rolling "Is This Racist?" thread

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The whole point in saying "white people" pejoratively is to treat white people as reductively as white people treat other races.

― suidavyvan eht nioj (Whiney G. Weingarten)

the only people i know who bemoan "white people" are white people.

zubaz fupa (elmo argonaut), Tuesday, 1 May 2012 20:17 (2 years ago) Permalink

oh man, those "white people" are the worst kind of white people. there's two kinds of white people. there's white people, and then there's "white people" who are ruining it for all the white people.

Mordy, Tuesday, 1 May 2012 20:19 (2 years ago) Permalink

i agree with the onion guy that using "white" as a pejorative is stupid and unthinking but not really for the reasons that he lists, which are weird and personal

max, Tuesday, 1 May 2012 20:19 (2 years ago) Permalink

haha mordy

Neil Young’s social media channels (some dude), Tuesday, 1 May 2012 20:20 (2 years ago) Permalink

this is a much better, more persuasive and more succinct argument for ending "white" as an insult

http://agrammar.tumblr.com/post/207970845/white

max, Tuesday, 1 May 2012 20:20 (2 years ago) Permalink

that's so bougie

dayo, Tuesday, 1 May 2012 20:26 (2 years ago) Permalink

ugh, blogs.

Mordy, Tuesday, 1 May 2012 20:26 (2 years ago) Permalink

Can't tumblr at work, max. What's the gist?

L'ennui, cette maladie de tous les (Michael White), Tuesday, 1 May 2012 20:27 (2 years ago) Permalink

that's so bougie

I'M THAT POSTA, AAAAAAAAAH (DJP), Tuesday, 1 May 2012 20:28 (2 years ago) Permalink

endless bougie

suidavyvan eht nioj (Whiney G. Weingarten), Tuesday, 1 May 2012 20:28 (2 years ago) Permalink

teach me how to bougie

♆ (gr8080), Tuesday, 1 May 2012 20:28 (2 years ago) Permalink

see, that was smart

a la bouquet marmoset (Austerity Ponies), Tuesday, 1 May 2012 20:30 (2 years ago) Permalink

I agree with nabisco but we've already established that everybody in America is middle class except for Mitt Romney and Warren Buffett

dayo, Tuesday, 1 May 2012 20:31 (2 years ago) Permalink

God I hate the Anglo use of 'bougie'...

L'ennui, cette maladie de tous les (Michael White), Tuesday, 1 May 2012 20:34 (2 years ago) Permalink

I guess that makes me insufferably bourgeois

L'ennui, cette maladie de tous les (Michael White), Tuesday, 1 May 2012 20:34 (2 years ago) Permalink

just c/p the whole thing here:

Ezra Koenig is not incorrect about this. I might even replace “infrequently mentioned” with “infrequently even noticed.” For me, this was a constant surprise in reactions to Vampire Weekend’s debut: how often and how casually the band was described—or derided—as being white, or consisting of WASPs. Given how much it bothered me as a third party, I can only imagine how irritating it’d be to have white people criticize you for being “white” when you’re Persian; to have Protestants write you off as a WASP when you’re Jewish; maybe even to have people call you a WASP when your name is Baio.

This isn’t just pedantry about the meanings of words, though. Most of what people are trying to shorthand when they call indie acts “white” is set of ideas about social manner and social class: what they’re doing is fundamentally just a modern-American youth-culture spin on calling people bourgeois. (Obviously the last thing you’ll risk when calling out an indie band for being bourgeois is actually using an upscale word like “bourgeois.”) As always, much of it is a game of small differences: middle-class youth reprimanding one another for being whatever they’re most embarrassed to be. Koenig and Batmanglij can be those things, too—of course they can.

I don’t even object to the inevitable use of shorthand for those things. (The English have an interesting term: “student types.”) What surprises me, though, is how many white speakers—including people who are relatively savvy about race and culture—seem completely unbothered by the very obvious problems involved in using a racial shorthand for them. Some will quite casually use “white” as code for a certain set of qualities—safety, cleverness, politeness, education, middle-class manner, “literary” pretensions, alleged blandness—without, so far as I can tell, much noticing the shadow of opposites that casts on everyone else. (Danger? Vulgarity? Ignorance? Poverty? Savagery?) Some will argue, in earnest, that they’re actually taking the side of some vibrant other thing over bland, upscale whiteness—all without noticing how very old and familiar that line is. (Haven’t white audiences traditionally admired black artists as a source of transgression, of danger, of dirt, of “authenticity,” of “soul,” of “primitive” thrills?)

But even more than those obvious issues, I’m surprised by how this mode of thinking can lead people to actually misapprehend what’s right in front of their eyes—straight down to the ability to look at four guys in a band, one of them a Persian guy with the surname Batmanglij, and say, without missing a beat, that you’re looking at four white guys. The ability to look at a crowd at an indie show and claim that everyone’s white, even when you’re surrounded by two dozen east Asians. The ability to use “white” to mean “middle-class” to such an overwhelming extent that you actually start to misidentify people—all so that race itself, not class or background or culture or manner, can still remain the difference, the Other. There’s an odd habit here.

max, Tuesday, 1 May 2012 20:34 (2 years ago) Permalink

i think pointing out 'white ppl problems' or 'white ppl show' or whatever, other issues aside, does challenge the ongoing notion that white culture is normative culture.

Mordy, Tuesday, 1 May 2012 20:35 (2 years ago) Permalink

(the missing quote is an oblique reference to how ppl constantly call Vampire Weekend, a band whose primary songwriters are Jewish and Persian, a WASP band)

I'M THAT POSTA, AAAAAAAAAH (DJP), Tuesday, 1 May 2012 20:37 (2 years ago) Permalink

what if someone says that a basketball team sucks because they have too many white players

That's a pretty funky dance, Garfield. Show me how you do it. (frogbs), Tuesday, 1 May 2012 20:41 (2 years ago) Permalink

oh sorry didnt realize i cut off the quote

max, Tuesday, 1 May 2012 20:41 (2 years ago) Permalink

what if someone says that a basketball team sucks because they have too many white players

― That's a pretty funky dance, Garfield. Show me how you do it. (frogbs), Tuesday, May 1, 2012 4:41 PM (51 seconds ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

what if

max, Tuesday, 1 May 2012 20:42 (2 years ago) Permalink

frogbs raises a great point

I mean, what if

xp: damn u

I'M THAT POSTA, AAAAAAAAAH (DJP), Tuesday, 1 May 2012 20:42 (2 years ago) Permalink

*strokes chin*

max, Tuesday, 1 May 2012 20:42 (2 years ago) Permalink

completely the opposite of what we're talking about, frog

but coincidentally the nets DO suck because they have too many decemberists fans on the roster

suidavyvan eht nioj (Whiney G. Weingarten), Tuesday, 1 May 2012 20:43 (2 years ago) Permalink

of all the teams in the NBA, the nets are the team with too many white players?

dayo, Tuesday, 1 May 2012 20:46 (2 years ago) Permalink

that it is, but there's an example of using "white" as a perjorative that's at least a little more acceptable

That's a pretty funky dance, Garfield. Show me how you do it. (frogbs), Tuesday, 1 May 2012 20:46 (2 years ago) Permalink


any excuse to post louis

"in this super-sexy postracial age" (forksclovetofu), Tuesday, 1 May 2012 20:47 (2 years ago) Permalink

WHEEEEE

"in this super-sexy postracial age" (forksclovetofu), Tuesday, 1 May 2012 20:47 (2 years ago) Permalink

maybe Whiney actually wasn't using an INDIE=WHITE=BAD shorthand for once and just happens to know that DeShawn Stevenson is really into The Crane Wife

Neil Young’s social media channels (some dude), Tuesday, 1 May 2012 20:48 (2 years ago) Permalink

guys, i'm gonna be honest with you, i just named the first basketball team that came to my head.

suidavyvan eht nioj (Whiney G. Weingarten), Tuesday, 1 May 2012 20:49 (2 years ago) Permalink

yeah I have trouble believing that Whiney could name one current white basketball player

That's a pretty funky dance, Garfield. Show me how you do it. (frogbs), Tuesday, 1 May 2012 20:51 (2 years ago) Permalink

how the heck does some dude know who deshawn stevenson is??

dharunravir (k3vin k.), Tuesday, 1 May 2012 20:52 (2 years ago) Permalink

"in this super-sexy postracial age" (forksclovetofu), Tuesday, 1 May 2012 20:52 (2 years ago) Permalink

have we had the "White Mamba" discussion on this thread yet, because it would be appropriate

"in this super-sexy postracial age" (forksclovetofu), Tuesday, 1 May 2012 20:52 (2 years ago) Permalink

google, dude (xpost)

Neil Young’s social media channels (some dude), Tuesday, 1 May 2012 20:53 (2 years ago) Permalink

i mean...i had to google the name of a decemberists album too, fwiw

Neil Young’s social media channels (some dude), Tuesday, 1 May 2012 20:53 (2 years ago) Permalink

that it is, but there's an example of using "white" as a perjorative that's at least a little more acceptable

― That's a pretty funky dance, Garfield. Show me how you do it. (frogbs), Tuesday, May 1, 2012 4:46 PM (6 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

what on earth

max, Tuesday, 1 May 2012 20:54 (2 years ago) Permalink

haha i was impressed for a minute there

dharunravir (k3vin k.), Tuesday, 1 May 2012 20:54 (2 years ago) Permalink

oh, hey, scalabrine's a ginger. respect!

a la bouquet marmoset (Austerity Ponies), Tuesday, 1 May 2012 20:56 (2 years ago) Permalink

yeah I have trouble believing that Whiney could name one current white basketball player

― That's a pretty funky dance, Garfield. Show me how you do it. (frogbs), Tuesday, May 1, 2012 4:51 PM (5 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

I def cannot. I know the big guy with the shaggy hair from all the gifs

suidavyvan eht nioj (Whiney G. Weingarten), Tuesday, 1 May 2012 20:57 (2 years ago) Permalink

♆ (gr8080), Tuesday, 1 May 2012 20:57 (2 years ago) Permalink

♆ (gr8080), Tuesday, 1 May 2012 20:57 (2 years ago) Permalink

I thought Whiney was just interested in the nets cuz they're jay-z's team

dayo, Tuesday, 1 May 2012 20:57 (2 years ago) Permalink

i'm actually thinking about becoming a basketball fan to root for the Nets

suidavyvan eht nioj (Whiney G. Weingarten), Tuesday, 1 May 2012 21:00 (2 years ago) Permalink

yeah I have trouble believing that Whiney could name one current white basketball player

― That's a pretty funky dance, Garfield. Show me how you do it. (frogbs), Tuesday, May 1, 2012 4:51 PM (5 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

I def cannot. I know the big guy with the shaggy hair from all the gifs

― suidavyvan eht nioj (Whiney G. Weingarten), Tuesday, May 1, 2012 4:57 PM (2 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

wait i don't even know who this is

dharunravir (k3vin k.), Tuesday, 1 May 2012 21:00 (2 years ago) Permalink

i'm actually thinking about becoming a hip-hop fan to listen to jay-z!

pplains, Tuesday, 1 May 2012 21:00 (2 years ago) Permalink

like when the brooklyn nets win, it's a 1/3 victory for hip-hop

suidavyvan eht nioj (Whiney G. Weingarten), Tuesday, 1 May 2012 21:01 (2 years ago) Permalink

also a 2/3 victory for russia

dayo, Tuesday, 1 May 2012 21:02 (2 years ago) Permalink

a total victory for russian hip-hop

suidavyvan eht nioj (Whiney G. Weingarten), Tuesday, 1 May 2012 21:09 (2 years ago) Permalink


otm

Choc. Clusterman (contenderizer), Tuesday, 1 May 2012 21:23 (2 years ago) Permalink


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