so tell me, why is Kaputt better or worse than Let England Shake?

"Whereas Rowland actually was as successful as the people he idolised"

one-hit wonder in the states. but remembered fondly for that one hit. NOBODY here knows the name of the singer from dexy's.

i've certainly never seen a low level indie musician chasing cocaine

yeah even in the UK Kevin is idolised more than genuinely massive

OK, maybe Rowland's not famous as an individual, but Eileen and Geno were MASSIVE hits, both #1 in the UK, and Eileen #1 in the US too; Dexys sold a LOT of records. I'd wager as many as Geno Washington and then some.

And yes, low-level indie musicians can be found chasing cocaine, of course, but I get the sense that Bejar's more writing about the kind of people who fly to gigs on learjets than half a squiff in the toilets of Camden Electric Ballroom.

xxpost But then he was idolising all these Northern Soul artists who probably didn't make a huge mark in the US and only had a narrow cult following in the UK. Not that that's important.

"Together is the fifth studio album by Canadian indie rock band The New Pornographers. It was released on May 4, 2010[1] and debuted at number 18 on the Billboard 200."

that's pretty good! not arcade fire good, probably, but good.

even i bought the 45 of come on eileen. that's how huge it was.

They played "Come On Eileen" at my teen dance club on "progressive night" and all the skinheads would do their weird little dance in a circle.

definitely heard it a bunch on college radio at the time before it got huge. like madonna.

Did the Pet Shop Boys live glamorous playboy lifestyles or just fantasize about this? I seem to imagine them as pretty dour people who always carry a macintosh, but I think I remember Tennant saying in an interview that a lot of his music was inspired by a wish to live the Studio 54 lifestyle but never having the chance to. So this is an imaginary culture being sold back and forth across the Atlantic from decade to decade.

Tennant and Lowe said about twenty years ago that the stereotypes are "largely true." Tennant's apt to stay in with a glass of wine and a Shostakovich CD while Lowe clubs a few nights a week. They're older now though.

Tennant is really a folkie in a not-so-good disguise.

Bejar's not idolising Tennant. He's idolising Ferry, and Screamadelica. These are who he's name checking. We need Mark S to bring the "sounds like" vs "influence" slapdown.

dour people who always carry a macintosh

Usually dour people I see are carrying Dell laptops.

lowe - "i'm a mac"
tennant - "i'm a pc"

lol

I don't think I can answer this poll because my favorite song literally changes with every listen.

Oops. I thought this was the other Kaputt one.

from deep sea skiving to screamadelica. oh england...so much to answer for.

Bejar's not idolising Tennant. He's idolising Ferry, and Screamadelica. These are who he's name checking. We need Mark S to bring the "sounds like" vs "influence" slapdown.

― Sick Mouthy (Scik Mouthy), Wednesday, February 8, 2012 12:35 PM (38 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

and new order. are we really content saying that bejar is "idolizing" these artists and sounds, though? i get the impression that he's using 80s signifiers as a shorthand for the "cinematic" superficiality that ultimately alienates the narrator. this interpretation seems to follow from what judith described earlier: emptiness and longing reflecting emptiness and longing.

i get the impression that he's using 80s signifiers as a shorthand for the "cinematic" superficiality that ultimately alienates the narrator. this interpretation seems to follow from what judith described earlier: emptiness and longing reflecting emptiness and longing.

"superficiality that ultimately alienates the narrator" is accurate yet too negative a spin on the vibe at work, I think.

I feel it's more akin to, if you're single or you've just broken up or whatevs, romantic films with happy endings making you as sad those with unhappy endings (lol this makes me think of Jewel's "You Were Meant For Me").

It's not the "emptiness" of the desire that gets the narrator down so much as the impossibility of bringing it to life.

I know there have been times in my life when I've listened to, say, Hats, and I've felt that way, the impossible swell of emotions didn't same fake but it seemed sharply otherworldly, a plenitude in the music that threw into relief a lack in life.

So in a way Kaputt is like listening to someone listening to Hats.

yeah, that's how i'd read it, too. i don't think that's at odds with the idea that the 80s are being used to shorthand superficiality, the conjuration of heightened worlds that can be seen but not inhabited and the alienation that arises from the discontinuity.

Yeah, I agree with that. I don't mean idolising in the way a teenager would. It's a tool in many ways. I don't doubt he loves Avalon though.

He adores this sound palette. He loves it. There's no irony or machination there. But he knows how to use it, too, what it signifies.

So in a way Kaputt is like listening to someone listening to Hats.
do you mean that literally? in the sense that bejar makes music after having listened to and being influenced by hats? hats by the way is probably the one album in the ilm canon which i never "got" at all. there too the singer's voice is very hard to swallow. and the slow & lush music seems even more shallow. kaputt is much easier to digest than hats. just the idea of having to listen to hats drives me nuts.

"So in a way Kaputt is like listening to someone listening to Hats."

oh my god you are demented. but in a good way. its a cool thought.

i used to embarrass myself a bit listening to that first blue nile album alone in my room as a kid. i had been taught to keep those emotions in check. i wasn't used to hearing declarations of love that were that loud. and naked. i never really learned how to be completely naked. but i appreciated others who were bold in that way.

i never listened to the lyrics of blue nile. the maudlin voice was like a wall in between the words and my ear. are they really that confessional? usually i love songwriters who seem to be totally open in their songers. like neil young or joni mitchell for example.

songs

Buchanan is a very stark, emotional lyricist, aye.

So in a way Kaputt is like listening to someone listening to Hats.

do you mean

So in a way listening to Kaputt is like listening to someone listening to Hats.

because otherwise - maybe i am splitting hairs here - you are comparing a work, an artefact with an activity. there is a logical fallacy looming there.

Listening to Destroyer is like knitting a hat

kaputt is a hat listening to a hat
having fun with destroyer...

do you mean

So in a way listening to Kaputt is like listening to someone listening to Hats.

yes. of course. And I don't mean it literally sounds like that, I was talking about what I perceive to be the album's general emotional content and narrative thrust.

i mean, keep up

fuck listening to a hat!

/obvious joke

everyone on this thread is wrong

even if that means i'm saying mutually exclusive positions with no middle ground are both wrong. they are both wrong. go away. you're wrong.

there's an album called hats?!?!

fuck all of you who like it

wait what is your job again?

nothing to do with hats

it's an album by The Blue Nile, lex. superior chill '80s sounds.

i know what my favoured chill sounds are and they're not what destroyer fans recommend smh

vibe with me, brother (may i call u brother?)

(i've vaguely intended to get into the blue nile for about a decade now but this episode may have killed that faint intention completely)

would u ask mariah if u could call her brother?!?!

you are definitely not mariah.

can we all agree that 'let england shake' is considerably more of an indie rock album than 'kaputt'? it's strange that lex is spending so much energy defending indie rock.

oh lex you sure are incorrigible, arent you

I think Let England Shake is more in the tradition of major label outsiders than indie rock.

pj harvey is obviously not indie rock enough for you p4k disciples

way more rock than kaputt and made a *concept album* about..."war, man"