Why I love the Daily Mail, as distilled into one story.

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"My son has autism, I'm afraid I cannot look at curves with pleasure anymore"

Mark G, Thursday, 8 January 2009 17:15 (5 years ago) Permalink

this really does seem quite o_O tho

Yes, welcome to experimental psychology.

Men who prefer non-curvy women might be fathers to autistic children

Hah, no: they showed no preference for any figure. "Men who don't conform to arguable global norm for what heterosexual males find attractive" is a bit unwieldy for a headline, though.

What's there isn't an elegant headline, either, I agree. I can see why they chose it, though.

Special topics: Disco, The Common Market (grimly fiendish), Thursday, 8 January 2009 17:21 (5 years ago) Permalink

AutiDads love Posh More.

there. Fixed.

Mark G, Thursday, 8 January 2009 17:23 (5 years ago) Permalink

Taking it further...

Dads of autistic children do not want more kids, so are attracted to females that look less childbearing types...?

Mark G, Thursday, 8 January 2009 17:38 (5 years ago) Permalink

Couldn't the headline have just as easily read "Men who don't find athletic women attractive could father children with autism?"

p.s. I have neither read the article nor the supporting materials.

He's like a big coloured steamroller (Ned Trifle II), Thursday, 8 January 2009 17:43 (5 years ago) Permalink

I mean, why pick on curvy women when the men didn;t state a preference? That's typical DM o_O surely?

He's like a big coloured steamroller (Ned Trifle II), Thursday, 8 January 2009 17:44 (5 years ago) Permalink

Couldn't the headline have just as easily read "Men who don't find athletic women attractive could father children with autism?"

It could, but the point is that there's cross-cultural support for the curvy stereotype, based on the "ideal" waist-hip ratio of 0.7 (Singh, 1993, I think), so there is a reason for mentioning curves. As you'd know if you'd read the piece (gah, I can't believe I'm sticking up for the Mail).

I mean, why pick on curvy women when the men didn;t state a preference? That's typical DM o_O surely?

Not really, no. For the love of all that is decent, read the piece before you start posting, dudes.

Special topics: Disco, The Common Market (grimly fiendish), Thursday, 8 January 2009 17:47 (5 years ago) Permalink

100 men seems like a very small sample size. I'm a bit more worried about the oestrogen/health stuff and this idea the writer seems to have about autism being similar to brain damage and something that crops up randomly when parents have bad health or put bad things into their kids bodies, it's the same logic they use when they reckon autism is caused by MMR and mercury, and that stuff was all bollocks.

xpost

, Thursday, 8 January 2009 17:49 (5 years ago) Permalink

Ok, read it now.

Dr Mark Brosnan and Dr Ian Walker from the university's Department of Psychology found that as a group the fathers of autistic children didn't all go for the same figure as their most attractive choice.

Hmmm. I really think we may to read the whole thing. It doesn't seem to be quite as clear cut as the DM is making it.

OH REALLY, you say.

He's like a big coloured steamroller (Ned Trifle II), Thursday, 8 January 2009 17:56 (5 years ago) Permalink

StanM, Thursday, 8 January 2009 17:58 (5 years ago) Permalink

100 men seems like a very small sample size

It's probably (sadly?) about average for such a study.

this idea the writer seems to have about autism being similar to brain damage

Plenty of studies link autism to brain "damage" of some kind; hellfire, one of the most convincing new theories on unipolar depression suggests that's actually linked in some way to a structurally abnormal brain. Plenty of studies link it to all sorts of things. That's the point: there isn't a pathology of autism yet. This is why research exists.

something that crops up randomly when parents have bad health or put bad things into their kids bodies

What evidence are you using for this, anyway? Can you quote the actual text that states this, or are you basing this reading on your own assumptions about how the Daily Mail often presents such stories? (Which, I'll admit, are usually fucking shocking.)

Special topics: Disco, The Common Market (grimly fiendish), Thursday, 8 January 2009 17:58 (5 years ago) Permalink

It doesn't seem to be quite as clear cut as the DM is making it

Well, of course it isn't -- this is a very short newspaper article, while (I'd hope!) that what Brosnan and Walker are doing is a tightly controlled experiment. My point, though, is that going "TUT DAILY MAIL HEADLINES WHATEVER NEXT" without actually reading the piece isn't constructive.

Although why I'm wasting time defending the Daily Mail, I really don't know.

Special topics: Disco, The Common Market (grimly fiendish), Thursday, 8 January 2009 18:00 (5 years ago) Permalink

one of the most convincing new theories on unipolar depression suggests that's actually linked in some way to a structurally abnormal brain

Actually, I wish I'd not written that because it'll be misconstrued, and I'm falling into my own trap of trying to explain something staggeringly complex using very few words. My fundamental point still stands, though: autism could well be linked (NB: correlation, not causality!) to structural "defects" in the brain.

Special topics: Disco, The Common Market (grimly fiendish), Thursday, 8 January 2009 18:03 (5 years ago) Permalink

My. I went off and made some soup there (very nice, since you ask: fennel and potato with lemon, and a gremolata topping) and expected to come back to a minor clusterfuck. Anyway, I should be toiling over an essay, but because I am the KING OF PROCRASTINATION ...

Autism could well be linked (NB: correlation, not causality!) to structural "defects" in the brain

... a little light reading on that subject for anyone who's interested, in no particular order.

Carper, R A Carper and Courchesne, E (2000). Inverse correlation between frontal lobe and cerebellum sizes in children with autism. Brain, 123 (4), 836-844. (Various other Courchesne papers consider a similar hypothesis.)

Dawson G, Webb SJ, Wijsman E, Schellenberg G, Estes A, Munson J, Faja S (2005). Neurocognitive and electrophysiological evidence of altered face processing in parents of children with autism: implications for a model of abnormal development of social brain circuitry in autism. Dev Psychopathol, 17, 679–697.

Wicker, B (2008). New Insights from Neuroimaging into the Emotional Brain in Autism. In E McGregor, M Núñez, K Cebula and J Carlos Gómez (Eds). Autism: An Integrated View from Neurocognitive, Clinical and Intervention Research. Malden, Mass; Oxford: Blackwell. (Actually: if you want to criticise the Brosnan and Walker study for being "quite o_O", I'd suggest you read that entire book first.)

Sparks, B F, and a fucking shitload of others (2002). Brain structural abnormalities in young children with autism spectrum disorder. Neurology, 59, 184-192.

Haas, R, and, again, more others than I can be arsed rearranging into author/initial format (1996). Neurologic abnormalities in infantile autism. Journal of Child Neurology, 11 (2), 84-92.

Now, shall we look at some studies considering autism and genetic predisposition/hormonal influences? Is that a resounding "no, shut the fuck up, Grimly?" Suits me fine.

Special topics: Disco, The Common Market (grimly fiendish), Thursday, 8 January 2009 19:43 (5 years ago) Permalink

‘When Jack talked about creating Barbie it was like listening to somebody talk about a sexual episode, almost like listening to a sexual pervert,’ Ryan’s friend, Stephen Gnass told the author.

Almost.

He's like a big coloured steamroller (Ned Trifle II), Thursday, 8 January 2009 20:42 (5 years ago) Permalink

Quite, em, compulsive level of detail there, grimly. I prefer my scaremongering lower on facts, higher on sheer panic, please. Here's Warning over 'third-hand smoke'. Not from the Mail, but it might as well be

Ismael Klata, Thursday, 8 January 2009 20:46 (5 years ago) Permalink

Has he gone?

I AM BACK. Actually, no, I'm still looking for innovative new ways to not start writing. Drinking BEER has helped. Shit.

As always, the URL is WAY more interesting than the story, which is desperately dull. Filling in the blanks myself, I was hoping for something like: "Man created Barbie and Ken dolls to amuse friends at kinky swinger parties for manic depressives in need of plastic toys to achieve sexual gratification". Which would have been so much better.

I really want to know if those are being generated automatically or not. I shall endeavour to find out.

Special topics: Disco, The Common Market (grimly fiendish), Thursday, 8 January 2009 20:47 (5 years ago) Permalink

Quite, em, compulsive level of detail there, grimly

Heheheh. I think it's served its purpose.

Special topics: Disco, The Common Market (grimly fiendish), Thursday, 8 January 2009 20:48 (5 years ago) Permalink

Back on the light bulb tip, it's quite funny being reminded in the Guardian that twelve months ago, the Daily Mail were giving away free energy-saving bulbs and encouraging people to change.

Yehudi Menudo (NickB), Monday, 12 January 2009 13:30 (5 years ago) Permalink

lol i thought it was a myth that people in the all 'respect' the mail for its vaunted professionalism

A bitter, disillusioned sub writes: while knocking a story into shape last night, I needed to check when a particular dude was knighted, and chanced upon a relevant article from the Mail. Said article spelled said dude's name two different ways in the space of 100 words ...

... neither of which was actually correct.

Special topics: Disco, The Common Market (grimly fiendish), Saturday, 17 January 2009 15:22 (5 years ago) Permalink

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/article-1129978/How-faceless-amoral-world-cyberspace-created-deeply-disturbing--generation-SEX.html

I would srsly buy a drink - maybe two - for whoever came up w/ the idea of having the URLs read like this

I'm Throwing Small Arms Around Powys (DJ Mencap), Wednesday, 28 January 2009 16:44 (5 years ago) Permalink

that mother & daughter pic is quite something

Ismael Klata, Wednesday, 28 January 2009 16:48 (5 years ago) Permalink

How did this happen? Who's to blame? Well certainly there are those more responsible than others, and they will be held accountable, but again truth be told, if you're looking for the guilty, you need only look into a mirror.

Mare Street tour guide (Dom Passantino), Wednesday, 28 January 2009 16:50 (5 years ago) Permalink

Marcello?

talk me down off the (ledge), Wednesday, 28 January 2009 16:52 (5 years ago) Permalink

It's 1954 in my house!

- mrs B, cleveland, usa, 28/1/2009 3:15 Click to rate Rating 27

I'm Throwing Small Arms Around Powys (DJ Mencap), Wednesday, 28 January 2009 16:53 (5 years ago) Permalink

who's that being Obamafied in the background?

O Supermanchiros (blueski), Wednesday, 28 January 2009 16:56 (5 years ago) Permalink

Looks like Gianlucca Vialli to me.

zero learnt from nero (Neil S), Wednesday, 28 January 2009 16:59 (5 years ago) Permalink


Remember that Hilaire Belloc cautionary tale - Matilda told such dreadful lies, it made one gasp and stretch one’s eyes? I used to love it as a child when telling lies was one of the naughtiest things you could do: Matilda ended up getting burned to death.

Seriously, though, the answer is - change society. (stevie), Wednesday, 28 January 2009 17:02 (5 years ago) Permalink

Good of the Daily Mail to include a clip from Skins, despite it not being mentioned anywhere in the article, for anyone wondering what 'teenage promiscuity' might look like, without having to search for it online themselves.

chord simple (j.o.n.a), Wednesday, 28 January 2009 17:11 (5 years ago) Permalink

12-year-olds today have seen raunchier stuff on the internet today than most 40-year-olds have seen in their entire lives.

Chew on that for awhile. Your 12-year-old has seen "Two Girls, One Cup" - and that ain't getting erased.

I'm Throwing Small Arms Around Powys (DJ Mencap), Wednesday, 28 January 2009 17:24 (5 years ago) Permalink

Chew on 2G1C for a while

I'm Throwing Small Arms Around Powys (DJ Mencap), Wednesday, 28 January 2009 17:25 (5 years ago) Permalink

Pretty sure our boy hasn't seen 2 Girls, 1 Cup. He thought the posters for Sex Drive were too rude to be on the side of a bus.

Theo Wankcott (Noodle Vague), Wednesday, 28 January 2009 17:29 (5 years ago) Permalink

Prudle Vague Jr. more like

O Supermanchiros (blueski), Wednesday, 28 January 2009 17:42 (5 years ago) Permalink

Shameful Lawless Internet is full of raunchy XXX rated child-endangering pictures like these: (pic) (pic) (pic) (pic) (pic) (pic)

StanM, Wednesday, 28 January 2009 17:45 (5 years ago) Permalink

First 12 comments all from the US there.

Architect of the Geocities (Raw Patrick), Wednesday, 28 January 2009 18:17 (5 years ago) Permalink

If morality is subjective then why not live it up? If God is dead all things are lawful. If there is no God why not let sex be your god and use as many other humans as possible to fulfill ones personal pleasures. Darwin taught us the survival of the fittest right?

Architect of the Geocities (Raw Patrick), Wednesday, 28 January 2009 18:24 (5 years ago) Permalink

Workplace harrassment: 12 women's sizzling hot tales!

Tracer Hand, Wednesday, 28 January 2009 18:31 (5 years ago) Permalink

too shit; didn't read

Special topics: Disco, The Common Market (grimly fiendish), Wednesday, 28 January 2009 22:32 (5 years ago) Permalink

You were right not to do so.
DM comments always full of Americans and ex-pats.

The Unbelievably Insensitive Baroness Vadera (Ned Trifle II), Wednesday, 28 January 2009 23:02 (5 years ago) Permalink

3 months pass...

It turns out that it was the Walkman that has broken Britain, according to not-at-all-crazy AN Wilson.

zero learnt from nero (Neil S), Sunday, 17 May 2009 14:17 (4 years ago) Permalink

Exposing your ear drums to badly mixed rock music

Scik Mouthy?

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/article-1183011/AMANDA-PLATELL-Insults-betray-bigotry-gay-zealots.html

I really don't want to look at the comments section there, but it's so tempting. Can someone confirm that it's as bad as you'd imagine? (Poor little girl, staring wistfully into the distance, wishing for a real mummy and daddy.)

Like, (Expletive) my (expletive). (Merdeyeux), Sunday, 17 May 2009 14:34 (4 years ago) Permalink

The gay rights lobby should remember that not everyone who opposes gay adoption is a narrow-minded redneck

Pictures or it didn't happen

Jimmy Pursey Thrower (Noodle Vague), Sunday, 17 May 2009 14:35 (4 years ago) Permalink

adam and eve not adam and steve

zero learnt from nero (Neil S), Sunday, 17 May 2009 14:48 (4 years ago) Permalink

The plugs that go into the ears are a wonderful source of bacteria so unless they are sterilised before each use they are a germ playground.

Ant Attack.. (Ste), Sunday, 17 May 2009 15:11 (4 years ago) Permalink

I really don't want to look at the comments section there, but it's so tempting. Can someone confirm that it's as bad as you'd imagine? (

First comment.

don't know the research and I am not homophobic but it is only common sense that tells me children must surely have a better chance in life with a married heterosexual couple and that is who they should be put with.

- Expat Andi, Dubai UAE,

Brandy Frotte and Reel De La St-Jean (Ned Trifle II), Sunday, 17 May 2009 16:31 (4 years ago) Permalink

A heterosexual couple yesterday.

Brandy Frotte and Reel De La St-Jean (Ned Trifle II), Sunday, 17 May 2009 16:31 (4 years ago) Permalink

Hang on, this bunch would have been a better example...

Brandy Frotte and Reel De La St-Jean (Ned Trifle II), Sunday, 17 May 2009 16:33 (4 years ago) Permalink

James Mitchell, Sunday, 17 May 2009 16:51 (4 years ago) Permalink

poll

I am a 'music' fan. Revolutionary, isn't it? (onimo), Thursday, 20 February 2014 10:58 (2 months ago) Permalink

you are clinically deaf and should sell you iPod (stevie), Thursday, 20 February 2014 10:59 (2 months ago) Permalink


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