❀ the cult of: ➥motivational speakers ➥life coaches ➥personal growth gurus ➥new-age charlatans ➥AWESOMENESS FEST

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One thing a lot of participants in the seminars do, that is discouraged in the courses and obviously really dumb, is try to Landmark their friends. They tell you to share authentically about your life and be honest about your relationships, but not to analyze your friends using the paradigms of the course. But of course everyone leaves the course and starts telling all their friends about "enrollment," and "authenticity," and "creating possibility," and "running rackets," and "winning formulas/strong suits." There is a highly specific jargon, and I'm not sure that it has value per se, but it certainly has more value when contextualized + discussed + unpacked (lol unpacked- academia another one of my cults) than it does when you're enthusing about how "enrollment is causing a possibility to be present for another such that they are touched, moved and inspired by that possibility" to your roommate that you really want to come to your "graduation" Tuesday night but just wants to read their book and not hear you overshare about your weekend.

Mordy, Thursday, 2 February 2012 15:12 (2 years ago) Permalink

Mordy, you don't seem like a person who uncritically follows anything, though.

mh, Thursday, 2 February 2012 15:13 (2 years ago) Permalink

omar/horseshoe: i am unfamiliar with landmark!!!! enlighten me!!

― ⚓ (gr8080), Thursday, February 2, 2012 3:05 AM (6 hours ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

mordy mentioned it but landmark used to be EST which was HUGE in the 70s and is in many ways the granddaddy of all this shit

lag∞n, Thursday, 2 February 2012 15:14 (2 years ago) Permalink

Mordy, you don't seem like a person who uncritically follows anything, though.

I critically follow everything, lol. But yeah -- I'm not trying to paint an uncritical picture of Landmark, just trying to add some nuance + historical context.

Mordy, Thursday, 2 February 2012 15:15 (2 years ago) Permalink

My experience with people who got into Landmark - blessedly limited - is on track with horseshoe's.

Jenny, that's kind of like the obvious "you're not doing what we like / you're not with the program: you have negative energies!" formula in a nutshell!

YES. I would be shocked if at least half of the people I worked with didn't go on to be hardcore Landmarkians/Awesomefest attendees. They were basically living The Secret before The Secret was even a thing. Actually at the time I think the Celestine Prophecies was the bullshit, dumbed-down pseudospiritual handbook du jour.

I did, however, take a lot of Tarot reading classes and it's nice to have a skill to fall back on.

gonna give her the old fuquay-varina (Jenny), Thursday, 2 February 2012 15:16 (2 years ago) Permalink

The purpose of est was "to transform one's ability to experience living so that the situations one had been trying to change or had been putting up with, clear up just in the process of life itself."

hmmm

horseshoe, Thursday, 2 February 2012 15:16 (2 years ago) Permalink

Is that supposed to make sense?

gonna give her the old fuquay-varina (Jenny), Thursday, 2 February 2012 15:17 (2 years ago) Permalink

Also, I don't want to sound like I'm blaming the participants and letting the business off-the-hook. I fully think the business is responsible for the kinds of participants it attracts, and responsible to deal with them ethically and responsibly once allowing them to take their courses. I'm just pointing out that these kinds of businesses are always going to attract a particular group of participants. For instance, I don't think it's possible to take a Landmark course and go crazy because of the course. I think it's possible to start with a precarious mental situation and then have it degrade by taking a course. But I also studied Kabbalah + Chassidic philosophy for three years and met ppl who experienced psychotic episodes from that as well.

Mordy, Thursday, 2 February 2012 15:18 (2 years ago) Permalink

but is the course worthwhile in any way?

horseshoe, Thursday, 2 February 2012 15:19 (2 years ago) Permalink

The purpose of est was "to transform one's ability to experience living so that the situations one had been trying to change or had been putting up with, clear up just in the process of life itself."

Let me translate? The stuff that you've been trying to change, or the shitty things you've been just suffering with - they will clear up without actually addressing them directly, just by changing your perspective. A huge part of the model (which IIRC Erhard got directly from Hubbard and was probably responsible for their rift and for Scientology trying to defame and then later kill Erhard) is that resisting things causes them to persist, and what is actually required is a contextual shift. That context shift is generally supposed to be creating a possibility -- generally something life-affirming and positive for your community. The idea is that you throw yourself into good works and the shitty stuff will disappear.

Mordy, Thursday, 2 February 2012 15:21 (2 years ago) Permalink

fwiw i would not have characterized my former college roommate as mentally unstable, before or even during the Landmark thing. she was odd and sort of bullheaded but she seemed pretty okay, honestly. i guess that could have been an elaborate front, but i don't know.

horseshoe, Thursday, 2 February 2012 15:21 (2 years ago) Permalink

the main diff between the current milieu and landmark or w/e motivation seminars of old is the internet, like est/landmark is this huge org w/curriculum and and a marketing budget and whatnot but w/the internet you can just throw yr own shit out and see if it sticks, which is obv lol m/l how the internet has effected other industries, but i think w/this one which is a marketplace of ideas it has created this strange dynamic where everyone is an aspiring teacher, its just a bunch of teachers trying to teach each other, they make noises abt being students too but theres this hardly concealed undercurrent of ambition to dominate, and everyone is just sort of talking over each other in this inane gibberish, its v sad!

lag∞n, Thursday, 2 February 2012 15:22 (2 years ago) Permalink

xp to horseshoe -- idk, I thought it was for me. I'm not going to plug it though. I'm way more fascinated by the political stuff -- like why Erhard had to flee the country and the whole network of mass encounter groups that were exploding in the 70s (and which obviously stuff like Mindvalley is the child of).

Mordy, Thursday, 2 February 2012 15:22 (2 years ago) Permalink

Back to Mindvalley briefly -- I was looking at their website and they remind me of Entertainment720.

Mordy, Thursday, 2 February 2012 15:24 (2 years ago) Permalink

mindvalley is my fav name for anything, really disappointed i didnt come up w/it myself

lag∞n, Thursday, 2 February 2012 15:25 (2 years ago) Permalink

Wonder if these businesses are designed specifically to attract those types of people. When people are looking for help and guidance they're vulnerable, and some people when they're vulnerable are very suggestible or at the worst looking to lose themselves into something ... don't know much about Landmark itself, but you get people who can be easily exploited. Makes me sick to think about.

Rethinking your context about stuff is a good idea ... reminds me of Buddhism or even 7 Habits/Dale Carnegie kinda stuff, and totally appeals to common sense. But even that can be a hook all depending on how it's used.

Spectrum, Thursday, 2 February 2012 15:26 (2 years ago) Permalink

mindvalley is v arrested development-y

horseshoe, Thursday, 2 February 2012 15:28 (2 years ago) Permalink

ok can we stop being analytical and go back to finding awesome craziness to link?

mh, Thursday, 2 February 2012 15:28 (2 years ago) Permalink

life coach FAQ

the parable is the parable of the (Lamp), Thursday, 2 February 2012 15:29 (2 years ago) Permalink

Interesting btw how Tony Robbins has shifted from sketchy/cult-y to more the TED Talk style of self-improvement.

Burritos are one of the things I'm nostalgic about!!! (Eazy), Thursday, 2 February 2012 15:34 (2 years ago) Permalink

I had a roommate who was really into Landmark. Mostly it seemed like she had never reached an adult level of emotional function, and Lmark was showing her how to grow up. It was kind of like remedial emotional life skills, or at least that's what she was getting out of it and coming home to talk about.

It seemed like kind of dumb obvious shit to me, but she was a nice person who meant well and had had a lot of bad/violent things happen to her, and been poor and without options. Considering all of that, she had kind of made a success of herself, and she looooooved Landmark.

one little aioli (Laurel), Thursday, 2 February 2012 15:36 (2 years ago) Permalink

Mostly it seemed like she had never reached an adult level of emotional function

tbf this describes like 90% of the human beings i interact with on a daily basis on ilx and in real life.

Mordy, Thursday, 2 February 2012 15:37 (2 years ago) Permalink

lol there are some outlier TED Talks that are suspicious

mh, Thursday, 2 February 2012 15:38 (2 years ago) Permalink

I happen to know some people on ilx and irl too, and when I say that she was emotionally dysfunctional/unlearned, I mean in comparison to the other people I have known.

one little aioli (Laurel), Thursday, 2 February 2012 15:45 (2 years ago) Permalink

mindvalley is v arrested development-y

Located at the base of Fuck Mountain.

gonna give her the old fuquay-varina (Jenny), Thursday, 2 February 2012 15:46 (2 years ago) Permalink

yeah there are definitely some dubious TED talks...
xp

obliquity of the ecliptic (rrrobyn), Thursday, 2 February 2012 15:47 (2 years ago) Permalink

ted is generally dubious imho

lag∞n, Thursday, 2 February 2012 15:48 (2 years ago) Permalink

just the whole culture

lag∞n, Thursday, 2 February 2012 15:49 (2 years ago) Permalink

This is such high end motivational stuff. I am really interested in the low end -- like this class by Alan Salami, LCSW

Want to learn how to talk to anyone at anytime and make a good impression. Are your fears of rejection in your way? Come learn how to:
o Overcome your fears
o Feel good about yourself and what you have to say
o Project self-confidence
o Start and continue conversations
We will practice self-image building and power communication skills. Alan Salami LCSW is an NLP Master Practitioner and Psychotherapist. He specializes in assisting people to learn new mental skills to transform their lives. Mat. Fee: $10

http://www.discoverycenter.cc/classes/il3556.htm

La Lechera, Thursday, 2 February 2012 15:49 (2 years ago) Permalink

Start and continue conversations

La Lechera, Thursday, 2 February 2012 15:49 (2 years ago) Permalink

I happen to know some people on ilx and irl too, and when I say that she was emotionally dysfunctional/unlearned, I mean in comparison to the other people I have known.

lol, fair enough. I was just trying to make the point that humans in general kinda suck at basic emotional competencies, but that's probably a discussion for another thread.

Mordy, Thursday, 2 February 2012 15:50 (2 years ago) Permalink

o Feel good about yourself and what you have to say

nbd

lag∞n, Thursday, 2 February 2012 15:50 (2 years ago) Permalink

Alan Salami LCSW is an NLP Master Practitioner and Psychotherapist.

first glance thought this said Alan Salami LCSW is an NLP Master Practitioner and Psychobabblist.

Mordy, Thursday, 2 February 2012 15:50 (2 years ago) Permalink

The business development/futurism/positivity/self improvement axis is a slippery slope.

guys check this out, specifically the course titles that are of the form "If I'm X then how come I'm not rich/famous"

http://www.floatinguniversity.com/courses

mh, Thursday, 2 February 2012 15:52 (2 years ago) Permalink

Pleased to see local ChILX hero Alan Salami itt.

gonna give her the old fuquay-varina (Jenny), Thursday, 2 February 2012 15:53 (2 years ago) Permalink

i think that might be the practical philosophy stuff i used to see advertised on MTA a lot. certainly something like that

Mordy, Thursday, 2 February 2012 15:53 (2 years ago) Permalink

These are not quite the same, but the format of:
Listen to genuine experts speak in broad, motivational terms about their fields
->
You are going to get some sort of insights and start your own business or come up with a revolutionary idea

mh, Thursday, 2 February 2012 15:54 (2 years ago) Permalink

While we're at it, how about this place?!

this is gonna be lol hueg

La Lechera, Thursday, 2 February 2012 15:54 (2 years ago) Permalink

lol those practical philosophy ads xp

lag∞n, Thursday, 2 February 2012 15:54 (2 years ago) Permalink

That's Iowa btw. AKA Utopia.

La Lechera, Thursday, 2 February 2012 15:55 (2 years ago) Permalink

I think that one that's always on the train is...another culty movement...energy manipulation, kind of...shoot WHAT is it called??

one little aioli (Laurel), Thursday, 2 February 2012 15:55 (2 years ago) Permalink

Founded by a lady named...Mary??

one little aioli (Laurel), Thursday, 2 February 2012 15:55 (2 years ago) Permalink

No, I don't know. I can't remember.

one little aioli (Laurel), Thursday, 2 February 2012 15:56 (2 years ago) Permalink

lag∞n, Thursday, 2 February 2012 15:56 (2 years ago) Permalink

oh man, anything that says maharishi

Is that referring to the maharishi school in Fairfield? It is a very interesting little community in that they have all these stores and nice stuff and it's in the middle of nowhere! I kind of wanted to go see David Lynch speak there a few years ago, lol

mh, Thursday, 2 February 2012 15:56 (2 years ago) Permalink

u really shouldve gone to that

lag∞n, Thursday, 2 February 2012 15:57 (2 years ago) Permalink

Yes! My husband is from there.

La Lechera, Thursday, 2 February 2012 15:57 (2 years ago) Permalink

I have been there many times too, obvs, but he grew up there. That place is BANANAS.

La Lechera, Thursday, 2 February 2012 15:57 (2 years ago) Permalink

btw something abt that photo of the tower of invincibility looks not quite real idk

lag∞n, Thursday, 2 February 2012 15:58 (2 years ago) Permalink

this doc was pretty good

La Lechera, Thursday, 2 February 2012 15:58 (2 years ago) Permalink


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