The ILC Favourite Characters Of All Time

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26. John Constantine (Swamp Thing/Hellblazer)

(96 points)

http://www.dogmaticblog.com/images/blog_images/constantine.jpg

John Constantine is the ultimate "Mary Sue" character - pretty much everyone who writes him infects him with their own habits and concerns, and no surprise as he's the perfect vehicle to live out both yr coolness fantasies and yr bastard ones: unlike most Mary-Sues he allows writers to explore self-disgust as well as self-glorification. He's also - albeit intermittently - one of the only convincing British characters in US comics, which may explain a lot of his votes.

Greatest Moment: Despite a 200+ issue ongoing series (not bad for someone designed to look like Sting!) his biggest impact is still his first dozen or so appearances, as the plot device and Greek chorus behind "American Gothic". Alan Moore's concept of an outsider who sees how the bits fit together has been ripped off umpteen times since but these appearances are still the freshest. Swamp Thing #46, the CRISIS tie-in issue, might be the best crossover issue of all time and shows how well the guy works in a shared universe.

Tom (Groke), Wednesday, 3 May 2006 11:02 (eighteen years ago) link

Of course the Swamp Thing stuff combines Mary Sueness and Britishness to excelsis - there's nothing wannabe-smart UK types like better than to see themselves as the cynical voice of dark experience in amidst the gaudy costume parade of American life!

Tom (Groke), Wednesday, 3 May 2006 11:04 (eighteen years ago) link

Huh, I had JC down as top twenty at least. I think part of his appeal lies in the simplicity of the character concept. Despite twenty plus years of often convuluted backstory, all you really need to know is, "He's a magician. He drinks smokes and swears. He's a bit of a bastard." There's none of the reliance on comic lore and postmodernism that so many recent creations have.

chap who would dare to be a nerd, not a geek (chap), Wednesday, 3 May 2006 11:15 (eighteen years ago) link

Is it a consistent part of his character that he's a magician who would rather be a schemer, he avoids blatant displays of power?

That's one of my favourite aspects of him, which is why my favourite moment is still the big scene in Books Of Magic.

Andrew Farrell (afarrell), Wednesday, 3 May 2006 11:27 (eighteen years ago) link

The Constantine chapter is easily the best part of that boringly expositional and bafflingly overrated book.

chap who would dare to be a nerd, not a geek (chap), Wednesday, 3 May 2006 11:30 (eighteen years ago) link

Yeah he's good in BoM too, again cos he's a Best Supporting Actor rather than Best Actor. I have barely ever enjoyed Hellblazer the comic, it tends to brutally lack thrill-power, but he is - or used to be - an incredibly high-impact guest star.

Tom (Groke), Wednesday, 3 May 2006 11:30 (eighteen years ago) link

25. The Spirit (The Spirit)

(99 points)

http://www.austinbooks.com/images/DCArchiveWESpirit17.jpg

Leaving aside the visual mastery and narrative genius of Will Eisner, Denny Colt still stands as a classic character. The Spirit contained everything we would love about adventure heroes in the years to come. Like James Bond, he knew the importance of a well-tailored suit. Like Indiana Jones, he usually took more punches than he threw. He was occasionally cruel to those he cared about, but he always maintained a stoic sense of duty. In a lot of ways, he was camp before camp was cool. (Huk-L)

Greatest Moment: "The Post-War Strips" sez Huk.

Tom (Groke), Wednesday, 3 May 2006 11:47 (eighteen years ago) link

I've still never read any Eisner. This is a MASSIVE oversight, right?

chap who would dare to be a nerd, not a geek (chap), Wednesday, 3 May 2006 12:33 (eighteen years ago) link

There's a reason that the Spirit was very much best when Feiffer was writing.

kit brash (kit brash), Wednesday, 3 May 2006 13:05 (eighteen years ago) link

JC would've been in my top five probably, but I didn't vote. He seems like the best comics character for audience identification, having a kind of believable, non-fabulist escapism that a superhero wouldn't have.

As for the Spirit--it's one of my favorite comics, but does anyone actually like the Spirit? I've never wondered what would happen to him, what he was like, etc. He just seemed like an automated "Main Character" for Eisner to send out into gigantic diminishing points of perspective and multi-colored postmodern metafictions.

kenchen, Wednesday, 3 May 2006 14:14 (eighteen years ago) link

I think that's exactly what I like about him.

Huk-L (Huk-L), Wednesday, 3 May 2006 14:19 (eighteen years ago) link

Like Indiana Jones, he usually took more punches than he threw. He was occasionally cruel to those he cared about, but he always maintained a stoic sense of duty.

but this could be any noir hero no? philip marlowe, the continental op...

s1ocki (slutsky), Wednesday, 3 May 2006 14:19 (eighteen years ago) link

Yes but how many other convincing noir heroes are there in comics?

Also - this is true of the Surfer too - a "good character" isn't just down to the writer! How the character stands, poses, moves, looks, smiles are just as important and that's where the Spirit picks up points and votes, surely.

Tom (Groke), Wednesday, 3 May 2006 14:21 (eighteen years ago) link

that was meant as a response to this:

The Spirit contained everything we would love about adventure heroes in the years to come

what i meant was a lot of those qualities were also contained by heroes who were the spirit's contemporaries.

s1ocki (slutsky), Wednesday, 3 May 2006 14:24 (eighteen years ago) link

Ohh sorry!

Tom (Groke), Wednesday, 3 May 2006 14:28 (eighteen years ago) link

i mean, "shared by," not "contained by," which sounds really weird!

s1ocki (slutsky), Wednesday, 3 May 2006 14:30 (eighteen years ago) link

Yeah, but the Spirit stayed that way. Batman and Superman (who, indeed, bore many of those traits in the 40s) have developed "personalities" and stuff, but the Spirit, by default, since he didn't have any adventures beyond the fifties (not counting the several revivals), is a fly in amber or whatever.

Huk-L (Huk-L), Wednesday, 3 May 2006 14:31 (eighteen years ago) link

Back on Hellblazer--the best dialectic between indie comics and superheroes? It's got the relationship stuff, introspection, and politics of the former, and the "Look out, a firebreathing dragon!!!" of the latter.

kenchen, Wednesday, 3 May 2006 14:39 (eighteen years ago) link

I don't have much to add here except that I'm really enjoying the countdown. Thanks, Tom!

Austin Still (Austin, Still), Wednesday, 3 May 2006 23:00 (eighteen years ago) link

Brian Azarello's baffling sex-cockney Hellblazer is definitely the worst thing I've read since my ILC-sponsored return to comics.

Chuck_Tatum (Chuck_Tatum), Thursday, 4 May 2006 10:20 (eighteen years ago) link

Inspired by the Spirit-love upthread, I have ordered to the first two volumes of the Spirit Archives. If it's not as good as you say, then it's coming out of your wages.

aldo_cowpat (aldo_cowpat), Friday, 5 May 2006 09:41 (eighteen years ago) link

oh dear the early Spirits are not so hott, unfortunately - tho' I disagree w/ kit's argt that Feiffer wrote the best Spirit strips - his 'moon' storyline, even w/ added wally wood, is esp. duff imho

Ward Fowler (Ward Fowler), Friday, 5 May 2006 11:01 (eighteen years ago) link

I am hoping for a series of Showcase Spirits, personally.

Martin Skidmore (Martin Skidmore), Friday, 5 May 2006 12:01 (eighteen years ago) link

I think it doesn't get REALLY GOOD until about Vol. 10, Aldo. I'm so sorry. (Cuz they're expensive!)

Huk-L (Huk-L), Friday, 5 May 2006 13:28 (eighteen years ago) link

I suspect I will still like them anyway and build to the good stuff, and importing them hasn't been that expensive - for reference, they're about $70 EACH in the UK and I got two shipped for that from the US.

aldo_cowpat (aldo_cowpat), Friday, 5 May 2006 13:35 (eighteen years ago) link

oh, that's pretty good.
Regardless of how good they eventually become, IMHO, they're still vastly superior to any of their contemporary costumed crimefighter comics.

Huk-L (Huk-L), Friday, 5 May 2006 13:39 (eighteen years ago) link

24. She-Hulk (She-Hulk)

(103 points)

http://www.zeuscomics.com/images/covers/she-hulk-v4-3.jpg

She's big. She's green. She's the smartest gal in the room. She hates clothing. (Huk-L)

A nothing character that lots of people have done a surprising amount with. (Pete)

Greatest Moment: defeating Blizzard with the power of booze (Mark C)

Tom (Groke), Friday, 5 May 2006 14:37 (eighteen years ago) link

I haven't checked this very well, but my impression is that aside from two stories in Archive 11, Archives 3-11 don't really have anything by Eisner.

asdf, Friday, 5 May 2006 16:01 (eighteen years ago) link

She-Hulk beats The Thing? Is this bizarro world or something?

chap who would dare to be a nerd, not a geek (chap), Friday, 5 May 2006 16:09 (eighteen years ago) link

Dan Slott hadn't written the Thing yet.

Huk-L (Huk-L), Friday, 5 May 2006 16:56 (eighteen years ago) link

Did Feiffer do the Spirit in space stuff? Yeah that's lame. I should amend to "most of the best Spirit was when it was being mainly done by Eisner & Feiffer, rather than Feiffer and anyone else, or any teams of anonyhacks, or Eisner and any other main collaborators." Eisner did do plenty of good stories before he let Feiffer on, of course, but from what I've read the quality stayed much higher consistently during that period (also note that the collaboration invigorated Eisner enough that he engaged with the strip a lot more than he often had previously [though this may have also been largely economic I s'pose, as the studio was shrinking and there weren't enough teenagers to hand off to]).

And the good Eisner-written stories from the Spirit totally pwn everything he did post-retirement obv.

kit brash (kit brash), Friday, 5 May 2006 21:40 (eighteen years ago) link

two months pass...
so...

Amadeo (Amadeo G.), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 03:18 (seventeen years ago) link

Oh, man - I didn't realize the Shulkie picture was a Horngo special!

David R. (popshots75`), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 03:20 (seventeen years ago) link

I'm not gonna badger Tom right now, because I like the Freaky Trigger revamp a lot.

Maybe tomorrow, though...

chap who would dare to start Raaatpackin (chap), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 21:01 (seventeen years ago) link

four weeks pass...
BEFORE ILX DIES, PLEASE.

aldo_cowpat (aldo_cowpat), Thursday, 10 August 2006 08:08 (seventeen years ago) link

I realise I've just built your hopes up into thinking this was Tom posting.

aldo_cowpat (aldo_cowpat), Thursday, 10 August 2006 08:10 (seventeen years ago) link

Re: "I haven't checked this very well, but my impression is that aside from two stories in Archive 11, Archives 3-11 don't really have anything by Eisner.
-- asdf (asdfasd...), May 5th, 2006"

You're pretty much right -- this would have been circa '42-'45, when Eisner diverted his attentions from comic books to beating the Nazis, albeit using comic books to do it, using them as instruction manuals for GIs. Still, Lou Fine was drawing El Spirito, and since he was one of the three best Golden Age artists, that's no bad thing.

David

David Simpson (David Simpson), Thursday, 10 August 2006 10:17 (seventeen years ago) link

http://img291.imageshack.us/img291/7288/stevienixvz7.jpg

Daniel_Rf (Daniel_Rf), Thursday, 10 August 2006 10:43 (seventeen years ago) link

http://www.atwmusic.com/6649.gif

lumberingwoodsman (Chris Hill), Thursday, 10 August 2006 12:23 (seventeen years ago) link

Maybe we should just make up the rest of the list.

23. Heathcliff (Heathcliff and the Catillac Cats)

(4,602 points)

http://www.shoutfactory.com/img/detail/heathcliff.jpg

Imagine Garfield -- but funnier!

c('°c) (Leee), Thursday, 10 August 2006 19:51 (seventeen years ago) link

I was going to suggest that myself

22. Juggernaut/Cain Marko (X-Men)
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/e/ea/Juggernaut.PNG

Greatest Moment: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GV_3cBmAHjA

Jessie the Monster (scarymonsterrr), Thursday, 10 August 2006 20:06 (seventeen years ago) link

21. Forbush Man.

http://es.geocities.com/beatlescomicsmelgar3/notbrand8b.jpg

He's got a pot. On his HEAD. A pothead, gettit?

Greatest moment: beating the Meatles. Whoops, meeting the Beatles.

lumberingwoodsman (Chris Hill), Thursday, 10 August 2006 20:34 (seventeen years ago) link

Addendum for Heathcliff:
Greatest moment: You remember that time he said he really liked lasagna, and Jon Arbuckle... oh, wait.

c('°c) (Leee), Thursday, 10 August 2006 20:43 (seventeen years ago) link

20. J. Wellington Wimpy (Popeye The Sailor)
(665 points)
http://www.popeye-n-olive.com/image/Wimpy-poem.jpg

Wimpy is probably best know for
his consumption of hamburgers,
and anything else if hamburgers
are not available. Here is his famous,
"I would gladly pay you Tuesday
for a Hamburger today." line.

-- David R

chaki (chaki), Thursday, 10 August 2006 20:49 (seventeen years ago) link

With those line breaks, shouldn't that be attributed to Squirrel_Police

Jessie the Monster (scarymonsterrr), Thursday, 10 August 2006 20:55 (seventeen years ago) link

19. Calvin's Dad (Calvin and Hobbes)
(889 points)
http://www.cooperativeindividualism.org/calvin-science-lesson-from-father.gif

if calvin's dad isn't top 5 there's something wrong somewhere!!
-- J.D.

(not to give anything away JD but i sorta kinda address the "calvin's dad" issue in my comments --- albeit in a way that will possibly disappoint you!!)
-- mark s

J.D. (Justyn Dillingham), Thursday, 10 August 2006 21:52 (seventeen years ago) link

18. Sonic the Hedgehog (Sonic the Hedgehog)
(999 points)
http://images.gildia.pl/ggk/gry/sonic_the_hedgehog_x360/okladka/w200/

REPENT THE END IS NIGH, FOR WHEN SONIC THEE HEDGEHOGS COMiCS REACH THEE ISSUE 200 THEE END SHALL BE UPON US

-- the eunuchs, Cassim and Mustafa, who guarded Abdur Ali's harem

chap who would dare to start Raaatpackin (chap), Thursday, 10 August 2006 23:10 (seventeen years ago) link

i bought the first ever issue of sonic when it came out!

J.D. (Justyn Dillingham), Thursday, 10 August 2006 23:47 (seventeen years ago) link

I can't believe there are more Sonic comics than Simpsons comics (which is at #120 according to wikipedia).

Jordan (Jordan), Thursday, 10 August 2006 23:53 (seventeen years ago) link

17. Ralph Drabble (Drabble)
(3 points)
http://www.comics.com/comics/drabble/images/cast_drabble_Ralph.gif

“Ah, I love “Drabble”. The dad’s like an unfunny version of me.”
-Homer Simpson

chaki (chaki), Thursday, 10 August 2006 23:55 (seventeen years ago) link


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