HEY JEWS

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would it be unkind to say that anyone seeking a rhinoplasty to dissimulate their ethnicity in america in 2012 is a pusillanimous fool

nakhchivan, Thursday, 3 May 2012 13:30 (2 years ago) Permalink

unkind but fair. u should go to war with the nose you have, not the nose you wish you had

Mordy, Thursday, 3 May 2012 13:31 (2 years ago) Permalink

this is my favourite nose

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Nose_%28Gogol%29

i don't remember it having any antisemitic elements

nakhchivan, Thursday, 3 May 2012 13:37 (2 years ago) Permalink

ironically the one time gogol wasn't a raving anti-semite

Mordy, Thursday, 3 May 2012 13:41 (2 years ago) Permalink

probably all the c19th russian greats were at least somewhat antisemitic

gogol at least had the excuse of being completely insane

nakhchivan, Thursday, 3 May 2012 13:46 (2 years ago) Permalink

has anyone heard anything about this? http://www.amazon.com/The-Genealogical-Science-Epistemology-Practices/dp/0226201406

i kinda really want to read it, but i'm nervous about it...

Mordy, Friday, 11 May 2012 03:41 (2 years ago) Permalink

I vaguely recall reading something about that, somewhere.

In other jew news: I bought some challah today.

quincie, Friday, 11 May 2012 17:21 (2 years ago) Permalink

Mordy, I remember reading about some genetic study of Kohens (Cohen, Cohn, Kohn, etc...) worldwide and how many of them could actually trace themselves back to a single ancestor, presumably Aaron.

Love Max Ophüls of us all (Michael White), Friday, 11 May 2012 17:25 (2 years ago) Permalink

pretty sure they all go back to the coen brothers

A Little Princess btw (s1ocki), Friday, 11 May 2012 18:06 (2 years ago) Permalink

the coen fathers

max, Friday, 11 May 2012 18:07 (2 years ago) Permalink

Yeah- I read a decent book about Jewish genetics a couple years ago called something like Abraham's Children. This book seems more about interrogating the discursive elements of genetics rather than the scientific corpus. I think Jewish discussions of hereditary inheritance are kinda ripe targets for criticism, so maybe unfairly I worry that this book will be polemical. I really hate that shalom sand book, tangentially.

Mordy, Friday, 11 May 2012 19:24 (2 years ago) Permalink

I would almost guarantee that book will be at least subtly polemical.

Scott, bass player for Tenth Avenue North (Hurting 2), Friday, 11 May 2012 19:26 (2 years ago) Permalink

That's what worries me, especially bc often what is being covertly discussed when you talk about Jewish genetics is political (particularly wrt Israel). I find it really offensive when someone explains to me that my ancestors were importers (cf sand).

Mordy, Friday, 11 May 2012 19:29 (2 years ago) Permalink

yeah even reading that synopsis i was 'waiting for it'

A Little Princess btw (s1ocki), Friday, 11 May 2012 19:29 (2 years ago) Permalink

who says our ancestors were importers???

A Little Princess btw (s1ocki), Friday, 11 May 2012 19:29 (2 years ago) Permalink

On an unrelated note my copy of Herschel's 'on prophets' just came in. I'm really excited to read it

Mordy, Friday, 11 May 2012 19:30 (2 years ago) Permalink

I mean her other major book is about Jewish claims to Israeli land.

Which is not to say that her work is not legitimate, I just think it's an example of how "exposing" the political motives behind something can also a political move.

Scott, bass player for Tenth Avenue North (Hurting 2), Friday, 11 May 2012 19:30 (2 years ago) Permalink

Sorry zing typo meant "imposters" xp

Mordy, Friday, 11 May 2012 19:30 (2 years ago) Permalink

Like you know, the subtext sort of strikes me as "Judaism is a CONSTRUCTED identity," and then there's no accompanying caveat on how maybe so is Palestinian, Arab, White, African-American, British, Italian, etc.

Scott, bass player for Tenth Avenue North (Hurting 2), Friday, 11 May 2012 19:32 (2 years ago) Permalink

Don't get me wrong, I think Jewish claims to Israel based on ancient ties are about as silly as anything.

Scott, bass player for Tenth Avenue North (Hurting 2), Friday, 11 May 2012 19:33 (2 years ago) Permalink

Part of the tension here is that genetics are incredibly important to Ashkenazi Jewishness beyond just inheritance wrt genetic disorders, testing, etc. Forward for instance has a yearly Genetics supplement so it's not like this is all bullshit eugenics constructed identity stuff. It's also life and death stuff ppl deal w daily

Mordy, Friday, 11 May 2012 19:35 (2 years ago) Permalink

All identity is constructed! Do we really think that any king's lineage is 100% reliable?!

Love Max Ophüls of us all (Michael White), Friday, 11 May 2012 19:55 (2 years ago) Permalink

It's all about street cred in the ghetto.

bnw, Friday, 11 May 2012 19:57 (2 years ago) Permalink

Ok taking this thread in another direction appropriate for SHABBAT . . .

I'd love to hear experiences/thoughts on shabbat observance/non-observance. Did you grow up with any Shabbat observance? Do you do anything special for Shabbat now? Or is it just another day/no biggie?

quincie, Friday, 11 May 2012 22:51 (2 years ago) Permalink

used to grow up with candles/family dinner.

as with all jewish observance, i dont do nothin now

A Little Princess btw (s1ocki), Friday, 11 May 2012 23:12 (2 years ago) Permalink

Did you like the candles/dinner thing, or did you resent it? Do you find yourself drawn to that idea now, or not at all?

quincie, Friday, 11 May 2012 23:20 (2 years ago) Permalink

Did you grow up with any Shabbat observance?

My family is observant, so full blown Shabbos observance.

Do you do anything special for Shabbat now? Or is it just another day/no biggie?

Obviously I'm not totally observant, but we go out for Shabbos meals about once a week and host them ourselves. We also go to shul every few weeks or so. We like the social aspects a lot, but not the restrictions so much. I would never work on Shabbos.

Mordy, Saturday, 12 May 2012 02:46 (2 years ago) Permalink

Did you like the candles/dinner thing, or did you resent it? Do you find yourself drawn to that idea now, or not at all?

― quincie, Friday, May 11, 2012 7:20 PM (Yesterday) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

i was fine with it, and i still am, but its not my thing

A Little Princess btw (s1ocki), Saturday, 12 May 2012 14:46 (2 years ago) Permalink

i've interviewed yitz for profiles / traveling in overlapping social circles with him over the years so it's nice to hear the news

Mordy, Tuesday, 15 May 2012 13:46 (2 years ago) Permalink

x-post-

I grew up with the candles/dinner thing then got away from it. Then I did again while my son was young until he was Bar Mitzvahed, then I got away from it again. I have worked some Saturday mornings, and my son frequently has had ballgames on Shabbat.

curmudgeon, Tuesday, 15 May 2012 15:07 (2 years ago) Permalink

every time i see the title of this thread now i think of the louis ck schindler's list "GOODBYE JEWS" bit anyone know what im talking about

A Little Princess btw (s1ocki), Monday, 21 May 2012 14:28 (2 years ago) Permalink

haha yes

horseshoe, Monday, 21 May 2012 14:37 (2 years ago) Permalink

yes, def!

catbus otm (gbx), Monday, 21 May 2012 14:57 (2 years ago) Permalink

OMG googled it, in tears

this guy's a gangsta? his real name's mittens. (Hurting 2), Monday, 21 May 2012 15:17 (2 years ago) Permalink

On Thursday, May 24th, Sixth & I celebrates Shavuot like nowhere else. Don't miss this high-energy, entertainment-rich, and thought-provoking evening in anticipation of the festival holiday. Taste blintzes, beer, and dairy delights. Hear Matisyahu unplugged. Understand the thoughts behind the music. Ask questions. Study late into the night with Rabbi Shira Stutman.

Does any of this relate to the Torah being revealed, harvesting of wheat, bring fruit to the temple or not working?

curmudgeon, Tuesday, 22 May 2012 19:59 (2 years ago) Permalink

bringing

curmudgeon, Tuesday, 22 May 2012 20:00 (2 years ago) Permalink

Well, eating blintzes + dairy delights are historical customs that have to do with the state of kashrut laws before the giving of the Torah (and I think with the Holofernes narrative?). Matisyahu is Jewish, idk. Studying late into the night is also a historical custom, also with roots in the actual Mt Sinai story (ppl slept the night before the Torah was given which was a no-no, so now we do a tikkun by staying up all night and learning).

When I was in Yeshiva, they spent the entire night of Shvuot teaching Gemara. One particular year they went through the fourth + fifth chapters of Baba Metziah which are basically all tort law and very difficult and at 3:00 in the morning I probably retained 10% of what I heard.

Mordy, Tuesday, 22 May 2012 20:21 (2 years ago) Permalink

this year i've been roped into giving a lecture about the midrash where the angels protest to G-d that He shouldn't give the Torah to the Jewish ppl but should keep it up in heaven. Moshe responds to them by saying, "do u have a desire to worship idols? do you have parents you need to respect? do you have to follow laws of fair business when you buy and sell?" etc and so he gets to bring it down. i'm talking about this story in the context of the agricultural law that states that if you're going to sell a piece of land, your neighbors have right of first refusal (the angels in this case being the neighbors, and moshe's answers actually being legalese to disavow their claim.)

Mordy, Tuesday, 22 May 2012 20:26 (2 years ago) Permalink

while i'm here... this link is blowing up my fb feed today:
http://www.xojane.com/relationships/hasidic-women-sex

Mordy, Tuesday, 22 May 2012 20:28 (2 years ago) Permalink

I think we can safely consider the point missed.

how did I get here? why am I in the whiskey aisle? this is all so (Laurel), Tuesday, 22 May 2012 20:36 (2 years ago) Permalink

That article makes some reasonable points, but I wonder what the author's take is on, for example, the yiddish flyers I have seen mere blocks from my apartment that say that women should step aside whenever men are coming down the sidewalk, or the delis that require women to sit separately with the kids while men sit together (tbf, I find this as offensive to the men as it is to the women -- I want to eat with my wife).

this guy's a gangsta? his real name's mittens. (Hurting 2), Tuesday, 22 May 2012 20:41 (2 years ago) Permalink

OTOH, we ate dinner in the home of a chabbadnick family not too long ago (my wife's co-worker) and one interesting thing we learned was that chassidic women are often more educated in a worldly sense than men, since the men spend all their time studying talmud and the women are forbidden to do so.

this guy's a gangsta? his real name's mittens. (Hurting 2), Tuesday, 22 May 2012 20:42 (2 years ago) Permalink

I knew that! In fact the message I got was that women are pretty likely to work outside the home, even to be the "professional" member of the househole bc the families need their income and the men are called to study instead of work.

how did I get here? why am I in the whiskey aisle? this is all so (Laurel), Tuesday, 22 May 2012 20:59 (2 years ago) Permalink

Yeah.

Chabbad Lubavitch is also a group with sort of an "outreach" philosophy so they may be even moreso. But I was sort of surprised to see, e.g., that they shopped at Whole Foods and Trader Joe's on occasion and served belgian beer with dinner. Probably not even the best details, just the ones that stuck out in my mind.

this guy's a gangsta? his real name's mittens. (Hurting 2), Tuesday, 22 May 2012 22:07 (2 years ago) Permalink

I think of the Lubavitch as the happy Jews--and Trader Joe's has TONS of kosher stuff that's not easy to find (I'm told), so that's a big favorite.

how did I get here? why am I in the whiskey aisle? this is all so (Laurel), Tuesday, 22 May 2012 22:14 (2 years ago) Permalink

that article appears to commend an ancient religious codex for how successfully anticipates the mores and proclivities of liberal new york in 2012, which is of course the greatest cultural paradigm yet seen

Serov devochka s persikami (nakhchivan), Tuesday, 22 May 2012 22:32 (2 years ago) Permalink

just one B, btw in Chabad (incidentally, my family's ortho tradition)

Mordy, Tuesday, 22 May 2012 22:42 (2 years ago) Permalink

hey jews I have questions about much of the above but it will have to wait till the morrow why because going to bed now

quincie, Wednesday, 23 May 2012 01:46 (2 years ago) Permalink

oh but before I go I now have a jewish personal trainer and kvetch with naked jew ladies in the whirlpool at the JCC. Pretty sure I'm passing, no one has called me out!

quincie, Wednesday, 23 May 2012 01:47 (2 years ago) Permalink


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