Honestly, this Dylan-is-the-true-twat-here! kinda thing is just reflexive contrarianism.
Which is fun and all, I know, but it leads to ghastly statements like these:
Does a Dylan song ever make anyone smile? Is he ever funny?
Someone else came up with the examples. But I do recommend that you try actually listening to Bob Dylan records someday, some are quite good.
And why tell your readers that Donovan has less influence than Dylan on young songwriters when influential characters like Devendra Banhart are citing Donovan and not Dylan in their interviews?
So -- by the "influence as measured by namechecks in interviews" standard, we have, in the Donovan corner, neo-freak-folkie Devendra Banhart.
Brooooce Springsteen, Leonard Cohen, Paul Westerberg, John fucking Lennon, Elvis Costello, Patti Smith, Richard Hell, Johnny Cash, and just about everyone else who ever picked up a guitar post-1964 to thread please.
Dylan was a speed-addled asshole in the Don't Look Back period, but to go from there to "Donovan is more influential" is just fucking madness.
― A|ex P@reene (Pareene), Saturday, 10 September 2005 16:47 (eighteen years ago) link
I think the point, for me at least, is that ok, Dylan is obviously the greater songwriter and contributed more to music and on the whole I will have logged ten times as many hours listening to Dylan as Donovan in my life.
But that doesn't diminish Donovan, who was a really great songwriter and musician in his own right, and whose best work actually sounds nothing like Dylan and often does a fantastic job of gently mocking psychadelia while reveling in its excess. Yeah, Dylan is greater. I just hate the cliche that sad, weighty songs are "important" and pleasant, sweet songs are "fluff," and that Donovan sounded exactly like Dylan, except when he didn't, and then he wasn't any good anyway because he was too "light."
― Hurting (Hurting), Saturday, 10 September 2005 17:40 (eighteen years ago) link
But hey, Donovan's a nice guy though.
― Jazzbo (jmcgaw), Saturday, 10 September 2005 18:37 (eighteen years ago) link
― Jazzbo (jmcgaw), Saturday, 10 September 2005 18:39 (eighteen years ago) link
― Hurting (Hurting), Saturday, 10 September 2005 18:59 (eighteen years ago) link
― Hurting (Hurting), Saturday, 10 September 2005 19:00 (eighteen years ago) link
― Jazzbo (jmcgaw), Saturday, 10 September 2005 19:09 (eighteen years ago) link
I like hime better than Dylan bcz of Season of the Witch (and multifarious cover versions) and Get Thy Bearings. I'm not saying he's more important, but I am saying I listen to him and I don't Dylan.
― Raw Patrick (Raw Patrick), Saturday, 10 September 2005 20:41 (eighteen years ago) link
― Hurting (Hurting), Saturday, 10 September 2005 20:43 (eighteen years ago) link
He would, being British. Dude also hated Springsteen, apparently. No accounting for taste, etc.
"Season of the Witch" is a great song, though, and has been covered excellently. I also have a soft spot for "Atlantis" 'cause of Goodfellas.
― disco violence (disco violence), Saturday, 10 September 2005 21:11 (eighteen years ago) link
― disco violence (disco violence), Saturday, 10 September 2005 21:15 (eighteen years ago) link
― Ned Raggett (Ned), Saturday, 10 September 2005 21:25 (eighteen years ago) link
Donovan plays him the saccharine To Sing for You
as:
Donovan plays him the Saccharine Trust.
that would have been more interesting.
― maria tessa sciarrino (theoreticalgirl), Saturday, 10 September 2005 21:34 (eighteen years ago) link
yes. dylan's not humorless but a lot of his "followers" are.
― simian (dymaxia), Saturday, 10 September 2005 21:54 (eighteen years ago) link
people are definitely better looking today
― BeeOK (boo radley), Sunday, 11 September 2005 02:06 (eighteen years ago) link
TS: Hurdy Gurdy Man vs. Tambourine Man
― joseph cotten (joseph cotten), Sunday, 11 September 2005 02:21 (eighteen years ago) link
― Drew Daniel (Drew Daniel), Sunday, 11 September 2005 02:54 (eighteen years ago) link
― Hurting (Hurting), Sunday, 11 September 2005 02:59 (eighteen years ago) link
― The Good Dr. Bill (The Good Dr. Bill), Sunday, 11 September 2005 03:16 (eighteen years ago) link
― Hurting (Hurting), Sunday, 11 September 2005 03:18 (eighteen years ago) link
It's irrelevant in terms of the two's quality, but not in terms of their legacy, of which I think Donovan has fairly little.
― The Good Dr. Bill (The Good Dr. Bill), Sunday, 11 September 2005 03:21 (eighteen years ago) link
― BeeOK (boo radley), Sunday, 11 September 2005 03:56 (eighteen years ago) link
― Hurting (Hurting), Sunday, 11 September 2005 04:01 (eighteen years ago) link
― Hurting (Hurting), Sunday, 11 September 2005 04:02 (eighteen years ago) link
So I will.
And I like Donovan's music. A "Best Of" suffices, though.
― Brooker Buckingham (Brooker B), Sunday, 11 September 2005 14:46 (eighteen years ago) link
haven't heard "honest with me," have you?
anyways, anybody who could come up with "first there is a mountain" needs no one to defend him
― pus bop, Sunday, 11 September 2005 17:16 (eighteen years ago) link
otm.
― piscesboy, Sunday, 11 September 2005 18:04 (eighteen years ago) link
― donut Get Behind Me Carbon Dioxide (donut), Monday, 12 September 2005 02:30 (eighteen years ago) link
Although I will allow I had a thought about Dylan this past week when I heard him in a CD shop - "why do so many people seem to hate Dylan? I mean he's not my preferred thing to listen to, but the hate is hard to understand"
― There's a Tipsy Ghost on the edge of my couch (Bimble...), Monday, 12 September 2005 02:44 (eighteen years ago) link
― bah, Monday, 12 September 2005 02:52 (eighteen years ago) link
― dan bunnybrain (dan bunnybrain), Monday, 12 September 2005 15:01 (eighteen years ago) link
― lexurian (lexurian), Monday, 12 September 2005 15:15 (eighteen years ago) link
― mark grout (mark grout), Monday, 12 September 2005 15:21 (eighteen years ago) link
― dan. (dan.), Monday, 12 September 2005 17:56 (eighteen years ago) link
― dan. (dan.), Monday, 12 September 2005 17:58 (eighteen years ago) link
Giles Hattersley, eh? Any relation? Should we blame the parents, or instead blame the sham media meritocracy which continues to ensure that you can only earn a living as a broadsheet writer if you had the correct parents?
― Marcello Carlin (nostudium), Tuesday, 13 September 2005 05:10 (eighteen years ago) link
I can see them. We're both rather soft-spoken Scots with a line in whimsy and a certain kind of Aquarian starry-eyed quality, as well as a tendency to mock same. I sat in a hotel lobby in Paris with Donovan in April. It was just the two of us, and I was tempted to tell him "My records are often compared with yours!", but I thought it would have been a bit twattish, and I didn't want to disturb him as he read "Uriel's History: Uncovering the Secrets of Stonehenge, Noah's Flood and the Dawn of Civilization".
― Momus (Momus), Tuesday, 13 September 2005 11:48 (eighteen years ago) link
― simian (dymaxia), Tuesday, 13 September 2005 12:30 (eighteen years ago) link
Hey, guess what Giles, these days people from Donovan's background still don't have "gap years"
― Raymond Douglas Dadaismus (Dada), Tuesday, 13 September 2005 12:42 (eighteen years ago) link
― A|ex P@reene (Pareene), Tuesday, 13 September 2005 13:57 (eighteen years ago) link
― Hurting (Hurting), Tuesday, 13 September 2005 14:01 (eighteen years ago) link
― katie, a princess (katie, a princess), Tuesday, 13 September 2005 16:28 (eighteen years ago) link
― shookout (shookout), Tuesday, 13 September 2005 23:51 (eighteen years ago) link
----I am so sick of reading about the Don't look back scene. Donovan requested he play It's all Over now Baby Blue. The thick headed Dylan fans will never see this because they don't want to see it. Donovan hands him the guitar and says "I want to hear It's all over now Baby Blue." Then Dylan asks, "You wanna hear that." and he asks what tuning his guitar is in. Donovan tells him its in a D tuning. People really need to watch this movie more closely. Donovan wasn't embarrassed at the song he friggan requested, how could he be? Enough ranting.
― hurdy gurdy man, Wednesday, 21 September 2005 11:50 (eighteen years ago) link
You shouldn't be laughing, you should have been in awe that the greatest singer songwriter was performing right in front of your eyes. You should have been praising him, and by the way, Beat Cafe is an amazing album. Better then anything the old 60's artist are doing these days, including Dylan's recent album and McCartney's.
― hurdy gurdy man, Wednesday, 21 September 2005 11:54 (eighteen years ago) link
― hurdy gurdy man, Wednesday, 21 September 2005 11:58 (eighteen years ago) link
Still though, I don't see how anyone could say Donovan's in the same class as Dylan, that's just insane, on many levels, beginning with volume alone. For every transcendend moment Donovan has, Dylan's got 20.
Also, I've read large portions of his book (which no one has mentioned), and it's unintentionally hilarious, evidence of massive self-involvement and an ego spun far out of proportion to actual ability.
― shookout (shookout), Wednesday, 21 September 2005 12:10 (eighteen years ago) link
― hurdy gurdy man, Wednesday, 21 September 2005 13:56 (eighteen years ago) link
― Brooker Buckingham (Brooker B), Wednesday, 21 September 2005 14:24 (eighteen years ago) link
Since when did they cut and paste Feargal Sharkey into LANDMARK (or at least the Bed Shed) DYLAN FILM?
― Dingbod Kesterson, Wednesday, 6 February 2008 12:58 (sixteen years ago) link
He's right. Anyone who says the 60s were great is right.
― Geir Hongro, Wednesday, 6 February 2008 13:49 (sixteen years ago) link
You were there were you?
― Herman G. Neuname, Wednesday, 6 February 2008 14:08 (sixteen years ago) link
fake Geir?
― Thomas, Wednesday, 6 February 2008 14:14 (sixteen years ago) link
I don't need to have been there to acknowledge that 60s music, along with 70s music and music from the first half of the 80s, was great.
― Geir Hongro, Wednesday, 6 February 2008 14:27 (sixteen years ago) link
james brown was in the 60s. therefore great. i am right.
― Thomas, Wednesday, 6 February 2008 14:30 (sixteen years ago) link
he's right!
― Mark G, Wednesday, 6 February 2008 14:55 (sixteen years ago) link
If only he left
― nabisco, Wednesday, 6 February 2008 21:07 (sixteen years ago) link
I thought I heard something about this.. Was this the Mountain Goat band or something like that??
J0hn Darn1elle to thread.
-- A|ex P@reene (Pareene), Wednesday, 21 September 2005 18:32 (2 years ago) Link
people who get me drunk enough often get to hear this story, which involves Donovan turning up at a show and having his manager demand that he sit in and throwing an absolute shitfit when we said "no"
― J0hn D., Wednesday, 6 February 2008 22:10 (sixteen years ago) link
lololol
― s1ocki, Wednesday, 6 February 2008 22:12 (sixteen years ago) link
Good thing it wasn't Don McLean.
― James Redd and the Blecchs, Wednesday, 6 February 2008 22:12 (sixteen years ago) link
nb by "'get' to hear" I probably mean "are forced to endure"
― J0hn D., Wednesday, 6 February 2008 22:13 (sixteen years ago) link
I was feeling pretty groovy when the radiator burst So I ran across a meadow a magical antelope saw me first And then Jennifer Juniper and then a floating merman from Atlantis
― nabisco, Wednesday, 6 February 2008 22:25 (sixteen years ago) link
I loved my shirt so much I gave it to a very friendly praying mantis
― nabisco, Wednesday, 6 February 2008 22:28 (sixteen years ago) link
Don't worry, I'm done now
http://www.javno.com/slike/slike_3/r1/g2007/m04/x82137689653212655.jpg
― James Redd and the Blecchs, Wednesday, 6 February 2008 22:32 (sixteen years ago) link
and then a floating merman from Atlantis
dude you know I could seriously sell this line on that beat
― J0hn D., Thursday, 7 February 2008 00:32 (sixteen years ago) link
http://www.metro.co.uk/fame/article.html?in_article_id=73158&in_page_id=7&in_a_source=
― jim, Thursday, 14 February 2008 22:01 (sixteen years ago) link
Oh hey, that didn't work.
The gist was that Donovan is opening the "Invincible Donovan University". But this youtube link it better. He sings about it. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AldJWJk34ag
― jim, Thursday, 14 February 2008 22:02 (sixteen years ago) link
Listen to the cunts whooping.
― jim, Thursday, 14 February 2008 22:03 (sixteen years ago) link
lowl
― am0n, Thursday, 14 February 2008 22:09 (sixteen years ago) link
Funny how when hippy dudes talk (brag) about how at peace and in tune with the universe they are, the more insecure and fucked up they sound.
― Bodrick III, Thursday, 14 February 2008 22:12 (sixteen years ago) link