What's The Deal With Saul Williams?

Black History Month
Convict Colony
Tr(n)igger
Sunday Bloody Sunday
Break
NiggyTardust
DNA
WTF!
Scared Money
Raw
Skin of a Drum
No One Ever Does
Banged and Blown Through
Raised to be Lowered
The Ritual

Tr(n)igger

ok now he's just playin'

i understand where dude is coming from with this flipping-stereotypes shit or whatever but i think when you crew with the dude from nine inch nails & set it up so your album is gonna be heard by like 99.9% white dudes (instead of just the usual 90%) theres some kinda responsibility to cool it with the ironic bamboozled shit

don't try to stop the musical miscenegation, ethan! sasha fere-jones's beautiful dream is coming to life!

i understand where dude is coming from with this flipping-stereotypes shit or whatever but i think when you crew with the dude from nine inch nails & set it up so your album is gonna be heard by like 99.9% white dudes (instead of just the usual 90%) theres some kinda responsibility to cool it with the ironic bamboozled shit

ethan at the risk of getting ultra-flamed by you I don't think it's your place to school a black artist on how to represent himself - hate if you gotta hate, whatever, but when a white writer starts telling a black artist what his community responsibilities are...shit man I can't see you putting up with that from somebody else!

nb I don't know Saul Williams from Adam and will probably never hear his music

its not my place to tell saul williams who to collab with but dropping 2 records in the last 2 years where the music is masterminded by dorky white dudes & both have the word 'nigger' in the title is kinda

-- and what, Thursday, October 25, 2007 2:57 PM (20 minutes ago) Bookmark Link

ilxor Saul Williams

and wtf man you seem to have no problem being a white dude telling black artists what their community responsibilities are in every rap thread no matter how tedious or self-parodic it gets

ethan at the risk of getting ultra-flamed by you I don't think it's your place to school a black artist on how to represent himself I'm going to post something

:P

Roots Manuva - Run Come Save Me (Britain) Vs Saul Williams - Amethyst Rock Star (America)

:)

By the way, Saul is pimpin' the album too, I just happened to see that nin.com page first.

http://www.saulwilliams.com forwards to the new album site.

http://niggytardust.com/saulwilliams/moreinfo :

My Dearest Friends and Fans,

It is my greatest honor to present to you The Inevitable Rise and Liberation of NiggyTardust!,
my new album produced by Trent Reznor and mixed by Alan Moulder. The wall of sound that we've created is tagged with such graffiti that a passerby would seek out doors and ways to ENTER. Once inside a world defined by dreams come true they'd find aligned with the simplest act of sharing what we treasure. Most people aren't aware of the world of art and commerce where exploitation strips each artist down to nigger. Each label, like apartheid, multiplies us by our divide and whips us 'til we conform to lesser figures. What falls between the cracks is a pile of records stacked to the heights of talents hidden from the sun. Yet the energy they put into popularizing smut makes a star of a shiny polished gun. The ballot or the bullet for Mohawk or the mullet is a choice between new times and dying days. And the only way to choose is to jump ship from old truths and trust dolphins as we swim through changing ways. The ways of middlemen proves to be just a passing trend. We need no priests to talk to God. No phone to call her. And when you click the link below, i think it fair that you should know that your purchase will make middlemen much poorer...

NiggyTardust!

love,

Saul

wow thats even stupider than i expected

Most people aren't aware of the world of art and commerce where exploitation strips each artist down to nigger. Each label, like apartheid, multiplies us by our divide and whips us 'til we conform to lesser figures.

hating shitty boho spoken word rap-rock = apartheid

He'll gladly reply on his forum if you want him to:

http://www.saulwilliams.com/cgi-bin/ubb/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=2;t=002301;p=1#000014

The Inevitable Rise and Liberation of NiggyTardust! is the lovechild of me and Trent Reznor. I met Trent when he asked me to fill the opening slot of his European With Teeth tour. After only the 2nd show he asked if I might be down to collaborate on a song or album, whatever I saw fit. At the time we were both listening to the Kanye/Jon Brion collaborations and feeling like a cocktail of our two worlds would fare even more interesting…and harder. Since then, Trent Reznor has become the big brother I never had, offering his insight, expertise, and shared desire to fuck up the system while believing fully in the power of music and the intelligence of the masses. What we both first realized we had in common was a deep love of Public Enemy and their Bomb Squad production, which personally served as the backdrop of my adolescence and fueled the fire that matured my vision of the sort of artist I wanted to be. A lot of people get caught up on my lyrics and poetry, but my writing is always founded on beats and polyrhythmic backdrops. My background as a dancer (I used to dance for a rap group in ATL in the early 90s) has always made me crave hard rhythms. Through Public Enemy I discovered that my ability to dance somehow improved when I truly felt the power of the words. This album captures everything I have aimed for in a song. Of course, as a performer, what truly inspires me is the opportunity to perform them live. The Niggytardust concept sets me free to do more on stage with costume, etc. than one might expect from a regular Saul Williams show. It allows me to put my theatre training to use. I’ve also thought long and hard about all the discussion surrounding racial epithets etc. and chose this title as a means of furthering the dialogue while also showing how creativity will outlive and outshine hatred of any kind.

The album would not have been possible without the collaborative spirit Trent and the other artists involved: CX Kidtronik and Thavius Beck brought beats and fire to the vision, energizing the process with blown amps and head-nodding cramps. Atticus Ross engineered and programmed. Alan Moulder is sonic testimony from headphone to full blown that the very rocks will cry out if you work with the right engineer.

I’m also collaborating with visual artists and designers as part of the whole NiggyTardust concept and presentation. Melody Ehsani designed Tardust jewelry, bracelets, rings. necklaces, etc. and also did the cover layout. Angelbert Metoyer has contributed greatly to the visual aesthetic with paintings and soon to be finished set design for the shows.

As far as the way we’ve decided to release the album, we’re aware that it’s pretty risky, but are even more aware that we cant turn to the so-called powers that be of the industry for answers. Someone has got to be willing to take chances. I was very inspired by the recent Radiohead release and felt compelled, almost instantly, to follow my gut and expand on their concept. Obviously, independent artists have been around for years. My indie film, Slam was in fact what opened so many doors for me. yet, the stigma of being an indie artist in the music world hasn’t always been rewarding. This time I feel different. I feel like the times have conspired to make this album an important part of history.

Whiney otm

e I had a feeling you wouldn't be hearing me and would just try to flip it and get mad, so whatever, be mad

aint not mad johnny d just sayin a) i pre-empted your criticism & b) you call out rappers for shit all the time, why is it suddenly an issue w/ you now??

We're really getting sidetracked from the real issue here, the use of the phrase "tard" in the album's title is pretty insensitive.

^^ shipley stealing PC-gone-mad jokes from britishers??

I'm specifically saying "white people don't get to tell black people how to present their own blackness" - I do think men can tell men to back off the misogyny, because while race & gender cross streams at plenty of places, they're different, and I think if you wanna argue that the stuff I'm calling "misogynist" is an essential part of representing blackness or is somehow inextricable from racial power relations, that'd be getting into some really shaky ground

you know what I mean? do you think I'm completely out of line to throw a flag on a white critic calling out a black artist for his associations with white producers?

Haha I think the only adequate approach to take here is that of Cocorosie's psychologist, who would say that while it's not prohibited for white singers to say "nigger," it is (shall we say) "very very interesting" that one would choose to put it in the song, then have to sing it to groups of people every third night for the next few years, then trade your drum loops for beatboxing from your black backing band (haha then get quoted in infamous "Kill Whitey" article), all leading up to a general chin-scratching steeple-fingered "very interesting, Cocorosie, you are very interested in black people."

-- nabisco, Wednesday, March 28, 2007 4:54 PM (6 months ago) Bookmark Link

During the first Lollapalooza tour, Jane's Addiction brings out Ice-T to perform a rendition of Sly & the Family Stone's "Don't Call Me Nigger, Whitey (Don't Call Me Whitey, Nigger)". Perry Farrell sings the white part, Ice-T sings the Black part. Black quartet Living Colour comes onstage afterward and bandleader Vernon Reid announces "I'll never be anyone's nigger for entertainment..."

^^ from that big ego trip book

from Saul's forum post I just quoted:

"I’ve also thought long and hard about all the discussion surrounding racial epithets etc. and chose this title as a means of furthering the dialogue while also showing how creativity will outlive and outshine hatred of any kind."

This isn't the guy you want to attack concerning race stuff, folks.

nobody's 'attacking' saul williams here - i dug 'twice the first time' and slam, hated his rock-rap bullshit, and only said his pattern of album naming here is 'suspect'

xpost OTM

He's probably thought about anything that anyone can say in this thread like 800 times over.

His rap-rock stuff is great!

calling someone's actions 'suspect' is not the same as attacking him, note the use of quotes

I imagine this album will sound a lot like El-P's album.

The real issue here is that Saul is hit and miss on his best day and Trent is miss and miss on everything in the last ten years or so.

Back of envelope math predicts a 75% suck ratio.

Still worth $5?

xposts

ok ok, I take that "attack" back - I should have used another verb.

I'd like a little spoon of ice cream before I buy the whole cone.

He'll probably put up some samples on that "spread the word" channel they're asking people to link to:

http://niggytardust.com/saulwilliams/spreadtheword

it's worth $5 to me just to support what they're doing, but even though i like trent he produced one of the worst tracks on saul's last record. basically i hope it doesn't sound like an el-p album!

http://emynd.blogspot.com/2005/07/its-new-day-and-better-day-is-coming.html

well his new album is pretty much a rock album. albeit one which acknowledges the existence of rhythm.
-- The Lex (The Lex), Tuesday, 26 April 2005 21:11 (2 years ago) Link

ban sasha frere jones the plagiarist.

i don't like the catchdubs mix, if only because saul's shit sounds worse than it does over his own beats

at least sasha didnt say genre divisions were 'apartheid' that 'strip each artist down to nigger'

haha no i was joking that sfj plagiarized lex. carry on.

very clever

i try my best.

http://emynd.blogspot.com/2005/07/its-new-day-and-better-day-is-coming.html

-- and what, Thursday, October 25, 2007 7:58 PM

Was this an indication of approval or disapproval?

trust dolphins

I'm willing to give this a chance- I like the Kill Memory Crash remix of one of his tracks, at least- but the video on his Myspace (scroll down)? Uh...

and wtf man you seem to have no problem being a white dude telling black artists what their community responsibilities are in every rap thread no matter how tedious or self-parodic it gets

-- and what, Thursday, October 25, 2007 12:19 PM (Thursday, October 25, 2007 12:19 PM) Bookmark Link

"and wtf"

Fuck. I have no use for Saul Williams, but same as that other act I have no use for, it's free, so why the hell not. And I like Rez sometimes. And I liked parts of that El-P album that this might sound like, so again, why the hell not.

you could just spent $5 on a used 12" of puffy's victory with nin remix

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dqg0Zl8tDuI

in 2 consecutive posts Simon H. made me think "maybe I do want to hear this album" and then "ok, maybe not."

Hey, this is actually pretty g-

"Hail Mary, Mother of God / Got your whole host of angels shuffling on my iPod"

WHAT

OW (MY BRAIN)

I'm pleasantly surprised by this album.

"the cover of sunday bloody sunday..."

quite awful i thought.

half the album is quite awful in fact. a lot of the industrial/rockier elements just sound really corny.

ok ok, I might be wrong. :-)

a) no one should cover U2

RONG

counterpoint:

http://i23.photobucket.com/albums/b351/MrClivver/SH105417s.jpg

^ on point

It's a good record
I like the music and words
Hello all you guys

It's a strange time to be an artist in the recording business. It's pretty easy to see what NOT to do these days, but less obvious to know what's right. As I find myself free from the bloated bureaucracy of major labels, finally able to do whatever I want... well, what is that? What is the "right" way to release records, treat your music and your audience with respect and attempt to make a living as well? I have a number of musician friends who are either in a similar situation or feel they soon will be, and it's a real source of anxiety and uncertainty.
I'd like to share my experience releasing Saul Williams' "The Inevitable Rise and Liberation of NiggyTardust" and what I've learned from the process. Perhaps by revealing of all our data - our "dirty laundry" - we can contribute to a better solution.

A quick history: Saul makes a great record that I produce. We can't find the right home at a major label. We decide to release it ourselves, digitally. Saul does not have limitless financial resources so we shop around for a company that can fulfill our needs. We choose Musicane because they are competent and are willing to adapt to what we want. The results are here: niggytardust.com

We offer the entire record free (as in totally free to the visitor - we pay bandwidth costs) as 192 MP3s, or for $5 you can choose higher fidelity versions and feel good about supporting the artist directly. We offer all major CCs and PayPal as payment options.
Here's what I was thinking: Fans are interested in music as soon as it's available (that's a good thing, remember) and usually that's a leak from the label's manufacturing plants. Offering the record digitally as its first appearance in the marketplace eliminates that problem. I thought if you offered the whole record free at reasonable quality - no strings attached - and offered a hassle free way to show support that clearly goes straight to the artists who made it at an unquestionably low price people would "do the right thing". I know, I know...
Well, now I DO know and you will too.

Saul's previous record was released in 2004 and has sold 33,897 copies.

As of 1/2/08,
154,449 people chose to download Saul's new record.
28,322 of those people chose to pay $5 for it, meaning:
18.3% chose to pay.

Of those paying,

3220 chose 192kbps MP3
19,764 chose 320kbps MP3
5338 chose FLAC

Keep in mind not one cent was spent on marketing this record. The only marketing was Saul and myself talking as loudly as we could to anybody that would listen.
If 33,897 people went out and bought Saul's last record 3 years ago (when more people bought CDs) and over 150K - five times as many - sought out this new record, that's great - right?
I have to assume the people knowing about this project must either be primarily Saul or NIN fans, as there was very little media coverage outside our direct influence. If that assumption is correct - that most of the people that chose to download Saul's record came from his or my own fan-base - is it good news that less than one in five feel it was worth $5? I'm not sure what I was expecting but that percentage - primarily from fans - seems disheartening.
Add to that: we spent too much (correction, I spent too much) making the record utilizing an A-list team and studio, Musicane fees, an old publishing deal, sample clearance fees, paying to give the record away (bandwidth costs), and nobody's getting rich off this project.

But...
Saul's music in in more people's iPods than ever before and people are interested in him. He'll be touring throughout the year and we will continue to get the word out however we can.

So - if you're an artist looking to utilize this method of distribution, make of these figures what you will and hopefully this info is enlightening.

Best,
TR

DLed this for free; have listened to it once and am not that fussed to again. Is it just me or does Saul's singing voice sound very Reznoresque all of a sudden?

My mates got a spare ticket to see him in Hoxton tonight so I'm going along. Don't really know what to expect from him live. I like Amethyst Rock Star, but haven't really been into much he's done since aside from the odd tune.

So, he's got a VERY compelling stage presence and seems like a nice, funny guy. Tight band also. However, they only played new songs, most of which didn't seem great.

Almost the best part was in the encore, when he did Coded Language acappella and totally killed it. Then said "I don't know what any of that means".

http://blog.amtrak.com/amtrakresidency/