They're Remaking 'Alien' -- the 'Prometheus' thread

Anyone else notice the giant squid thingy, when it attached to the engineer, looked like a less-insectoid GIANT facehugger?

That was the idea, surely.

Well, when you put it that way, yes I do sound like a simpleton

avatar wasn't that bad

Let's not argue the point until we're blue in the face. #killme

ha

omg ned

avatar wasn't that bad

it wasn't that good either

I still haven't seen this, but the "Oh it's not a prequel" talk sounds so silly. Like if they made the Star Wars prequels the exact same, just renamed the characters and said "this takes place 1000 years before Star Wars, in a different galaxy.

50 Stars of Grey

xpost Quartermass and the Pit is out of print? Maybe I'll sell my copy!!!

tonally the phantom menace is so diff from star wars that that doesn't sound like such a bad idea

xxps

a certain tone found in both:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gAafHAQkHm8

i dunno--maybe i missed some things but i didnt get a "humans are special" vibe from the movie. kinda felt that idea was part of what led them into that death trap. almost a freudian death-drive kinda thing. and that the closing "that's why I'm human and you're not" (or whatever it was) seemed far more ambiguous to me than reaffirming the audience's faith in their own humanity.

...Charles Peirce has a line about Ecclesiastes along the lines of "we do not know whether god bears us love or hatred" and I dug that same idea about this movie.

...I was also reminded of a bit from tarkovsky's "Solaris" along the lines of "man needs man"--meaning our search into the cosmos is merely looking for ourselves. Kinda loved how that plays out in this movie.

― ryan, Wednesday, June 13, 2012 11:00/11:15/11:38 AM (2 hours ago)

i'll toss my hat in the ring and say i totally dug this movie. not a perfect film by any means, but pretty shocked to see such a negative reaction online. it was simply gorgeous, for one thing; also, that perpetua essay seems waaaay off the mark considering what a quasi-prequel this is

― Nhex, Wednesday, June 13, 2012 11:43 AM (2 hours ago)

it seems to me that these are the two most viable defenses: (paraphrasing) "there are some interesting ideas involved," and "it's really cool-looking."

the problem for me is that these arguments consider only the film's superficial costuming, the skin of its cinema and themes. fwiw, i agree on both counts. the production design and special effects are cool as hell. i love the idea that man might be doomed by his search for self-knowledge; that even if a creator does exist, we might mean nothing to it.

but that's it. the potentially intriguing themes don't arise naturally out of credible characters and an independently interesting narrative. instead, they're carelessly draped over a haphazard pile of names and "stuff that happened" in the apparent hope that they can substitute for coherent storytelling. they can't. what results is gibberish posing as profundity. and the spectacular visuals never really struck me as beautiful or "gorgeous". they're too artistically generic for that. though they're a good deal darker, stranger and, well, more alien than what we saw in avatar, they're similarly impersonal.

a dumb movie wrapped up in a skin of potentially interesting ideas is not a smart movie. and a billion-dollar heap of pretty/spooky special effects doesn't excuse moronic characterization and plotting. perhaps if the movie had been a bit more abstract and artful in general, i'd be willing to forgive the apparent idiocies and poor narrative construction, but this isn't a stylized aesthetic indulgence - it's a brain-dead, piece-of-shit would-be blockbuster.

yeah enjoyment of this movie might be how much you're willing to accept.

perhaps if the movie had been a bit more abstract and artful in general, i'd be willing to forgive the apparent idiocies and poor narrative construction, but this isn't a stylized aesthetic indulgence - it's a brain-dead, piece-of-shit would-be blockbuster.

this makes no sense to me

i would like to agree with contenderizer that the argument that a movie has cool "themes" doesn't really have any bearing on whether it's any good or not, while at the same time pointing out that that argument basically constituted his defence of avatar.

http://24.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m5j8cd15He1rt52f4o1_400.gif

lolol

complaining about this movie diminishing Alien is so stupid

losing the sense of mystery from its world is something of a blow. despite high production values and ridley scott stamp of approval i'm trying to tell myself this is just some random fools interpretation and extension of the mythos and it is NOT CANON.

space jockey you are not a scooby doo villain and i still <3 you, you big biomechanical elephant trunked freak.

you know the scooby doo engineers weren't even big enough by half. i've got a picture of giger right next to the original space jockey model and its head is more than twice as big as his - and in the scene the crew were actually kids in spacesuits, to make it seem even larger.

really this handwringing? the introduction of a freaking queen did more to diminish ALIEN than anything in PROMETHEUS

afaic there is no canon. ALIEN exists on its own and the poor saps aboard the Nostromo will be no better off when they encounter that utmost Other than they were before we knew (rather than merely suspected) that the Space Jockey was wearing a flight suit.

xpost -- Well maybe that's why that space jockey was on his own, he was the big freak everyone made fun of in school.

"I'll show them! I'm going to run away and get some of those eggs from my cousin's science project and bring them back and THEN they'll see! Oh fuck I'm out of fuel. *coughs* God I feel shitty."

lol

The first series of Alien comics from Dark Horse could have been a decent movie/TV series... I especially like this part:

A scientific corporation has acquired an alien Queen, and begins harvesting eggs. A weird cult that believes the Aliens to be God's spiritual rebirth breaks in and they all give themselves up for facehugging. Earth is overrun.

any excuse to post this guy again
http://images.wikia.com/avp/images/c/cc/Alien-Jockey4.jpg

so bummed out the engineers don't actually have elephant faces. inexcusable!

If they did David could make some heffalumps and woozles joke right before his head got ripped off.

sadly enough, Prometheus is probably accurate on that score

In the comics, the Jockey is shown to have an elephantine trunk. This is inconsistent with the original concept. An inspection of the concept art done by H.R. Giger, shows that the "trunk" is supposed to be an air hose and there is a helmet surrounding the Jockey's head. This is also supported by the fact that soft tissue such as elephant trunks do not fossilize. This does not leave out the possibility of a different kind of trunk, but the one depicted in the comics is very much like an elephant's. None of the works depicting the Jockey with a "trunk" are considered canon - the only canon appearance of the Space Jockey is in Alien and its novelization and directly related works.

THEN GIVE ME A DIFFERENT KIND OF TRUNK

i hope this is like star trek, showing how the young version of the original alien learned how to become the alien he is today

― s1ocki, Thursday, May 28, 2009 2:03 PM (3 years ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

also i hope it is set at alien academy

― s1ocki, Thursday, May 28, 2009 2:03 PM (3 years ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

was i basically correct about this?

SPACE TRUNK

Isn't that a Parliament album

The more I think about Prometheus, and remember the first and deeply shitty Alien vs Predator film, the more I realise Prometheus didn't even do much that was new. Substitute engineers for Predators, and put the pyramids on Earth rather than LV 223 and you have most of the same (dumb Erich von Daniken) ideas in both films, plus dying Weyland is also in both.

Perhaps the space jockey is really a fossilized Snuffleupagus.

http://25.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m5kw49te421qk2jwqo1_500.jpg

In the comics, the Jockey is shown to have an elephantine trunk. This is inconsistent with the original concept.

i dispute this reading from ALIEN SPECIES WIKI. Concept art below, there's no obvious way of telling what is creature and what is suit - which is the whole damned point of biomechanicalism anyway.

http://i144.photobucket.com/albums/r198/adwendakon/Giger/AlienPilot.jpg

they might have been referring to this

http://www.museumsyndicate.com/images/3/20287.jpg

of course it may have just been the fashion to wear the trunk over the shoulder that season

prometheus < alien 4 < alien 3 < aliens < alien < giger

not sure where AvP fits in that scheme

the offensive shit-ness of this movie is making me nostalgic for the whimsical french shit-ness of alien resurrection

yup

"perhaps if the movie had been a bit more abstract and artful in general, i'd be willing to forgive the apparent idiocies and poor narrative construction, but this isn't a stylized aesthetic indulgence - it's a brain-dead, piece-of-shit would-be blockbuster."

this makes no sense to me

― Fas Ro Duh (Gukbe), Wednesday, June 13, 2012 3:22 PM (3 hours ago)

i mean that if the whole had been more satisfying on an artistic level, then the poor acting & characterization, nonsensical plotting and goofy spiritual pondering might have been more tolerable - might even have contributed some interesting texture to the whole. but it didn't engage me any more as a work of art than as a piece of pop entertainment (if that distinction can be sustained). it's not stalker or suspiria or even fantastic planet.

i would like to agree with contenderizer that the argument that a movie has cool "themes" doesn't really have any bearing on whether it's any good or not, while at the same time pointing out that that argument basically constituted his defence of avatar.

― brony ver (s1ocki), Wednesday, June 13, 2012 3:25 PM (3 hours ago)

my defense of avatar was basically that i enjoyed it. simplistic and rehashed as it was, cameron knows how to tell a story cinematically. he establishes character and context efficiently, builds narrative arcs that make sense and pay off, understands pacing and tension, knows how to generate emotional effects, etc. the "cool themes" part was secondary, though the conversation bogged down in a long argument about that.

it's not stalker or suspiria or even fantastic planet.

i did basically enjoy prometheus because it was a little bit of all these things to me!

that's cool. i might like it more on a second pass, but i don't know that i'll ever get over the disappointment (verging on betrayal, silly as that sounds). expectations are a curse.

Demanding quality from science fiction is bizarre. Real sci fi fans embrace the shitness

fantastic planet? surely you mean forbidden planet?

oh no no any space jockey prequel should be a lot more like fantastic planet than forbidden planet

fantastic planet is basically like the seventies made a movie about itself starring its favorite drugs