pitchfork is dumb (#34985859340293849494 in a series.)

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it's possible to do it without the result being embarrassing and terrible, it's just really rare. especially with that kind of wordcount.

some dude, Thursday, 31 May 2012 19:31 (2 years ago) Permalink

brad laner was just here on ilm responding to ned's p-fork medicine review. i think it's fine to respond if you feel so inclined, but i do think it's kinda lame that p-fork holds such weight these days that it feels like a make-or-break review for artists.

tylerw, Thursday, 31 May 2012 19:33 (2 years ago) Permalink

i feel like it's just something people say without examining why they're saying it. again, i realize there's a huge capacity for self-embarrassment there, but a musician is already writing recording and publicizing songs about their personal feelings and lives so what else have they got to lose.

congratulations (n/a), Thursday, 31 May 2012 19:34 (2 years ago) Permalink

Yeah, I actually fully disagree with you, aero. It's so obviously nagl but I think it's forgiveable, pardonable. And calling somebody an amateur? Dude states in his blog post that he and his band hold down temp work to make music, i.e. amateurs

poxen, Thursday, 31 May 2012 19:34 (2 years ago) Permalink

it kinda IS a make-or-break thing for bands like the Fleet Foxes dude though.

(xpost)

heated debate over derpy hooves (jon /via/ chi 2.0), Thursday, 31 May 2012 19:34 (2 years ago) Permalink

Yeah, I actually fully disagree with you, aero. It's so obviously nagl but I think it's forgiveable, pardonable. And calling somebody an amateur? Dude states in his blog post that he and his band hold down temp work to make music, i.e. amateurs

that's not actually what "amateur" means

that is a weird thing to bring up over lean cuisine (DJP), Thursday, 31 May 2012 19:35 (2 years ago) Permalink

yeah, and fleet foxes "made it" already. with lots of help from pitchfork.

some dude, Thursday, 31 May 2012 19:36 (2 years ago) Permalink

p-fork holds such weight these days that it feels like a make-or-break review for artists

Maybe not with listeners, but certainly with promoters and publicists

poxen, Thursday, 31 May 2012 19:36 (2 years ago) Permalink

@ DJP. I think you're a member of AFM? If you are, you have to answer the question "Do you rely upon music for the majority of your income Y/N" and if it's Y, you are considered professional and are eligible, and if it's N, you are considered amateur and are not.

Lol at self for citing AFM as being anything other than "a source of terrible evil" but I'm 'splaining myself

poxen, Thursday, 31 May 2012 19:38 (2 years ago) Permalink

the fleet foxes dude thing was remarkable in its butthurtedness

link pls?

diamonddave85, Thursday, 31 May 2012 19:38 (2 years ago) Permalink

xxp yeah i mean if ned had been like "10.0 medicine was the greatest shoegaze band ever better than mbv," that'd be a huge thing for them probably. just weird to have one publication carry that responsibility.

tylerw, Thursday, 31 May 2012 19:39 (2 years ago) Permalink

I am not a member of AFM, no

that is a weird thing to bring up over lean cuisine (DJP), Thursday, 31 May 2012 19:40 (2 years ago) Permalink

you lucky bastard

poxen, Thursday, 31 May 2012 19:41 (2 years ago) Permalink

to be fair to the FF dude, this sentence from the pitchfork review is fucking horrific

The arrangements entertain a rhythmic stiffness that sticks strictly to the beat, without any syncopation to suggest the messy experiences Tillman’s lyrics evoke.”

Mr. Que, Thursday, 31 May 2012 19:41 (2 years ago) Permalink

plus it's not like most of the bands that Pitchfork reviews make any real money, so I doubt they really care much about their image or whatever; if you feel like it, do it

frogbs, Thursday, 31 May 2012 19:42 (2 years ago) Permalink

i think it's a risky move but one i'd like to see more musicians take on.

lol how is it risky? everybody does it now because via twitter & facebook & then they get immediate tonguebaths from the fanbase on their walls. then they RT the backscratching. it is pathetic.

it's true that one could, conceivably, reply briefly and wittily to criticism, but it's really just sad to rush to the public with your outraged!! response to a review. if you can't bear for people to "misunderstand" your art (i.e., to not agree with you about it), then you are probably better off keeping it to yourself.

cosi fan whitford (underrated aerosmith bootlegs I have owned), Thursday, 31 May 2012 19:42 (2 years ago) Permalink

because above

cosi fan whitford (underrated aerosmith bootlegs I have owned), Thursday, 31 May 2012 19:43 (2 years ago) Permalink

Tillman / FJM (ex-Fleet Foxes dude) was railing against P-Fork and their fest even before they reviewed his album. He just enjoys taking the piss.

Simon H., Thursday, 31 May 2012 19:45 (2 years ago) Permalink

I mean idk maybe I just don't get it. aerosmith for example is kinda polarizing, people who hate us hate us & it always feels horrible to read somebody saying that the hard work we put in isn't good, that they didn't enjoy it, that we've failed in our efforts - everybody wants approval, artists more than other people I think. but I can't imagine having such a low opinion of myself that I'd say "well! I suppose everyone wants to hear what I thought about this review that ran this morning, well here is my REBUTTAL!" the fuck. I like music criticism! the critic's job is not to understand you on your own terms, it's to report on how your attempt to communicate your vision came across

I guess there's The Axl Exception if you wanna write "Get In the Ring" and go big with your infantile need for absolutely everybody to kiss your ass but better yet, don't

cosi fan whitford (underrated aerosmith bootlegs I have owned), Thursday, 31 May 2012 19:47 (2 years ago) Permalink

c'mon, nobody hates aerosmith.

tylerw, Thursday, 31 May 2012 19:48 (2 years ago) Permalink

aerosmith haters -- About 7,930,000 results (0.32 seconds)

Ned Raggett, Thursday, 31 May 2012 19:49 (2 years ago) Permalink

it's a risky move because people will probably post in internet threads about how whiny you are

congratulations (n/a), Thursday, 31 May 2012 19:50 (2 years ago) Permalink

it is practically impossible to find a GIF of Steven Tyler with the words "STEP OFF HATER" on it

that is a weird thing to bring up over lean cuisine (DJP), Thursday, 31 May 2012 19:51 (2 years ago) Permalink

but I can't imagine having such a low opinion of myself that I'd say "well! I suppose everyone wants to hear what I thought about this review that ran this morning, well here is my REBUTTAL!" the fuck. I like music criticism! the critic's job is not to understand you on your own terms, it's to report on how your attempt to communicate your vision came across

that's the way *you* would respond to criticism, sure--but that may or may not be the same angle that Fleet Foxes dude or Andy Falkous is coming from. FF could just be talkin shit on twitter for fun you know? And as others have said, this is the way Falkous comes across live, as a caustic bastard so why wouldn't he respond this way? totally agree that it's not the critics job to understand you on your own terms. . . but, i dunno, i've said this a bunch already but i think the FOTL post is hilarious.

Mr. Que, Thursday, 31 May 2012 19:53 (2 years ago) Permalink

wait, if FF dude is so caustic why does FF music sound like a wet lavender fart

that is a weird thing to bring up over lean cuisine (DJP), Thursday, 31 May 2012 19:55 (2 years ago) Permalink

FF could just be talkin shit on twitter for fun you know?

He's not actually in Fleet Foxes anymore, but yes, he's not doing it seriously at all. All of his interviews and public appearances have been affected/ridiculous.

Simon H., Thursday, 31 May 2012 19:56 (2 years ago) Permalink

Falkous is the caustic one, he's not in FF

Mr. Que, Thursday, 31 May 2012 19:57 (2 years ago) Permalink

he's in FOTL

Mr. Que, Thursday, 31 May 2012 19:57 (2 years ago) Permalink

*farts with lavender*

Mr. Que, Thursday, 31 May 2012 19:57 (2 years ago) Permalink

I'm talking about Tillman. Whose record is pretty damn good, and not very Fleet Foxes-y at all.

Simon H., Thursday, 31 May 2012 19:58 (2 years ago) Permalink

I'm not going to indict anybody but myself on this count but my "Saved to drafts" folder contains years of unsent
'responses to criticism', maybe ten total. I don't think it's pathetic or amateur or indicative of any failing on anybody's part to get butthurt about a shit review. xp

poxen, Thursday, 31 May 2012 19:58 (2 years ago) Permalink

haha reading comprehension is not my friend today, apparently

that is a weird thing to bring up over lean cuisine (DJP), Thursday, 31 May 2012 19:59 (2 years ago) Permalink

go down on you in a thyatrr (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Thursday, 31 May 2012 19:59 (2 years ago) Permalink

to be clear, in general responding to criticism is prob a bad idea, but if you're going to do it a) noting clearly whatever blatant inaccuracy cheesed you off, b) making clear you poop on the critic's head and c) shutting the fuck up after a & b is probably most likely to inspire lols and make the critic feel lame.

da croupier, Thursday, 31 May 2012 19:59 (2 years ago) Permalink

a) I agree b) blow me c)

poxen, Thursday, 31 May 2012 20:01 (2 years ago) Permalink

I can only assume that ‘John Stossel’ is the kind of peculiarly North American reference that pervades the reviews which sit about websites of this type, acting as smug and impenetrable signifiers of absolutely nothing at all. I, the ‘author’, googled ‘Mr Stossel’ and can find no absolute evidence of a monopoly of commonsense on his part let alone any indication that he and I could agree that the term has any unified or even loosely defined meaning. I do, however, detect the ascribing to us of the safe, conservative values which are exhibited far more freely within your own work and again, applaud you for attempting to deal with your complicity and guilt in such a public forum.

I mean really

go down on you in a thyatrr (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Thursday, 31 May 2012 20:01 (2 years ago) Permalink

i mean you either think that is hilarious or you don't

Mr. Que, Thursday, 31 May 2012 20:02 (2 years ago) Permalink

(hint: it's hilarious)

that is a weird thing to bring up over lean cuisine (DJP), Thursday, 31 May 2012 20:04 (2 years ago) Permalink

I, a poster, found it "hilarious."

go down on you in a thyatrr (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Thursday, 31 May 2012 20:04 (2 years ago) Permalink

A+

poxen, Thursday, 31 May 2012 20:05 (2 years ago) Permalink

constantly referencing how self-aware you are that you are doing something stupid actually makes it more stupid

call all destroyer, Thursday, 31 May 2012 20:21 (2 years ago) Permalink

jesus stop ascribing your conservative values on the rest of us, cad

go down on you in a thyatrr (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Thursday, 31 May 2012 20:22 (2 years ago) Permalink

i mean someone needs to take ian cohen down a notch but this was not the way

call all destroyer, Thursday, 31 May 2012 20:25 (2 years ago) Permalink

eh, it's just a ranty blog post. intermittently funny, but not funny enough. nbd in any event.

spextor vs bextor (contenderizer), Thursday, 31 May 2012 20:26 (2 years ago) Permalink

lol alfred

call all destroyer, Thursday, 31 May 2012 20:26 (2 years ago) Permalink

Did alfred just out cad as Jesus? wow.

EZ Snappin, Thursday, 31 May 2012 20:34 (2 years ago) Permalink

Ned Raggett, Thursday, 31 May 2012 20:35 (2 years ago) Permalink

"not funny enough"--contenderizer

Mr. Que, Thursday, 31 May 2012 20:38 (2 years ago) Permalink

to be clear, in general responding to criticism is prob a bad idea, but if you're going to do it a) noting clearly whatever blatant inaccuracy cheesed you off, b) making clear you poop on the critic's head and c) shutting the fuck up after a & b is probably most likely to inspire lols and make the critic feel lame.

― da croupier, Thursday, May 31, 2012 3:59 PM (14 minutes ago) Bookmark

yeah but in this case i don't know why making Cohen feel lame should be a worthy goal. the gist of the review was basically "this guy is a genius but he's made better records" and the guy's response was to liken the reviewer's fandom to a vengeful ex stalking his high school sweetheart.

some dude, Thursday, 31 May 2012 20:38 (2 years ago) Permalink

and i mean, the majority of the time you're reviewing a record by one of your favorite artists, it's probably not their masterpiece, so i kind of hate the idea of being on the receiving end of a rant like that from one of my heroes just because i wrote "i love this guy but this album, not so much"

some dude, Thursday, 31 May 2012 20:40 (2 years ago) Permalink


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