copies and mixes are mere xeroxes compared to the authenticity you get from thumbing through (never touching or picking up, those are barbaric terms) thumbing through faded but still breathing leaves of vinyl and cd
― Know how Roo feel (LocalGarda), Tuesday, 2 October 2012 22:04 (7 months ago) Permalink
I mean "physical music" just doesn't exist, it's not a thing. People just think it is because they happened to have lived at the one brief point in human history when it was necessary to store it physically.
― Matt DC, Tuesday, 2 October 2012 22:10 (7 months ago) Permalink
― Cap'n Hug-a-Thug (The Reverend), Tuesday, 2 October 2012 22:13 (7 months ago) Permalink
no, the commercial album of the 20th century is the high point of humanity's relationship with sound. never has we been at the cusp of such a great decline.
― Know how Roo feel (LocalGarda), Tuesday, 2 October 2012 22:15 (7 months ago) Permalink
see it's even affecting how we write.
the "i buy physical music to help keep favourite artists' bank accounts healthy" argument is very odd when across almost every genre artists agree that they mostly make a living from live performances rather than record sales in any format
― lex pretend, Tuesday, 2 October 2012 22:16 (7 months ago) Permalink
sometimes i feel like i'm in one of those pictures of a person watching themselves watch themselves watch television on a television and we're just having the same thread 10 million times for years and years and years
― farte blanche (upper mississippi sh@kedown), Tuesday, 2 October 2012 22:17 (7 months ago) Permalink
when did these feelings begin? and is the picture a jpg or a hard copy?
― Know how Roo feel (LocalGarda), Tuesday, 2 October 2012 22:25 (7 months ago) Permalink
Some thoughts, not necessarily coherent:
1) I remember when "Home taping is killing music" was a big issue ... but feel sure that home taping actually prompted me to buy more music than I would have done otherwise ... but it does seem like there is a culture of expecting music to be free, at the moment. That Grizzly Bear comment about comparing the price of a CD to a starter seemed pertinent.
2) It's not just how you buy music but where you buy music. I have a £2 rule where I'll buy a CD in my local independent store if it's within a couple of quid of Amazon ... but there are times when I'll buy from where ever is cheapest.
3) I enjoy trawling my CD shelves when drunk in a way that I don't flicking through my computer files.
4) I wonder how much Keiran Hebden made from Pink (download only, more or less) compared to if he'd put out a physical product?
5) I've bought the odd CD - that train announcement on Trunk, say - knowing I'd only play it once but thinking an hour's entertainment for a fiver is sometimes fine.
― djh, Tuesday, 2 October 2012 22:25 (7 months ago) Permalink
I kind of understand that last point -- when compared against other forms of entertainment, music is a bargain. If an album really grows on me or has amazing packaging/liner notes/etc then I'm more willing to seek it out, but it seems like a waste to manufacture, ship, and stock a cardboard sleeve and disc if I'm not that invested in it to begin with. There have been albums that have grown on me and I've actually bought twice, as a download and as a physical release.
― ɥɯ ︵ (°□°) (mh), Tuesday, 2 October 2012 22:38 (7 months ago) Permalink
Somewhere up-thread someone mentioned cherry picking the best tracks from albums and downloading those but this doesn't seem to take into account that the tracks that sound best after one play, five plays, ten plays, twenty plays etc are different and it is often worth pursuing with tracks that initially sound a bit dodge.
― djh, Tuesday, 2 October 2012 22:44 (7 months ago) Permalink
Buying music has been like a drug habit for me since I was a kid, pay day and getting some more new tunes has been the thing for years. I've had a couple years where I didn't go out and get more nearly as much, but it's never stopped. That said, I haven't had the urge to follow what's 'new' much for quite a few years. I tend to get into a certain sound, genre or artist for a while then move to something else. I kind of tend to focus on a few things at a time with intensity in my personal listening. If there is new music tied to it, cool, if not, that is fine.
I'm definitely at 100+ for this year, as I have gotten into a few things I never really listened to with great depth, but I buy quite a bit used.
I might be into the whole mix and trading thing if I knew more people around here that were deep into music. I got friends that really like music, but they usually kind of just like one thing and I might like that one thing, but it's the only think they like and that might not be the main thing i'm checking out at this moment.
― earlnash, Tuesday, 2 October 2012 23:05 (7 months ago) Permalink
used? they are cheaper than mp3s weirdly― Philip Nunez, Wednesday, 3 October 2012 06:29 (3 hours ago)
In Australia new CDs in our biggest chain cost about the same as low-sound-quality DRM files from iTunes
the "i buy physical music to help keep favourite artists' bank accounts healthy" argument is very odd when across almost every genre artists agree that they mostly make a living from live performances rather than record sales in any format― lex pretend, Wednesday, 3 October 2012 08:16 (1 hour ago)
They have to make more of a living from live performance bcz ppl stopped buying records; buying records helps them better recoup advances and actually make money from recording. Touring artist show prices have basically tripled here over the last 8 years as the recording industry has contracted, which then leaves much less discretionary purchasing power for records etc etc.
― ┐(´ー｀)┌ (sic), Wednesday, 3 October 2012 00:39 (7 months ago) Permalink
um whoever itt is arguing that u don't need to purchase music to support artists because they just make music off live shows, if you like the artist you should also pay them for their recorded music i think that is pretty clear-cut whether or not it's a physical release. you can and should also pay for the show, but these two do not preclude each other
― flopson, Wednesday, 3 October 2012 01:09 (7 months ago) Permalink
someone spent money & time making it => you should pay for it
― flopson, Wednesday, 3 October 2012 01:10 (7 months ago) Permalink
As for EOY albums, I keep all new purchases separate from the rest of the collection, as a very visual reminder / guide to what I've bought this year (both new stuff and back catalogue). I filter everything into the stacks on New Years Day; done this for a few years now, and much prefer it to keeping a list anywhere or trying to remember by going through everything. Also gives me a default 'what to listen to niow' pile for when I'm feeling indecisive.― comedy is unnatural and abhorrent (Scik Mouthy), Tuesday, October 2, 2012 3:31 AM (14 hours ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink
― comedy is unnatural and abhorrent (Scik Mouthy), Tuesday, October 2, 2012 3:31 AM (14 hours ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink
Ha, that's been my routine for the past 5 years or so as well.
― musicfanatic, Wednesday, 3 October 2012 01:12 (7 months ago) Permalink
My general routine is to make a playlist of every album I'm interested enough in to check out (I personally use Rhapsody), and out of that list - roughly 400 or so albums a year - I end up buying about 60-80 of my favorite albums on CD.
― musicfanatic, Wednesday, 3 October 2012 01:17 (7 months ago) Permalink
100+ vinyl LPs (almost all $1 or less; none more than $2 I don't think)3 CDs (all $1)0 digital anything
― xhuxk, Wednesday, 3 October 2012 01:18 (7 months ago) Permalink
BUT I still get a ton of physical promos of new music (mostly CD, occasionally vinyl), which I prefer to digital. Get sent even more downloads, probably, which I completely ignore unless I have an actual assignment and no other way to hear something. And I have a free Rhapsody account since I'm their metal editor -- actually free "fantasy" Rhapsody account, which means I can stream lots of additional music that subscribers can't -- which fills most of the other holes for new stuff (and I'll listen to something there rather than downloading it, if possible.)
― xhuxk, Wednesday, 3 October 2012 01:42 (7 months ago) Permalink
"Get sent even more downloads or streams," I guess I mean. Given the choice, would rather stream than download.
― xhuxk, Wednesday, 3 October 2012 01:47 (7 months ago) Permalink
Are a lot of those purchased on a whim, Chuck? Or are those albums ones you've been meaning to buy once you've found them for ~ a dollar?
― musicfanatic, Wednesday, 3 October 2012 02:16 (7 months ago) Permalink
They are ALL purchased on a whim. I guess. At least in the sense that I never go to a store (or garage sale, or record convention) looking for anything in particular. But a lot of them are ones I've wondered about over the decades, if that makes sense. Though sometimes I don't realize I've wondered about them until I see them. And at least a few are by artists I've never even heard of before, but the LP just looks interesting.
― xhuxk, Wednesday, 3 October 2012 02:27 (7 months ago) Permalink
About 95% legitimate purchases, and 0% physical. I'm 380 miles distant from my conventional A/V equipment due to a familial disorders.
― ‽ Interrobang You're Dead ‽ (Sanpaku), Wednesday, 3 October 2012 02:30 (7 months ago) Permalink
I'm all about physical music, but I've been trying to listen to all the classic albums the past two years and the library has allowed me to do that for free...so not too many physical purchases this year. Probably only about 10-12...yikes.
― Tyler Burns (firstname.lastname@example.org), Wednesday, 3 October 2012 04:07 (7 months ago) Permalink
I will say though, I've been getting into cassettes this year. Bought my first hi-fi and I'm looking to get a Walkman Pro.
― Tyler Burns (email@example.com), Wednesday, 3 October 2012 04:08 (7 months ago) Permalink
Not counting a boatload of used crap scored on Amazon and used sections:
18 records, 10 CDs, 5 cassettes, and a 7"
― Mary Ty$ Band (Whiney G. Weingarten), Wednesday, 3 October 2012 04:55 (7 months ago) Permalink
i just found this thread and see that i was the inspiration for it.
anyways, right after all this i went out and bought 8 album. 5 are 2012 releases and the other three are from 2011.
― Bee OK, Wednesday, 3 October 2012 05:03 (7 months ago) Permalink
now going back to read this thread.
― Bee OK, Wednesday, 3 October 2012 05:04 (7 months ago) Permalink
btw, i own around 4,000 CD's and a bunch of vinyl but haven't bought any vinyl in over five years now.
have never purchased a digital download, i want the CD if i'm putting out the money.
― Bee OK, Wednesday, 3 October 2012 05:11 (7 months ago) Permalink
Pretty sure this is zero for me. I'd kind of like to start buying vinyl again (cheap/used stuff), but I don't have a stereo system at the moment.
― Sandy Denny Real Estate (jaymc), Wednesday, 3 October 2012 05:14 (7 months ago) Permalink
But "the real thing" is just packaging really. And mixes are an amazing way to discover new stuff. There are so many ways of discovering music you miss out on if all you do is buy CD albums, so much great music that you never get to hear.
Oh doubtless, but a: I love design and packaging, and b: I have more than enough avenues for discovering new music already, so I don't feel like I'm missing out on anything by not getting mixes. I know this might seem stuck-in-the-mud and illogical, but we're talking about music, art: logic isn't a priority, and I'm hardly a Luddite - I have digital music players and an iTunes library, I rip all my CDs and use them for portability on my iPhone, but at home I like to sit down and put an album on, stand up and browse through the collection rather than sit at a computer and look through a database.
Ronan, you're being pretty unpleasant on this thread. People have different opinions to you and different values to you, that doesn't give you a right to mock and tease them.
Lex, yes artists might make more money through touring, but that's because CDs are selling less, not a reason to not buy them. I also live 180 miles from London and 80 from Bristol: I can't go to gigs to see the artists I like all that often: it's extremely expensive and it takes a lot of time. So I like to buy an album instead.
― comedy is unnatural and abhorrent (Scik Mouthy), Wednesday, 3 October 2012 07:02 (7 months ago) Permalink
There is this thing where mixes usually feature more than one artist..
― blank, Wednesday, 3 October 2012 07:11 (7 months ago) Permalink
I mean, for people with less than enough avenues
― blank, Wednesday, 3 October 2012 07:12 (7 months ago) Permalink
I am aware of that. I have experienced them. I am not saying that they are useless, just that I don't feel I need them.
― comedy is unnatural and abhorrent (Scik Mouthy), Wednesday, 3 October 2012 07:13 (7 months ago) Permalink
― blank, Wednesday, October 3, 2012 12:12 AM (1 minute ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink
― blank, Wednesday, 3 October 2012 07:16 (7 months ago) Permalink
fewer avenues, fuckn grammar cops
― blank, Wednesday, 3 October 2012 07:17 (7 months ago) Permalink
Bit late to the discussion but personally I’ve bought 83 albums this year.
26 new releases on vinyl1 new release on CD29 catalogue albums on vinyl (though this includes a good half dozen LP’s I overlooked from 2011, the rest are mostly reissues)19 second hand records8 catalogue CD’s
To be honest my music buying habits have remained relatively stable over the past decade. Getting into buying vinyl 5 or 6 years ago has resulted in me probably spending more and buying a lot of stuff I already had on CD. Retrospectively I resent that a little but it was a bit of an uncontrollable compulsion at the time. Now I’m a lot more discerning about re-buying albums and tend to do as much research as I can into the source/sound quality before shelling out.
The last couple of years has seen me embracing digital music more than I ever anticipated. I now download anything I buy on vinyl in FLAC. I’m subscribed to Spotify premium which I use a lot as well; mostly on my iPhone although I use it through my Sonos system as well. As a result of that I’m now more likely to listen to an album before I buy it, especially if it’s a band I haven’t really heard before, although I still have that strange ‘hold off ‘till I get a physical copy’ attitude towards releases I’m really looking forward to. Despite embracing digital/computer based music listening I still haven’t paid for a single song or album I’ve downloaded. I tend to justify downloading on the basis that I usually have paid for a physical copy on vinyl already or am going to buy one imminently. I also download a lot of bootlegs and live recordings.
I can’t ever see myself not buying music regularly for many of the positive reasons already discussed although on top of that I buy because it’s one of the ways I identify myself, such a key part of my personality/who I am/all that bullshit.
― Internet Alan, Wednesday, 3 October 2012 08:41 (7 months ago) Permalink
stick to the facts
― Know how Roo feel (LocalGarda), Wednesday, 3 October 2012 08:46 (7 months ago) Permalink
Lex, yes artists might make more money through touring, but that's because CDs are selling less
No it isn't, it's because MUSIC is selling less, you're conflating the issues again. CDs aren't going to return to their 90s sales levels, you might not be able to buy them at all by the time you're in your fifites, mourning them is missing the point. Whether the artists are being fairly remunerated for digital sales, streaming, etc is the core concern. There's nothing inherently worthy or better for the artist in buying a physical object.
Oh doubtless, but a: I love design and packaging, and b: I have more than enough avenues for discovering new music already, so I don't feel like I'm missing out on anything by not getting mixes. I know this might seem stuck-in-the-mud and illogical, but we're talking about music, art: logic isn't a priority, and I'm hardly a Luddite
Serious question, do you listen to non-album based music, or make much of an effort to seek it out? Would you, for example, have heard the material on Four Tet's Pink had it not been released in a handy album-shaped format? I'm saying this because you seem to genuinely enjoy electronic music and yet at least 80% of the best stuff doesn't appear in this format, maybe isn't even written about or talked about, but it does appear on mixes, that's how individual tracks get sold.
Personally I still have a hi-fi separates, big speakers and stuff, I still listen to at least half my music in my living room. It's just it streams directly from my laptop to the stereo. Before that I plugged in my iPod. At some point the need for plastic boxes with usually badly designed little booklets in them just evaporated.
Also, as a side point on the Grizzly Bear thing, how much money are they making compared to, say, mid-80s REM?
― Matt DC, Wednesday, 3 October 2012 08:51 (7 months ago) Permalink
artists also make less money because people have far more choice in terms of what music they buy, unlimited choice. it seems likely now you have more artists making less money.
― Know how Roo feel (LocalGarda), Wednesday, 3 October 2012 09:12 (7 months ago) Permalink
Anyone know about this BBC Playlister thing??http://www.factmag.com/2012/10/03/meet-playlister-the-bbcs-forthcoming-equivalent-to-spotify/
― DJ Mooncup (NickB), Wednesday, 3 October 2012 09:56 (7 months ago) Permalink
Maybe that should be a whole new thread
― DJ Mooncup (NickB), Wednesday, 3 October 2012 09:57 (7 months ago) Permalink
That's definitely a thread in its own right. I'm assuming it'll be old Peel and Maida Vale sessions and so forth, rather than going head-to-head with Spotify.
― Matt DC, Wednesday, 3 October 2012 10:02 (7 months ago) Permalink
No it isn't, it's because MUSIC is selling less, you're conflating the issues again.
Yeah, I should've put 'music' there, not CDs; in terms of fiscal remuneration, I don't care what format people buy stuff on, just that they buy it so that musicians can get paid and keep on making music - CD just happens to be my preferred medium for various reasons and interchanging the terms isn't helping.
Yes, but not masses, and not much of an effort; for a start I like albums qua albums as a convenient unit via which to consume music, as boring and staid as that may be (hence such an effort to get Pink, though I had about half the material already downloaded), and secondly I simply don't have the time I had a few years ago to chase individual tracks or take in everything that people get excited about; dayjob is more demanding and other hobbies are taking up my time.
― comedy is unnatural and abhorrent (Scik Mouthy), Wednesday, 3 October 2012 10:21 (7 months ago) Permalink
why is an album more convenient than a mix?
― Know how Roo feel (LocalGarda), Wednesday, 3 October 2012 10:37 (7 months ago) Permalink
1) I remember when "Home taping is killing music" was a big issue ...
I remember reading this on my dad's album sleeves and trying really hard not to tap my feet because somehow that would ruin the music.
― thomasintrouble, Wednesday, 3 October 2012 10:46 (7 months ago) Permalink
I don't listen to enough mixes. Part of the problem is that I rarely have time to listen to a whole one all the way through as much of my listening is done in short bursts. If the mix is cut up into individual tracks I tend to shy away from putting it on my iPhone because a lot of the time, if I'm just rushing to work, I'll stick the whole library on shuffle and I hate mixed tracks just bursting in mid-sync with the last few notes of the last track fading out. Lame I know. If it's one long mix I'm actually more likely to listen to it, but again I don't feel as though I often have the time to listen to the whole thing in one sitting, and coming back to a mix halfway through feels kind of wrong to me, like stopping a film halfway through. This is highly irrational, I know.
Another annoying thing is I've never worked out how to get a mix or compilation to appear on my iPhone library without it scattering all over the place. I tried to get Immer onto my phone the other day, but it's arranged everything so that rather than being grouped under Michael Mayer, it's all the individual artists in alphabetical order. Fucked if I'm going to sort that mess out.
― This Is... The Police (dog latin), Wednesday, 3 October 2012 10:48 (7 months ago) Permalink
I didn't say it was, I just said that I liked albums. Mixes are mad convenient, but it's not really a culture that I've ever got that involved with so it's not a format / medium I've got used to. Maybe I should change this approach, and perhaps I will, but I'm pretty happy with the avenues for music discovery that I'm using at the moment, in terms of them giving me enough stuff that I like listening to. If that changes, ill find explore new avenues.
― comedy is unnatural and abhorrent (Scik Mouthy), Wednesday, 3 October 2012 11:07 (7 months ago) Permalink
I've bought maybe 15 CDs this year, a similar number of digital releases (mostly 12"s and singles) and I think 0 vinyl. Definitely less than pre-Spotify (I peaked around 50 CDs a few years ago when I finally got a real job). These days I mostly buy physical albums that aren't on Spotify and aren't available noticeably cheaper as Boomkat/Amazon mp3s. If there's an album I really love I'll buy it even if it is on Spotify (recently: Julia Holter and Josephine Foster), both to "thank" the artists and for after the apocalypse when there's no Internet and just a communal CD player that tells dirty jokes and washes the dishes.
― fish frosch (seandalai), Wednesday, 3 October 2012 11:10 (7 months ago) Permalink
best way is to make a playlist and add in the tracks in order.
have to say the vast bulk of my new music listening is mixes. then i listen to older things (about 50 per cent of my listening) and albums via spotify.
i listen to mixes a lot while running but also at work i find they are a good way to shut out the office. albums and jazz and stuff like that i generally listen to in the evenings at home.
― Know how Roo feel (LocalGarda), Wednesday, 3 October 2012 11:11 (7 months ago) Permalink