I'm sorry but Paul Simon is so overrated

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yeah this is true! he's really good! but he's really not very daring - "Richard Corey" is a great poem by an underrated poet, but it's sort of telling that Robinson's sort of you-can-parse-this-cleanly style is where he goes when Cohen & Dylan are reading say Baudelaire and Rimbaud

― pathos of the unwarranted encore (underrated aerosmith bootlegs I have owned), Sunday, August 7, 2011 12:18 PM (20 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

youre a snob

max, Sunday, 7 August 2011 16:38 (3 years ago) Permalink

the mama pajama rolled out of bed and logged onto ILX to post

Neanderthal, Sunday, 7 August 2011 16:39 (3 years ago) Permalink

youre a snob

pathos of the unwarranted encore (underrated aerosmith bootlegs I have owned), Sunday, 7 August 2011 16:43 (3 years ago) Permalink

do u have any french poets that i could smear on my leonard cohen sandwich

max, Sunday, 7 August 2011 16:45 (3 years ago) Permalink

it's true i have been really into clarity in song lyrics lately. i like leonard cohen, too, though; it wouldn't really occur to me to pit him against simon.

horseshoe, Sunday, 7 August 2011 16:46 (3 years ago) Permalink

i don't get cohen until he puts on a corny deep voice and starts singing things like STICK ANOTHER TURTLE ON THE FIRE / GUYS LIKE ME ARE MAD FOR TURTLE MEAT. that's obv better than paul simon but that aside they're about on par for me.

my Sonicare toothbrush (difficult listening hour), Sunday, 7 August 2011 16:46 (3 years ago) Permalink

"no one listens to me, I might as well be a Leonard Cohen record..."

Neanderthal, Sunday, 7 August 2011 16:46 (3 years ago) Permalink

i like leonard cohen too i was just being mean

max, Sunday, 7 August 2011 16:46 (3 years ago) Permalink

i value your services itt max

horseshoe, Sunday, 7 August 2011 16:47 (3 years ago) Permalink

also surm y u braek hart

horseshoe, Sunday, 7 August 2011 16:47 (3 years ago) Permalink

paul simon is the best and people who dont like him can go str8 to hell

max, Sunday, 7 August 2011 16:48 (3 years ago) Permalink

exactly

horseshoe, Sunday, 7 August 2011 16:48 (3 years ago) Permalink

been listening to hearts and bones, the album, a lot lately. the smartest people in the world are gathered in los angeles / to analyze our love affair and finally unscramble us.

the new album is really good, too.

horseshoe, Sunday, 7 August 2011 16:52 (3 years ago) Permalink

max srsly tho I get that you love Paul Simon, kick ass, but it's not snobby to say that he's formally a lot more limited than Dylan, Joni Mitchell, Leonard Cohen, Randy Newman, Phil Ochs, Townes van Zandt, Neil Young, and others - those people all really stretch out a lot. Not always successfully! but Paul Simon is musically kind of...ignorant?

Simon doesn't really dislike the idea of musical theater, only what the musical theater has become. So as much as he may shake his head in dismay at the success of "Cats," he happily listens to the likes of George and Ira Gershwin, Jerome Kern, Oscar Hammerstein and Cole Porter.

"It's not rock and roll, but I liked it," he says, then laughs. "I didn't mean to parody the Stones, but that's exactly what it is. I liked it.

"But it ended up in a weird cul de sac -- probably because it was never energized by rock and roll," he says. As Simon sees it, the trouble with modern musical theater is that "it's all descended either from the musical theater from its heyday in the '40s and '50s, or it's the English variant that Andrew Lloyd Webber popularized. Those are the two mainstreams of what a Broadway musical is today."

Trouble is, there's nothing terribly special about the music these plays employ. "There are all of these different stories out there, but the music kind of all sounds the same," Simon says.

You're sort of doomed to complacency when you think that what the stage that gives us Sondheim needs is...you!!!

pathos of the unwarranted encore (underrated aerosmith bootlegs I have owned), Sunday, 7 August 2011 16:52 (3 years ago) Permalink

the smartest people in the world are gathered in los angeles / to analyze our love affair and finally unscramble us.

typed this in all caps, clicked "submit", your post appeared

my Sonicare toothbrush (difficult listening hour), Sunday, 7 August 2011 16:52 (3 years ago) Permalink

i guess i should red some edwin arlington robinson

xp <3

horseshoe, Sunday, 7 August 2011 16:53 (3 years ago) Permalink

I mean I will defend him against people who say he sucks, but he really is kind of a Lou Reed figure. "Hey guys guess what I just discovered last week and now I have a lot to say about it? African music!!!"

pathos of the unwarranted encore (underrated aerosmith bootlegs I have owned), Sunday, 7 August 2011 16:54 (3 years ago) Permalink

Graceland, which is the only record of his that I have burned into my brain deeply enough to play this game with, has some flat-out corny lyrics but imho they are generally salvaged by the delivery (best example that comes to mind = "hey señorita, that's astute / why don't we get together and call ourselves an institute?")

then again it also has its moments of absolutely undeniable brilliance e.g. "she said 'honey, take me dancing' but they ended up sleeping in a doorway"

swaguirre, the wrath of basedgod (bernard snowy), Sunday, 7 August 2011 16:54 (3 years ago) Permalink

"Next, I will discover Cuba and Brazil, you ungrateful fucks!!"

pathos of the unwarranted encore (underrated aerosmith bootlegs I have owned), Sunday, 7 August 2011 16:55 (3 years ago) Permalink

aerosmith OTM re:sondheim/theatre/complaceny

chief content officer (m coleman), Sunday, 7 August 2011 16:55 (3 years ago) Permalink

that was a dumb thing he said about musical theater and maybe it does reflect badly on his approach to music but the self-titled album is still one of my favorite things in the world.

horseshoe, Sunday, 7 August 2011 16:56 (3 years ago) Permalink

not tryna to play cap'n save-a-dilettante here but didn't the whole apartheid/sanctions situation make it kind of... difficult... for western musicians to engage more deeply with their african peers?

swaguirre, the wrath of basedgod (bernard snowy), Sunday, 7 August 2011 16:56 (3 years ago) Permalink

also real-time LOLs at this:

It is so clear that the talent behind Simon and Garfunkel rests solely in his taller, silent partner.

tho I would love to read a passionate defense of Artie's artsitry

chief content officer (m coleman), Sunday, 7 August 2011 16:57 (3 years ago) Permalink

"Next, I will discover Cuba and Brazil, you ungrateful fucks!!"

― pathos of the unwarranted encore (underrated aerosmith bootlegs I have owned), Sunday, August 7, 2011 4:55 PM (3 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

... idg where you're getting this from

Gatsby was a success, in the end, wasn't he? (D-40), Sunday, 7 August 2011 16:59 (3 years ago) Permalink

i think graceland is one of my least favourite just because of the big gated drums

℗⎣▲✘ (ico), Sunday, 7 August 2011 17:00 (3 years ago) Permalink

fwiw simon captures such a unique vibe w/ his lyrics and songwriting that calling him 'limited' in comparison to neil young joni mitchell et al seems really shortsighted. limited in what sense? being himself?

Gatsby was a success, in the end, wasn't he? (D-40), Sunday, 7 August 2011 17:00 (3 years ago) Permalink

lou reed vs paul simon might actually be competitive on ilm

iatee, Sunday, 7 August 2011 17:00 (3 years ago) Permalink

haha i knew i would virulently disagree with plax EVENTUALLY in this thread

Gatsby was a success, in the end, wasn't he? (D-40), Sunday, 7 August 2011 17:00 (3 years ago) Permalink

lol

℗⎣▲✘ (ico), Sunday, 7 August 2011 17:01 (3 years ago) Permalink

Stealing song from Los Lobos: Dud
Dabblings in and pronouncements on Broadway: Dud
Downplaying Artie's G contribution: Dud
Not making use of surrealist lyrical tradition in rock drawn from reading a few French poets and borrowing/stealing lyrics from Robert Johnson and old weird America songs on the assumption that they had already been borrowed: Fine with me
Everything else: Classic

Scharlach Sometimes (James Redd and the Blecchs), Sunday, 7 August 2011 17:01 (3 years ago) Permalink

i mean i love it and along with rumours its the album that i inherited from my parents but hearts and bones or rhythm of the saints easily take it (h+b is patchy as hell though)

℗⎣▲✘ (ico), Sunday, 7 August 2011 17:02 (3 years ago) Permalink

fwiw simon captures such a unique vibe w/ his lyrics and songwriting that calling him 'limited' in comparison to neil young joni mitchell et al seems really shortsighted. limited in what sense? being himself?

limited in the sense of being pretty content with the self he located early on. Joni Mitchell can't stand to sit still for longer than an album or two, ditto Neil Young. Change up the instrumentation on "Me & Julio" and it fits fine on "Graceland."

pathos of the unwarranted encore (underrated aerosmith bootlegs I have owned), Sunday, 7 August 2011 17:03 (3 years ago) Permalink

john dogg if u want me to dig up bob dylan and leonard cohen saying embarrassing things in their interviews i will but you gotta wait till i get off work

max, Sunday, 7 August 2011 17:04 (3 years ago) Permalink

do you like the 70s albums, plax? also i want Lamp to come back and explain his challop: S&G is better than Simon solo, or, like, that jerry landis stuff?

horseshoe, Sunday, 7 August 2011 17:04 (3 years ago) Permalink

keep a cool head and always carry a light bulb xp

my Sonicare toothbrush (difficult listening hour), Sunday, 7 August 2011 17:04 (3 years ago) Permalink

lou reed vs paul simon might actually be competitive on ilm

― iatee, Sunday, August 7, 2011 1:00 PM (22 seconds ago)


Think these two team upped briefly as part of Bizarro Wilburys in Dion DiMucci Rock and Roll Hall of Fame induction ceremony performance, but can't find the photo anymore.

Scharlach Sometimes (James Redd and the Blecchs), Sunday, 7 August 2011 17:05 (3 years ago) Permalink

teamed up

Scharlach Sometimes (James Redd and the Blecchs), Sunday, 7 August 2011 17:05 (3 years ago) Permalink

I mean I will defend him against people who say he sucks, but he really is kind of a Lou Reed figure. "Hey guys guess what I just discovered last week and now I have a lot to say about it? African music!!!"

― pathos of the unwarranted encore (underrated aerosmith bootlegs I have owned), Sunday, August 7, 2011 12:54 PM (6 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

it may be unsavory but if this is what it takes to make a great album then so be it

ice cr?m, Sunday, 7 August 2011 17:06 (3 years ago) Permalink

limited in the sense of being pretty content with the self he located early on. Joni Mitchell can't stand to sit still for longer than an album or two, ditto Neil Young.

― pathos of the unwarranted encore (underrated aerosmith bootlegs I have owned), Sunday, August 7, 2011 1:03 PM (2 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

i love neil young like a brother but srlsy UH

ice cr?m, Sunday, 7 August 2011 17:07 (3 years ago) Permalink

for every embarrassing bob dylan interview quote you could come up with 10 'worth putting in a book' utterly classic quotes.e not sure you could say that about paul simon. (or anybody else really)

iatee, Sunday, 7 August 2011 17:08 (3 years ago) Permalink

bob dylan and leonard cohen both give great interviews, it's true. don't really think of leonard cohen as someone who's constantly switching things up, not that it matters, great lyrics are great lyrics.

horseshoe, Sunday, 7 August 2011 17:09 (3 years ago) Permalink

... idg where you're getting this from

it's just a lol

I mean it is true that it's a little weird when a guy who never showed any interest whatsoever in these musics just suddenly wakes up one day and says "whaddaya know, African music!" and, having had towering success with that...loses all interest in pursuing the genre further - like "I did African music, now I'll conquer the islands" - those musics are titanic, rich, endlessly complex, to "do an album" in that style is a little colonial you know? it's not like it's any crime to explore and participate in the musics of other cultures but when it looks like your interest was limited to some dilettante cultural-buffetism...idk man. Like again I think the dude is good but I would think that if you loved that music you'd explore Ghana, Nigeria, the sub-Sahara instead of going "well I did some South African stuff...now, on to Brazil!!"

pathos of the unwarranted encore (underrated aerosmith bootlegs I have owned), Sunday, 7 August 2011 17:09 (3 years ago) Permalink

you know what i look for in music, great interview skills

ice cr?m, Sunday, 7 August 2011 17:10 (3 years ago) Permalink

lol

horseshoe, Sunday, 7 August 2011 17:10 (3 years ago) Permalink

So you are saying he should go the Ry Cooder route, John?

Scharlach Sometimes (James Redd and the Blecchs), Sunday, 7 August 2011 17:11 (3 years ago) Permalink

I mean obv everybody says dumb shit in interviews but in this case it's kind of evidence that Paul Simon's awareness of the music he's working with is profoundly limited. "What Broadway needs is rock and roll!" --srsly you guys are into that grandpaism? cool get yrs but it's kind of a v. lame look.

Joni Mitchell fwiw is way worse in interviews but I haven't see her say shit that is musically just igno-extreme like that

pathos of the unwarranted encore (underrated aerosmith bootlegs I have owned), Sunday, 7 August 2011 17:11 (3 years ago) Permalink

lol john as a child of the 80s i knew you eventually wouldnt be able to resist calling graceland 'a lil colonial'

ice cr?m, Sunday, 7 August 2011 17:12 (3 years ago) Permalink

aero everyone thinks what he said about musical theater was dumb

horseshoe, Sunday, 7 August 2011 17:12 (3 years ago) Permalink

xp I'm saying a guy who "dabbles in world music" deserves some routine "srsly dude fuck off"s along with the propers he deserves for being a great songwriter

pathos of the unwarranted encore (underrated aerosmith bootlegs I have owned), Sunday, 7 August 2011 17:13 (3 years ago) Permalink

haha yes what i like about paul simon is his grandpaism

are we even talking about lyrics anymore or just stuff that annoys john about paul simon

max, Sunday, 7 August 2011 17:13 (3 years ago) Permalink


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