday, 3 October 2012 18:03 (7 months ago) Permalink
Does that play on non-Apple devices though?
― o. nate, Wednesday, 3 October 2012 18:12 (7 months ago) Permalink
M4a is no good for me as it's incompatible with the version of acid pro I use to make mixes, and that's a really important factor for me.
― This Is... The Police (dog latin), Wednesday, 3 October 2012 18:16 (7 months ago) Permalink
Sure. It's actually the default format for PS3 and a bunch of other platforms. afaik after the drm removal a few years ago, the iTunes store files should play on about anything.
― ɥɯ ︵ (°□°) (mh), Wednesday, 3 October 2012 18:18 (7 months ago) Permalink
AAC is actually the industry standard replacement for mp3, which is pretty long in the tooth.
You'd think Sony would have had aac support in Acid Pro for years, what with their own hardware using it as the standard for a long time
― ɥɯ ︵ (°□°) (mh), Wednesday, 3 October 2012 18:20 (7 months ago) Permalink
I think mine's an old version. Actually maybe since I upgraded to acid 7 I may not have tried m4a on it yet
― This Is... The Police (dog latin), Wednesday, 3 October 2012 19:28 (7 months ago) Permalink
!!!!
ACID Pro 7 software offers increased format support, allowing for more options with media and hardware devices including the PSP®, iPod®, and iPhone®. ACID Pro 7 software also includes the Dolby Digital AC-3 Studio plug-in to export mixes in surround format.
― ɥɯ ︵ (°□°) (mh), Wednesday, 3 October 2012 19:33 (7 months ago) Permalink
this discussion is getting quite confusing, especially since ronan's choosing to ignore a whole bunch of things i've explained in numerous ways already and which I can't be fucked to go over again, but here goes.
if I am then prove it by making one cogent reply that isn't whining because people point out the gaping holes in your swiss cheese theory.
I have plenty of friends who I know listen to good music and are very passionate about it. My key point is that I feel music appreciation is becoming an increasingly marginalised, personalised, insular pastime as a massive part of it now hinges on having to be at a computer or plugged into an ipod which usually takes place alone.
how does an ipod differ from a walkman in this regard? how does a computer differ from a stereo?
Without physical formats to display and swap and get interested in, and without music outlets in which to browse and possibly bond in, many passionate music fans end up having better discussions with online strangers than they would their close friends.
yes, this is your theory, but you have yet to even make one point to prove it or even suggest why the internet would damage people's ability to talk to their friends about music.
Music taste is now shown through one's online profile, reduced to a homogenous list of names and usually not that indicative of the user's true tastes anyway. So yeah, disagree with me if you like, but I can only state from my experiences
why a "homogenous" list? what's "homogenous" about it? please give me some factual answers as to why an online profile contains "homogenous" information as opposed to say, a given individual's opinions or thoughts being likely to be "homogenous".
also how is music taste shown only through online profiles? i can't talk to people about music IRL anymore?
people have already responded to you to say they do discuss music IRL all the time.
this is all total fucking bunkum and you're the one not reading or engaging with responses.
― Know how Roo feel (LocalGarda), Wednesday, 3 October 2012 21:23 (7 months ago) Permalink
also no more whining about "snark" like some beleaguered child - if you want to throw down some mega theory placing yourself as the visionary that sees the homogeneity in the tastes of the masses then take your medicine.
― Know how Roo feel (LocalGarda), Wednesday, 3 October 2012 21:26 (7 months ago) Permalink
Don't mean to put words in his mouth but I think he means simply that the titles, artists, etc, are rendered in a homogenous font/format. Hard to argue with that.
― Clarke B., Wednesday, 3 October 2012 22:01 (7 months ago) Permalink
sharing on social media includes the art and frequently the record too, and the album and 5 more albums if it's via spotify, it's hardly just lists of the names of artists unless you're on friendster in 2001 or something.
a face to face conversation has more potential for homogenous listing of the names of artists, minus the art, and minus the music.
― Know how Roo feel (LocalGarda), Wednesday, 3 October 2012 22:19 (7 months ago) Permalink
Depends if they’ve got the record(s) in question to hand but overall, skimming through the above debate, I’d say Ronan is OTM. And yes I’m biased; without the internet I might never have been inspired to start a blog or write about music in any way, and given the way I was ten years ago it’s no understatement to say that music as experienced and felt through the internet probably saved my life. I wrote CoM, I got married again and got my old life back (only better, learning from previous mistakes etc.) – and none of this would have happened with just my physical “collection” of music at home and my general fucked-up widower state. It’s a medium, just as records etc. before them were a medium, and like any medium it’s as social as the individual listener wishes it to be.
My preferences, answering the original question, are thusly:
CDs: still my main way of getting and listening to music for very simple reasons; I am middle-aged and like the old-fashioned notion of record as tangible artefact and also like having lots of them (spines, etc.) but I’m under no illusion that that’s just the way I like it. Also probably the least fiddly non-online way of finding and playing music.
Vinyl: only really get vinyl if I can’t find the record in any other format, e.g. particularly elusive Then Play Long entries. I don’t have a “fetish” for vinyl as such but neither am I blindly going to knock it (considering the stupid crazy amount of the stuff I actually have); I acknowledge that something like Far Side Virtual is a concept which really could only have worked as a vinyl record.
Online: basically YouTube, MySpace and suchlike. Don’t “rip” CDs and for whatever reason Spotify doesn’t talk to Internet Explorer so I can’t get at it. Yes, iTunes, but I wish actual physical singles hadn’t gone the way of the Sinclair C5 (i.e. now only fetishable “limited edition” 7-inches for £9.99). I like the jumpy nature of random play iTunes though.
― Here he is with the classic "Poème Électronique." Good track (Marcello Carlin), Thursday, 4 October 2012 09:48 (7 months ago) Permalink
new stuff never but on occasion if i'm near a mve with time to spare i'll set myself a little £10 challenge and dig in the r&b/ragga vinyl sale bins just for nostalgia's sake, and that'll be largely for 90s stuff searching for alternate mixes and suchlike that hasnt been digitised somewhere or stuff pertaining to mini projects. probably only 4 or 5 this year
i mean i have a great big discogs wantlist too but when push comes to buy i can never be bothered
someone should really do a second hand shop insisting on selling only stuff pre 2000 cos there is such a vast useless wasteland of 00-05 clogging up the world it's dispiriting
― r|t|c, Thursday, 4 October 2012 10:02 (7 months ago) Permalink
It’s a medium, just as records etc. before them were a medium, and like any medium it’s as social as the individual listener wishes it to be.
yes! this in a nutshell.
― lex pretend, Thursday, 4 October 2012 10:06 (7 months ago) Permalink
hahah I love the wider notion of the years 2000-5 as a "vast useless wasteland" for music!
Less MVEs to be near these days; the Camden one's gone and I don't reckon the Notting Hill Soul & Dance one is long for this world either.
― Here he is with the classic "Poème Électronique." Good track (Marcello Carlin), Thursday, 4 October 2012 10:07 (7 months ago) Permalink
Far Side Virtual is a concept which really could only have worked as a vinyl record.
Why's that? I've only ever heard it on mp3
― This Is... The Police (dog latin), Thursday, 4 October 2012 10:09 (7 months ago) Permalink
actually i did buy a few new hardcore/punk lps as a gift for the missus recently and it was a pretty cool throwback experience... very niche obviously but limited pressings, reasonably priced, worthwhile attention to detail as a desirable object. real ingrained sense in that community that mp3s are meaningless and the physical artefact is still a thing, it's nice
tbh if all my fave little things were pressed on £2.50 7"s like dancehall used to be i might still spend a fair wedge
― r|t|c, Thursday, 4 October 2012 10:11 (7 months ago) Permalink
― Here he is with the classic "Poème Électronique." Good track (Marcello Carlin), Thursday, 4 October 2012 11:07 (3 minutes ago) Bookmark
heh obviously i meant within my narrow little avenue of stuff
perhaps there is a wider point in that that was the era of greatest physical/digital concurrence and thus most disposable stuff but the generalism goes without saying
― r|t|c, Thursday, 4 October 2012 10:17 (7 months ago) Permalink
doglatin xpost:
Hard to sum it up briefly but it's to do with the packaging and the record's general half-backward glancing. I just think it works beautifully as an artefact; on CD it would probably look all cramped and forced. I too listened to it on mp3 prior to buying it and I think the packaging and presentation enhance the record. No scientific idea why that would be the case, though. I wonder if anyone's ever done a study on listening to music and how packaging and presentation affect people's reactions to it (a bit like a recent study where people apparently found travelling by boat or train more of a "journey" than flying; see this article for instance).
― Here he is with the classic "Poème Électronique." Good track (Marcello Carlin), Thursday, 4 October 2012 10:20 (7 months ago) Permalink
> hahah I love the wider notion of the years 2000-5 as a "vast useless wasteland" for music!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Landfill_indie
― koogs, Thursday, 4 October 2012 10:24 (7 months ago) Permalink
don't get Far Side Virtual-as-vinyl-experience even slightly tbh. it has an ipad on the cover!
― please do not post on reddit as reusal often offends (DJ Mencap), Thursday, 4 October 2012 10:29 (7 months ago) Permalink
that said I get the impression Ferraro is p invested in what formats he does and doesn't present his releases on. but anyway
― please do not post on reddit as reusal often offends (DJ Mencap), Thursday, 4 October 2012 10:30 (7 months ago) Permalink
Subtle blend of past and future media innit.
― Here he is with the classic "Poème Électronique." Good track (Marcello Carlin), Thursday, 4 October 2012 10:37 (7 months ago) Permalink
Hard to sum it up briefly but it's to do with the packaging and the record's general half-backward glancing. I just think it works beautifully as an artefact; on CD it would probably look all cramped and forced. I too listened to it on mp3 prior to buying it and I think the packaging and presentation enhance the record. No scientific idea why that would be the case, though. I wonder if anyone's ever done a study on listening to music and how packaging and presentation affect people's reactions to it (a bit like a recent study where people apparently found travelling by boat or train more of a "journey" than flying; see this article for instance).― Here he is with the classic "Poème Électronique." Good track (Marcello Carlin), Thursday, 4 October 2012 11:20 (6 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink
― Here he is with the classic "Poème Électronique." Good track (Marcello Carlin), Thursday, 4 October 2012 11:20 (6 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink
Cool. I'm a big fan of that album as it happens. You've pretty much hit on something I've been trying to express about physical releases here, and yeah I wonder if there is a study (surely there must be?). It's all very well saying "MP3 is a medium same as CD and vinyl" but that's the same thing as saying "boats are a medium same as cars and planes" - there appears to be, for a lot of people a subconscious difference once packaging and presentation comes into play. It happens with food packaging all the time and there have been umpteen trials where people will be given two identical foodstuffs in different packaging to try out and they definitely believe there's a difference. So it's naive to think that appreciation of music isn't affected by the medium on which it's heard.
― This Is... The Police (dog latin), Thursday, 4 October 2012 10:37 (7 months ago) Permalink
I think the packaging and presentation enhance the record. No scientific idea why that would be the case, though. I wonder if anyone's ever done a study on listening to music and how packaging and presentation affect people's reactions to it
We talk about this quite a bit at DRC (two of us work in marketing / design, and one of us did a degree in colour chemistry or something), the idea of a record's sleeve influencing your perception of it. I often think of music in quite synaesthetic terms - a record will sound/feel colourful to me, or monochrome, or whatever, in terms of how I think of the music sounding, and I'm sure that sleeve design is a major factor in this. I think that the John Talabot sleeve has detrimentally affected by perception, and enjoyment, of that record; I think of it as being quite dour tonally, but I suspect other people really don't.
This might sound mental to people, and is probably more fuel to say "well if you will insist on physical media etc etc".
― comedy is unnatural and abhorrent (Scik Mouthy), Thursday, 4 October 2012 10:39 (7 months ago) Permalink
funny you mention that as earlier this morning I stopped myself from buying this EP bcs I didn't feel like I should be spending £9.50 + postage for less than 15 minutes of music when I have vinyl that arrived a few weeks ago I've still not played
I linked to that blog specifically cos it's about a niche punk band w/ a fairly developed aesthetic but also addresses what rtc mentions. you can substitute punk for techno or whatever if you like
― please do not post on reddit as reusal often offends (DJ Mencap), Thursday, 4 October 2012 10:40 (7 months ago) Permalink
t's all very well saying "MP3 is a medium same as CD and vinyl" but that's the same thing as saying "boats are a medium same as cars and planes" - there appears to be, for a lot of people a subconscious difference once packaging and presentation comes into play.
this is a different conversation to the one you've been having. nobody is arguing that there are inherent differences between formats.
nobody is even arguing that there are good things that may eventually be lost due to digital music dominating.
people are arguing with your extremely narrow and unempirical theory about what those things are, and the vaguely expressed argument that somehow nobody discusses music IRL because they are discussing it in FAKEWORLD - THE WORLD OF COMPUTERS WHERE WE ARE ALL ROBOTS.
― Know how Roo feel (LocalGarda), Thursday, 4 October 2012 10:42 (7 months ago) Permalink
*nobody is arguing that there aren't inherent differences between formats
― Know how Roo feel (LocalGarda), Thursday, 4 October 2012 10:43 (7 months ago) Permalink
that was only a tiny part of the wider point which you decided to focus on, ronan. never mind though..
― This Is... The Police (dog latin), Thursday, 4 October 2012 10:46 (7 months ago) Permalink
make a cogent argument or walk away humming the verve to yourself, whatever.
― Know how Roo feel (LocalGarda), Thursday, 4 October 2012 10:46 (7 months ago) Permalink
I'd never seen that John Talabot sleeve before. I always heard it as a white/brown/light green flavoured album.
― This Is... The Police (dog latin), Thursday, 4 October 2012 10:48 (7 months ago) Permalink
funny you mention that as earlier this morning I stopped myself from buying this EP bcs I didn't feel like I should be spending £9.50 + postage for less than 15 minutes of music when I have vinyl that arrived a few weeks ago I've still not playedI linked to that blog specifically cos it's about a niche punk band w/ a fairly developed aesthetic but also addresses what rtc mentions. you can substitute punk for techno or whatever if you like― please do not post on reddit as reusal often offends (DJ Mencap), Thursday, 4 October 2012 11:40 (26 minutes ago) Bookmark
― please do not post on reddit as reusal often offends (DJ Mencap), Thursday, 4 October 2012 11:40 (26 minutes ago) Bookmark
yeah it's funny, the actual amount of music didnt really strike me as a factor and to some extent i found the brevity pretty enjoyable - very twee objet impulse of course but idk it works for that stuff i think when it's so tied to an overarching community scene
doubtless if i spent longer than a couple days' holiday in that mode i would find it a trudge same as anything
i had to laugh though, i was expecting a traverse thru this byzantine undie netherworld and then everything's freely online, takes 20 minutes a piece to listen to, diligently blogged, physical easily obtained if you're quick enough... absolute piece of piss. try having to dig for some proper music sometime you lazy posers :)
― r|t|c, Thursday, 4 October 2012 11:24 (7 months ago) Permalink
(one of the bits i purchased was the crazy spirit lp so much obliged hat tip to you and flops btw)
― r|t|c, Thursday, 4 October 2012 11:25 (7 months ago) Permalink
I listen to most of my music via digital means but still have the weird collectible object addiction.
― ɥɯ ︵ (°□°) (mh), Thursday, 4 October 2012 15:06 (7 months ago) Permalink
recently just got my decks back where i live for first time in 3/4 years. will be buying some vinyl again soon, mainly so i can dj older stuff a bit more easily.
― Know how Roo feel (LocalGarda), Thursday, 4 October 2012 15:11 (7 months ago) Permalink
this just showed up this week and is part of the discussion on this poll (Spotify):
http://www.latimes.com/entertainment/music/posts/la-et-ms-mumford-chart-20121003,0,3864347.story
The music industry has been grappling with the following question for much of the last few years: Do streaming services such as Spotify, which allow users to listen to albums for free, cannibalize sales? Leave it to a banjo-wielding English folk-rock band to provide one very loud answer.
"Babel," the sophomore album from Mumford & Sons released on Glassnote Records last week, has had the biggest debut sales week of 2012, selling approximately 600,000 copies in the U.S., according to Nielsen SoundScan.
That number, revealed Tuesday, bests first-week totals from such A-list pop stars as Justin Bieber and Madonna and did so while being streamed more than 8 million times on Spotify.
Before the release of "Babel," the bestselling debut of 2012 belonged to Bieber's "Believe," which opened with 374,000 copies sold and which has moved a total of 887,000 copies as of last week.
"You're talking about a much different artist," said Dave Bakula, a senior executive for Nielsen. "This is an album-driven artist. They're not going to have one single solitary hit that defines the album. People want everything they can get from this artist, and that's where you get large album sales."
"Babel's" 8 million-plus streams on Spotify are more than three times that of the previous record holder, said Kenneth Parks, Spotify's chief content officer, although Parks refused to reveal the title.
"Our streaming numbers sit alongside a very healthy sales volume," said Parks, whose service boasts more than 15 million worldwide users (Spotify doesn't break out users by territory). "We're living in a new age. There isn't a single model of consumption for recorded music."
Spotify has been criticized for offering lower royalty payments to labels and artists than they'd get from album sales. Other big name artists, such as Mumford & Sons country-mates Coldplay, have opted to withhold new albums from Spotify during the week of release, fearing that the ad-driven free service would hurt sales. Coldplay's most recent album, "Mylo Xyloto," sold 447,000 copies in its first week.
"Spotify is a huge form of exposure, and they're not stealing," said Glassnote Records founder Daniel Glass. "It's retraining people to buy music through streaming services. Could we be getting better compensation? Yes, but I'm not going to hold it back from them. That's old thinking."
Glass credits the band's success, in part, the band's heavy touring schedule. Mumford & Sons, which will headline a sold-out Hollywood Bowl show on Nov. 10, has been playing most, if not all, the songs on "Babel" live for months before its release.
"They were playing some of these songs a year and a half ago," Glass said. "The album became a formality. The fans can take the songs off YouTube, obviously, but they want the produced album."
"So there's still a record business," Glass added. "For now."
― Bee OK, Friday, 5 October 2012 08:15 (7 months ago) Permalink
People making a shit-ton of money from record industry say record industry is healthy, shocker.
― comedy is unnatural and abhorrent (Scik Mouthy), Friday, 5 October 2012 08:28 (7 months ago) Permalink
the name of that article is "Spotify exposure pays off for Mumford & Sons' Babel" so the writer is trying to say that Spotify actually helped sales and that may or may not be true.
― Bee OK, Friday, 5 October 2012 08:30 (7 months ago) Permalink
I think you'd need to do some serious quantitive and qualitative research to prove that Spotify helped make those sales; given that physical album sales were massive concurrently with Spotify streams, I'm not convinced - M&S were already very large, had a big profile built over about 3 years and lots of touring and extensive radio / TV coverage (in the Uk at least); first-week sales for Babel were always going to be large, Spotify or no Spotify. < / social science >
― comedy is unnatural and abhorrent (Scik Mouthy), Friday, 5 October 2012 08:37 (7 months ago) Permalink
who wrote this? what beautiful prose.
― Know how Roo feel (LocalGarda), Friday, 5 October 2012 08:49 (7 months ago) Permalink
MOST MEANS NOT ALL
It's almost English (xp).
― Here he is with the classic "Poème Électronique." Good track (Marcello Carlin), Friday, 5 October 2012 08:50 (7 months ago) Permalink
I had to read it about five times, it disintegrates as you try.
― Know how Roo feel (LocalGarda), Friday, 5 October 2012 08:52 (7 months ago) Permalink
Life is like that, as are most, if not all, things.
― Mark G, Friday, 5 October 2012 12:31 (7 months ago) Permalink