Let's talk about Trayvon Martin, George Zimmerman, and how unbelievably fucked up this all is

So when you say it may be too much to ask, are you suggesting they should err in the favour of "home invader"?

i'm saying they can't be prosecuted if they do

I don't think the counter argument here is so much "what happened to this girl is a-OK awesome and I am totally sanguine with every facet of this case" as much as it is "don't get so drunk that you wander into someone else's house and get shot"

I mean, I think the correct solution to this is that this girl should recover from getting shot and get sentenced to probation for non-felony trespassing, but I'm not losing sleep over it.

Ah okay - I thought you were saying they shouldn't be.

You know how in British murder mysteries when someone dies, they have to have an inquest? For any homicide, at least, they should have some kind of investigation more public and more transparent than a phone conversation between a police captain and the DA's office.

I have zero respect for the kind of demagogue 'touch guy' prosecutor who wants to waste tax payer dollars on prosecuting someone who was legitimately shot for trespassing while blind drunk. Presumably the getting shot part will be retribution enough for her mistake and I presume there wasn't a shred of malice involved so why waste their time and our rescources?

touch guy = tough guy

like I said, if any type of prosecution happens it doesn't make sense to me that anything aside from probation should be put on the table considering it was a mistake and she got shot

ILX otm. sad that wandering drunk girl got shot, but the homeowner didn't do anything wrong, imo. felony trespass charges seem absurdly excessive. i'm okay with individual gun ownership (especially for hunters and in rural areas), but feel that it ought to be heavily restricted and monitored.

def gives new meaning to getting hammered and shouting the lyrics to

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XNtTEibFvlQ&ob=av2e

makes you wonder how much time elapsed between shouting at her and pulling the trigger

i'm pretty sure if she was so drunk that she wandered into someone's house that it didn't really matter

ban rural areas

also ban screen doors -- have you ever had to consistently open those things?

consistently?

i love screen doors

iatee would replace them with hydraulic ones purchased at Ikea.

bond revoked

if he is shanked in jail is it justice?

no

maybe?

I'm on the plus side of maybe

cool dude

at this point dude is a martyr to the john birchers even if he's acquitted, so...

don't be a creep

you make a useful point. thanks for the input.

http://www.snopes.com/photos/politics/martin.asp#little

"175 muscular pounds"

Zimmerman has turned himself into police ... again. I must have missed a beat of this story. Is it because his bail was revoked?

yes

Lied about how much money he had, and having a second passport.

I'm shocked, shocked etc. http://www.tampabay.com/news/publicsafety/crime/florida-stand-your-ground-law-yields-some-shocking-outcomes-depending-on/1233133

In the most comprehensive effort of its kind, the Tampa Bay Times has identified nearly 200 "stand your ground'' cases and their outcomes. The Times identified cases through media reports, court records and dozens of interviews with prosecutors and defense attorneys across the state.

Among the findings:

• Those who invoke "stand your ground" to avoid prosecution have been extremely successful. Nearly 70 percent have gone free.

• Defendants claiming "stand your ground" are more likely to prevail if the victim is black. Seventy-three percent of those who killed a black person faced no penalty compared to 59 percent of those who killed a white.

• The number of cases is increasing, largely because defense attorneys are using "stand your ground" in ways state legislators never envisioned. The defense has been invoked in dozens of cases with minor or no injuries. It has also been used by a self-described "vampire" in Pinellas County, a Miami man arrested with a single marijuana cigarette, a Fort Myers homeowner who shot a bear and a West Palm Beach jogger who beat a Jack Russell terrier.

• People often go free under "stand your ground" in cases that seem to make a mockery of what lawmakers intended. One man killed two unarmed people and walked out of jail. Another shot a man as he lay on the ground. Others went free after shooting their victims in the back. In nearly a third of the cases the Times analyzed, defendants initiated the fight, shot an unarmed person or pursued their victim — and still went free.

• Similar cases can have opposite outcomes. Depending on who decided their cases, some drug dealers claiming self-defense have gone to prison while others have been set free. The same holds true for killers who left a fight, only to arm themselves and return. Shoot someone from your doorway? Fire on a fleeing burglar? Your case can swing on different interpretations of the law by prosecutors, judge or jury.

• A comprehensive analysis of "stand your ground" decisions is all but impossible. When police and prosecutors decide not to press charges, they don't always keep records showing how they reached their decisions. And no one keeps track of how many "stand your ground" motions have been filed or their outcomes.

It has also been used by a self-described "vampire" in Pinellas County, a Miami man arrested with a single marijuana cigarette, a Fort Myers homeowner who shot a bear and a West Palm Beach jogger who beat a Jack Russell terrier.

this is making me feel terrible but... poll?

yes please

http://gawker.com/5917881/george-zimmermans-wife-charged-with-perjury-joins-him-in-jail

man see u

She seems charming.

Gawker commenters showing a good bit of charm themselves:

Clementine Rountree
And, you know, the thing about a Shellie... she's got lifeless eyes. Black eyes. Like a doll's eyes. 10 minutes ago

EOTxx
And she's fat!!! 8 minutes ago

Their commenters are pretty terrible in general.

I cant work out how to read the gawker comments anymore, on a complete aside. do they scroll sideways now instead of drill down?

they drill right into your brain iirc

My company's web filter seems to block a lot of comments sections. I should write someone an email, thanking them.

They should really advertise that as a perk in all job postings, tbh.

That reenactment video that was just released, when was it recorded? Because if it happened right after, Zimmerman sounds reasonable, including why he didn't just stay in the car (he was looking for a house number to give to the police; apparently not only was it raining, but he had a flashlight - out of batteries - and since he was behind a house there was no street name or house number visible). Obviously if the video is a lot more recent it is more suspect, but he's clearly beat up in the video - face, back of head - and he's calm. If what he says is at all accurate, I can totally see why he might shoot. Now, let off the hook? That's a different argument.

"reenactment video"??

I saw it here: http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/nationworld/os-george-zimmerman-video-reenactment-20120621,0,822087.story

I'm not sure that "a reenactment video" can be considered evidence of anything much, as compared to having Zimmerman give his testimony in court, which amounts to the same thing, except for taking the oath and knowing the consequences of perjury.

longer description here

http://www.cnn.com/2012/06/21/justice/florida-teen-shooting/index.html

And the investigator expresses doubt that Zimmerman, who had lived in the neighborhood for three years and described himself as head of the neighborhood watch, did not know the names of the three streets in the subdivision.

"To be honest with you, I have a bad memory anyway," Zimmerman said, adding that he has attention-deficit (hyperactivity) disorder and takes medication for it.

I don't know the names of several streets right by me, and I live on a city grid. Ever tried to navigate a gated subdivision? Shit is hard.

Of course, this could all be post fact bs. But the context he provIdes and shows helps.

devil's advocacy at its finest

tbf i don't like the idea of you declaring yourself neighborhood watch captain and stalking kids with a gun either