I understand, Ian, but my larger point is more, like, where do you draw the line? So you won't stock Skrewdriver because of racist/skinhead stuff, but what about church-burners? Murderers? I'm not trying to start a spat, it's just an interesting topic. I work in the wine business, and I remember post 9/11 when a certain famous Burgundy grower's (singular and amazing) wines were ceremoniously yanked from many shelves because of some unsavory anti-American comments he made. (And some stores went even further and gutted their stores of French wines altogether--not just because of this guy, though...) That left a really bad taste in my mouth, because I saw and continue to see wine as primarily a purely aesthetic realm where I don't have to worry about the beliefs or prejudices of the folks who produce them--and it's the same with music.
― Clarke B., Friday, 5 August 2011 14:59 (1 year ago) Permalink
Freedom Wine!
― jon /via/ chi 2.0, Friday, 5 August 2011 15:00 (1 year ago) Permalink
i think if the wine dude was like "i hate all wine stores, they're full of snobs, i'll be glad when you can just buy wine online" the stores would be within their rights to pull his products! no one said he had to distribute his wine via stores in the first place!
― call all destroyer, Friday, 5 August 2011 15:06 (1 year ago) Permalink
There really isn't a 'line' to draw imo--these are more like two isolated cases, not a trend towards limiting anyone's shopping experience.
― one dis leads to another (ian), Friday, 5 August 2011 15:08 (1 year ago) Permalink
To be totally truthful, I don't like stocking Burzum records either, but I got outvoted by my co-workers on that one.
― one dis leads to another (ian), Friday, 5 August 2011 15:10 (1 year ago) Permalink
and I think, to me, the difference between say burzum and skrewdriver, is that burzum's songs are about the lord of the rings and shit, while skrewdivers are about white pride etc. So there's something offensive in the actual content of the latter, and it's not a decision based solely on the politics of the creator.
― one dis leads to another (ian), Friday, 5 August 2011 15:13 (1 year ago) Permalink
in this way it's sort of different from wine, because when you open a bottle of wine, hate speech doesn't come pouring out. ever.
― one dis leads to another (ian), Friday, 5 August 2011 15:17 (1 year ago) Permalink
fyi when you carry burzum records, you're giving money to an unrepentant and vocal white supremicist and thusly making his life as an unrepentant and vocal white supremicist easier
― froster the poophole (Whiney G. Weingarten), Friday, 5 August 2011 15:19 (1 year ago) Permalink
i am aware of this. like i said, i was outvoted on that one. shrug. feel like maybe i'm getting trolled at this point, and i'm too hungover to continue with this silliness. xoxo
― one dis leads to another (ian), Friday, 5 August 2011 15:20 (1 year ago) Permalink
I'm with you 100% on not stocking john maus btw. "My store, my rules" is as good a defense as any when it comes to record store stock
― froster the poophole (Whiney G. Weingarten), Friday, 5 August 2011 15:21 (1 year ago) Permalink
i think sommeliers should get into those kind of metaphors. "redolent of dried cherry, cut grass, shop closures, instability, and hate speech."
― goole, Friday, 5 August 2011 15:22 (1 year ago) Permalink
though the burzum thing in brooklyn is like super weird to me. like i remember in the 90s when record stores had a VERY STRICT "no racists" policy because they didnt want to suppoort them financially. But in 2011 it's totally Ok as long as cool people like them. I'm sure if Bjork wore a Skrewdriver shirt to a shoot, stores would be diving over each other to carry their records
― froster the poophole (Whiney G. Weingarten), Friday, 5 August 2011 15:23 (1 year ago) Permalink
I get you Whiney, but as ian said above I think a lot of it does come down to content. The content of Burzum's records is not hateful or racist, but Skrewdriver's is.
― jon /via/ chi 2.0, Friday, 5 August 2011 15:32 (1 year ago) Permalink
Honestly if John Maus has a problem with paying for his music then he should just give it away for free. The fact that he isn't kind of underlying the BS-ness of his BS.
― Telephoneface (Adam Bruneau), Friday, 5 August 2011 15:36 (1 year ago) Permalink
like i remember in the 90s when record stores had a VERY STRICT "no racists" policy because they didnt want to suppoort them financially. But in 2011 it's totally Ok as long as cool people like them.
maybe you and I have p differing experiences here but it seems to me that in the 90s, as now, Burzum was more or less the singular exception to this because of various justifying getout clauses (and possibly the unspoken one, that people actually want to buy his records)
― 'what's puzzling you' is the name of my dog (DJ Mencap), Friday, 5 August 2011 15:37 (1 year ago) Permalink
I mean ftr I have noticed a kind of fetishism of the 'taboo' re: Skrewdriver and one or two other bands among like Termbo type people and other scenes made up of guys who call each other faggot but I don't think that's specifically new or what we're talking about really
― 'what's puzzling you' is the name of my dog (DJ Mencap), Friday, 5 August 2011 15:40 (1 year ago) Permalink
True enough, and I do understand and appreciate the distinction between actual lyrical content versus egregious beliefs and behaviors of artists, but there are a lot of ugly things said on that Tyler record, for instance, as well as probably hundreds of albums on the shelves. I'm equally as uncomfortable thinking that stuff is being filtered out because of unsavory lyrical content, to be honest.
(Also, Ian, sorry you're feeling like you're being trolled; I hope I'm not contributing to that, I'm just enjoying this discussion a lot. I work closely with wine shops and so the fact that an independent store is not just "a place to buy stuff" and is the sum/result of a lot of choices (ethical, aesthetic, commercial, etc, etc), debates, and concessions is always at the front of my mind, and it's cool to think and discuss that stuff in the context of record stores. I'm also hung over!)
― Clarke B., Friday, 5 August 2011 15:43 (1 year ago) Permalink
I ended up voting for "I've never been able to wrap my head around selling merch." because dude is participating in a pitchfork article so clearly self-promotion and market share aren't exactly foreign concepts to this guy.
― Telephoneface (Adam Bruneau), Friday, 5 August 2011 15:43 (1 year ago) Permalink
John Maus is basically a Washington Outsider.
― Telephoneface (Adam Bruneau), Friday, 5 August 2011 15:45 (1 year ago) Permalink
Dude clearly has issues
― Trip Maker, Friday, 5 August 2011 15:45 (1 year ago) Permalink
Nah, he's just real good at playing the indie rock attention game.
― Telephoneface (Adam Bruneau), Friday, 5 August 2011 15:46 (1 year ago) Permalink
Fun interview! Dude talks mile a minute but I like it!
― Ned Raggett, Tuesday, June 28, 2011 8:49 PM (1 month ago) Bookmark
― thomp, Friday, 5 August 2011 15:54 (1 year ago) Permalink
maybe you and I have p differing experiences here but it seems to me that in the 90s, as now, Burzum was more or less the singular exception to this because of various justifying getout clauses (and possibly the unspoken one, that people actually want to buy his records)― 'what's puzzling you' is the name of my dog (DJ Mencap), Friday, August 5, 2011 11:37 AM (16 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink
― 'what's puzzling you' is the name of my dog (DJ Mencap), Friday, August 5, 2011 11:37 AM (16 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink
i grew up in the suburbs in the 90s where no one was cool enough to listen to burzum yet, so idk.
― froster the poophole (Whiney G. Weingarten), Friday, 5 August 2011 15:55 (1 year ago) Permalink
xpost -- And I stand by that!
― Ned Raggett, Friday, 5 August 2011 15:56 (1 year ago) Permalink
RITES 4 GAYZ O YEH
― you've got male (jim in glasgow), Friday, 5 August 2011 16:00 (1 year ago) Permalink
I mean, I can't believe this guy is singing such blatant cop-hate.
― jon /via/ chi 2.0, Friday, 5 August 2011 16:06 (1 year ago) Permalink
pow pow pow pow pow
― a lagoon par la mer (psychgawsple), Friday, 5 August 2011 17:00 (1 year ago) Permalink
hey i found the world's biggest John Maus stan
https://twitter.com/#!/KeepYourReceipt
― froster the poophole (Whiney G. Weingarten), Friday, 5 August 2011 18:25 (1 year ago) Permalink
i have the suspicion that person is from minnesota
she has tweeted the mountain goats, the fleet foxes, uh, aziz ansari and... martin zellar
― goole, Friday, 5 August 2011 18:31 (1 year ago) Permalink
srsly is this a joke?
KeepYourReceipt Keep Your Receipt@MrHoratioSanz Not that he's playing Chicago, but have you listened to John Maus yet? Shit is hot!!30 Jul
KeepYourReceipt Keep Your Receipt@marcellocarlin Fuck off, John Maus is great.26 Jul
― goole, Friday, 5 August 2011 18:33 (1 year ago) Permalink
woah harsh vibes directed toward ilxors
― markers, Friday, 5 August 2011 18:41 (1 year ago) Permalink
Horatio sanz is an ilxor??
― Gatsby was a success, in the end, wasn't he? (D-40), Friday, 5 August 2011 18:47 (1 year ago) Permalink
IN DEFENCE OF JOHN MAUS:
Because his new album still unfuckwithably rules, regardless of all this shit.
― I for one am (Le Bateau Ivre), Friday, 5 August 2011 23:16 (1 year ago) Permalink
― froster the poophole (Whiney G. Weingarten), Friday, 5 August 2011 23:22 (1 year ago) Permalink
the world's first Mad Magazine fold-in post
lol at ^^^
also lol at this somehow becoming another burzum thread
― some dude, Friday, 5 August 2011 23:42 (1 year ago) Permalink
burzum is the godwins law for music geeks arguing on the internet
― I dream of vodka sandwich (jjjusten), Friday, 5 August 2011 23:46 (1 year ago) Permalink
is now my goal to get varg to do a pfork guest list
― king of torts (strongo hulkington's ghost dad), Friday, 5 August 2011 23:49 (1 year ago) Permalink
"my ringtone is a norwegian prison guard telling me my mom's on the phone"
― king of torts (strongo hulkington's ghost dad), Friday, 5 August 2011 23:51 (1 year ago) Permalink
i made some kind of comment a few months ago about how burzum exists solely to be referenced on a thousand ILM threads about musicians with offensive views, and kinda got shouted down with a bunch of "well he IS a unique case because blah blah blah"
― some dude, Friday, 5 August 2011 23:54 (1 year ago) Permalink
maybe maus will start burning down record stores
― lizard tails, a self-regenerating food source for survival (wk), Friday, 5 August 2011 23:54 (1 year ago) Permalink
I would like it if someone took a picture of a Maus holding a cat and photoshopped it so he was holding some sort of spiked LRPG cudgel.
― Death To False Camp (Doran), Saturday, 6 August 2011 00:01 (1 year ago) Permalink
A++ would read
― i genuinely thought when i first joined that he was the admin (ilxor), Sunday, 7 August 2011 17:19 (1 year ago) Permalink
not hearing the john maus ad :(
― markers, Sunday, 7 August 2011 19:03 (1 year ago) Permalink
lol martin zellar and john maus should do a chilly new wave version of "i wanna drive the zamboni"
― om nom nom nnamdi asomugha (upper mississippi sh@kedown), Sunday, 7 August 2011 19:10 (1 year ago) Permalink
New album is so good. Rights for Gays is a totally fun jam. Much better songs than Ariel Pink. Great show too.
Who cares about stupid interviews.
― filthy dylan, Sunday, 7 August 2011 20:14 (1 year ago) Permalink
i sang rights for gays so much at work that everybody was singing it on friday.
― ℗⎣▲✘ (ico), Sunday, 7 August 2011 20:40 (1 year ago) Permalink
rights for gays.
oh yeah.
:)
― lacanthrope (Drugs A. Money), Sunday, 7 August 2011 20:49 (1 year ago) Permalink