Revelation - Official ILX Pet Shop Boys tracks poll results

1) Being Boring

2) I Wouldn’t Normally Do This Kind Of Thing

3) Rent

4) Dreaming Of The Queen

5) The Survivors

6) The Way It Used To Be

7) Miracles

8) Nervously

9) Always On My Mind

10) Discoteca

11) Do I Have To

12) Liberation

13) We're The Pet Shop Boys

14) Your Funny Uncle

15) Shameless

16) Fugitive (Richard X Extended Mix)

17) One In A Million

18) Opportunities

19) Decadence

20) Hit And Miss

Happy to see another "The Samurai in Autumn" up there!

1. King's Cross
2. What Have I Done to Deserve This?
3. Always on my Mind
4. Integral
5. Rent
6. Being Boring
7. Legacy
8. Se A Vida É (That's the Way Life Is)
9. I Don't Know What You Want But I Can't Give it Anymore
10. Viva la Vida / Domino Dancing
11. Flamboyant
12. It's a Sin
13. Suburbia
14. The Samurai in Autumn
15. Can You Forgive Her?
16. West End Girls
17. I Get Along
18. Jealousy
19. A Red Letter Day
20. You Only Tell Me You Love Me When You're Drunk

My list - 16/20

1. Rent
2. Always on My Mind
3. Left to My Own Devices
4. It’s a Sin
5. Being Boring
6. King’s Cross
7. Do I Have To?
8. What Have I Done to Deserve This?
9. In the Night
10. Dreaming of the Queen
11. Paninaro
12. So Hard
13. This Must Be the Place I Waited Years to Leave
14. West End Girls
15. Your Funny Uncle
16. Two Divided By Zero
17. I Get Along
18. You Only Tell Me You Love Me When You’re Drunk
19. Was That What It Was?
20. Later Tonight

Thanks Billy. Very enjoyable.

sad Miracles didn't make it :-(

Huh?! Missed the final part of the countdown.... "What Have I..."? Really?! o_O

Anyway, great work Billy!

My ballot:

1. Being Boring
2. My October Symphony
3. Love Comes Quickly
4. King's Cross
5. I Want To Wake Up
6. Paninaro
7. Rent
8. Domino Dancing
9. Left To My Own Devices
10. Only The Wind
11. To Face The Truth
12. Suburbia
13. Nervously
14. This Must Be The Place I Waited Years To Leave
15. Jealousy
16. What Have I Done To Deserve This?
17. It Couldn't Happen Here
18. It's A Sin
19. The Theatre
20. I Wouldn't Normally Do This Kind Of Thing

There are only one or two placing songs I wouldn't want to hear right now, and at least a dozen or more I love equally. Man, these guys. You guys.

Oh, so glad WHIDTDT? won - as Tom said years ago on ILx, successful incorporation of divas into the PSB sound. Pristine designer regret and the possibility of glorious redemption. Hook after hook after hook. Tennant’s “at night the people…” verse is sublime. Best duet EVER MADE!.

Surprised Heart placed so low - I find it, er, classic/uncluttered rather than lightweight.

My ballot:

01. What Have I Done To Deserve This?
02. Heart
03. Bet She's Not Your Girlfriend
04. Some Speculation
05. Left To My Own Devices
06. Try It (I'm In Love With A Married Man)
07. Domino Dancing
08. One Of The Crowd
09. Rent
10. The Sound Of The Atom Splitting
11. Love Comes Quickly
12. I Want A Dog [/Alternative/ version]
13. I Get Excited (You Get Excited Too)
14. We're The Pet Shop Boys
15. A New Life
16. Jack The Lad
17. One More Chance [1984/Bobby 'O' version]
18. You Know Where You Went Wrong
19. Dry Heroin [Bumtschak bootleg, Superpitcher vs Pet Shop Boys]
20. Party Song

I was one of three people to vote for Jack The Lad, We're The Pet Shop Boys, and Bet She's Not Your Girlfriend; one of two people to vote for Party Song, You Know Where You Went Wrong, A New Life, I Get Excited (You Get Excited Too), The Sound Of The Atom Splitting, and One Of The Crowd, and the only vote for Dry Heroin (which didn't get folded within the Home & Dry votes).

Was hoping Bet She's Not Your Girlfriend would place - was my #1 until the last minute, one of Neil's most acrobatic vocal performances (the way the lyrics scan!), and a successful mesh of house and hi-NRG tropes in the production - those strings, and what sounds like Chris through a vocoder!

A question for all you guys who bought their singles and albums in their heyday: did you flip those singles over and say, for example, "Wow! 'I Get Excited (You Get Excited Too)' is a marvelous tune!" or did it take Alternative and the reissues to notice?

This thread is quickly becoming "people who read pitchfork are dumb"

A question for all you guys who bought their singles and albums in their heyday: did you flip those singles over and say, for example, "Wow! 'I Get Excited (You Get Excited Too)' is a marvelous tune!" or did it take /Alternative/ and the reissues to notice?

I loved "A Man Could Get Arrested", "Jack The Lad", "You Know Where You Went Wrong", "I Want A Dog", "We All Feel Better In The Dark", "It Must Be Obvious" and "Bet She's Not Your Girlfriend" when I heard them on the singles. Alternative just reaffirmed what I suspected; PSB B-sides pwn.

This thread is quickly becoming "people who read pitchfork are dumb"

do you mean this thread is a rebuke to Pitchfork?

It makes a big difference, I imagine, to hear all those b-sides in the context of "Alternative" at once, rather than scattered across various formats. That came out in, what, 95? Back then it took some doing to compile your own comprehensive collections. In the pre-downloading era, I think the impact of "Alternative" was more ... impactful? I readily admit that until the comp I had little to know idea about ANY of the PSB b-sides!

Ha, little to no.

Little to Know would make a great album title.

Just been catching on up on the final results, it made such an exciting read. Thanks so much for doing this Billy.

A bit gutted that four of my votes were in the 50-60 part of the list. I voted for A Different Point Of view (51) The Way It Used To Be (52) Dreaming Of The Queen (56) Yesterday When I Was Mad (57) Still it was a great list overall.

For anyone not bored with this sort of thing, I wrote blurbs for my picks.

I heard selected 80s b-sides at the time but, having been in possession of only a few of the singles, and having failed to keep a tape dub of the B-sides of a friend's copies of others, there are several even from that era that I've only heard a few times ("Do I Have To?", "You Know Where You Went Wrong"). I was distracted by Sebadoh or something when Alternative was finally released, such that I only bought my first (dirt cheap) copy just this week, for the convenience.

At the very least I think it's unlikely I would have given 36 points to "A Man Could Get Arrested" if I hadn't listened to both sides of the "WEG" single a zillion times as a pre-pubescent circa 1986. I mean, is it that good? I can't be even vaguely objective.

Didn't do homework, so stopped at 10:

If it's not too late. -Eazy

1. Go West
2. Try It (I'm in Love with a Married Man)
3. Positive Role Model
4. Two Divided by Zero
5. London
6. Rent
7. Love Etc.
8. Party Song
9. Love Comes Quickly
10. Home and Dry

(Oops-"If it's not too late" was part of my e-mail.)

Alfred, I had no idea it was you that wrote that Stylus write-up of "Young Offender". It's one of my favourite PSB write-ups.

My top 20,. My biggest disappointment, that I was the only one to vote for 'Nothing Has Been Proved' which I think's a highlight of both artists careers.

Incidentally has anyone seen 'It Couldn't Happen Here'? It looks like a rum piece of work. I remember it getting slammed at the time as indulgent and pretentious, but the clips I've seen have wetted my appetite.

Young Offender
You Only Tell Me You Love Me When You're Drunk
What Have I Done to Deserve This?
Love Comes Quickly
So Hard
West End Girls
Nothing Has Been Proved (Dusty Springfield)
I'm Not Scared (Eighth Wonder)
Suburbia
The Crying Game (Boy George)
Always On My Mind
One In A Million
Se A Vida E
Try It (I'm In Love With A Married Man)
It's A Sin
Love Etc
This Must Be The Place I Waited Years to Leave
We All Feel Better In The Dark
Love is Everywhere (Cicero)
Your Funny Uncle

Yep, saw it in the cinema. It is rum and pretentious and indulgent, and fun.

I was tempted to vote "Casanova in Hell" for the Rufus Wainwright version, but I don't guess that would have gathered much steam.

Rufus version >>> Tennant version IMO. Concrete is pretty fantastic overall.

I wonder why wasn't King's Cross a single? Or anything else on Actually. After a no. 1 it's pretty much a no brainer to release another single from the album.

It had already been a backwards step to release another [fourth!] single off the album after a stand-alone single; presumably Heart was delayed due to the unplannedness of the Always single after the TV cover version. Since Introspective was probably close to finished around then, they could have been wearing on peoples’ familiarity by releasing a FIFTH old song as a single when they had two magnificent new ones to get out before the end of the year, PLUS a feature film spun off from the old album to get into cinemas as well!

The remixed live version on the last tour was astounding.

All the live arrangements from the Pandaemonium/Glasto sets were done with or by Jacques Lu Cont iirc?

"In My House" isn't really a song, is it? I would've just counted it as a remix. It doesn't make a big difference anyway.

It’s as much of a song as Music For Boys, or We All Feel Better In The Dark, and more of one than anything on Relentless

Wow. Totally thought "The Night I Fell in Love" or "Dreaming of the Queen" would place high. What are y'all's stance on those?

I wish The Night I Fell In Love was any good, but it’s clunky and hamfisted in so very many ways. Dreaming Of The Queen worked great pacing-wise on the Cubism tour (at full shows) as a gather your breath / go to the bar song, and also became the first time I’d ever paid any attention to it at all.

Idly thinking of a best-covers-of-the-PSB poll – do people have any favourites others of us might not be familiar with? (or particular favourites from Results or the WEG catalogue)
eg

Carter USM – Rent
Merril Bainbridge – Being Boring
Robbie Williams – I Wouldn’t Normally Do This Kind Of Thing
Splendid – You Only Tell Me You Love Me When You’re Drunk
(https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Axym3dOvCY4 )

For info, I've left the spreadsheet public but have anonymised the names.

My ballot:

Being Boring
Always On My Mind
Left To My Own Devices
What Have I Done To Deserve This?
Go West
Home And Dry
Se A Vida E (That's The Way Life Is)
* Too Many People
So Hard
Rent
Can You Forgive Her?
Losing My Mind (Liza Minnelli)
A Red Letter Day
I Wouldn't Normally Do This Kind Of Thing
Heart
Love Etc
Where The Streets Have No Name
* Love Is Everywhere (Cicero)
* In Private (Dusty Springfield)
The Truck Driver And His Mate

* = didn't place in the 50

Billy: I voted for "Nothing Has Been Proved" too. Almost voted for it twice--I love the Strings of Love version even more than Dusty's, but I wasn't sure if Tenant/Lowe had anything to do with it beyond writing the song, so I skipped it. I was surprised it didn't make the Top 50 too.

xp I bought every single on seven and twelve from Please through Behaviour so every song on that first disc of Alternative means something to me, to the point where I can't really be objective about them. I remember trying to transcribe and decipher the lyrics to Don Juan. With Very they stopped doing vinyl singles so I drifted away from the B-sides. Even though many of the later ones are utterly fantastic, I discovered them en masse on Alternative so I didn't devote as much time to them.

In case anyone hasn't heard this:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zErjqOlHWqU&feature=related

There's a longer and better version on the 12-inch. Being right from the Black Box moment, I have to wonder if the gorgeous woman in the video is even doing the singing.

Billy: I voted for "Nothing Has Been Proved" too.

Yes, you did, my mistake. Don't worry, it was counted.

Loses a little something of the Profumo story, that version

Alfred, I had no idea it was you that wrote that Stylus write-up of "Young Offender". It's one of my favourite PSB write-ups.

aww thanks!

Yeah, that was a great piece. I am curious about something, though. I grew up listening to the Pet Shop Boys without ever thinking of them as gay. Not as straight, either - for some reason, sexuality never came into my appreciation of them (or at least I was too unsophisticated to recognize it). But when "Very" came out, I was suddenly very aware of the band's sexuality, as well as the album's place in the AIDS/post-AIDS era. It was like a little light bulb that went off that cast all their previous material in a different, more illuminating light. Sort of the same thing with the Magnetic Fields' "Holiday," which I believe came out the same year.

Anyway, for those of you back in the '80s who understand what being gay was (or were gay yourselves), how did that affect your appreciation of the Pet Shop Boys? Did they seem more daring? Subversive? Like a well-kept secret that went deeper than strictly great pop? Or as strictly great pop, with the layers of politics and sexuality only revealing themselves later?

When I bought Behaviour in early '91, there was already a lot of snickering from friends about their sexuality; it wasn't lost on anyone that "Getting Away With It" was a duet between two men. As a sixteen-year-old closeted teenager, I didn't know the language of homosexuality yet, but I sensed the oddness of the point of view in "The End of the World" (its detachment) and "Being Boring" (subject and object blur).

Anyway, for those of you back in the '80s who understand what being gay was (or were gay yourselves), how did that affect your appreciation of the Pet Shop Boys? Did they seem more daring? Subversive? Like a well-kept secret that went deeper than strictly great pop? Or as strictly great pop, with the layers of politics and sexuality only revealing themselves later?

as a pre-pubescent, I felt cheated when I clocked that NT's lyrics were dancing around gender so pointedly. be bold! why hide! I thought. your songs are so wonderful, they must be universally respected and beloved - to engage gendered pronouns would rip scales from eyes, and show the ludicrousity of homophobically languaged abuse to thousands, I thought.

later, I couldn't remember the one "she" or "her" that had tipped me towards briefly reading their songs in a heteronormative context, and became aware of how little dancing there actually was, if you didn't approach the songs in a standard pop context, and that bullies were irrational and fuckwits anyway.

by the time Tennant did the ...Advocate? interview in ...1993? it seemed ludicrous to me that anyone could possibly need or want clarification about 'their' sexuality. I became aware that it wasn't, though.

['their' as in the entity Pet Shop Boys, that makes the music of the Pet Shop Boys; expressed such to acknowledge Mr Lowe's disinterest in identifying sexually under anyone else's terms.]

TBH, as a straight fan, I never thought about their sexual orientation or whether it even mattered to how I listened to the songs until they released "Go West", which I didn't like to the point of actively avoiding everything associated with Very (which was really, really easy to do in the US) and incorrectly assuming for a while that they lost a good chunk of their cleverness when they officially outed themselves, that the allusions and restrictions they imposed upon themselves were the extra parameter that elevated them from pedestrian to essential.

A year later, a friend played me Disco 2 and I realized I was being a douchebag.

Chris Lowe has never made any statements, by the way.

Somewhere in a shoe box in the basement, I've got an interview I did with Tennant and Lowe in '88. It was slated for the next issue of the magazine I worked for at the time, which promptly went bankrupt before it ever went to print. I've been telling myself the past few years to sit down and transcribe it and post it on my site, but I'm just too lazy. (It would also be major work to find it; the shoe box is filled with cassettes.) Anyway, I did, circumspectly, bring up the dreaded question, and got an icy stare and evasive answer from Tennant. Big surprise: he handled 97% of the talking during the interview. I've always felt pretty stupid for doing so. As I wrote on my site when I recounted the story a few years ago, it was like asking Stevie Wonder if it was true he was blind.

I distinctly remember when I became aware of their homosexuality: it was in a 1990 review of Behaviour in a local music magazine, which casually described Tennant's new lyrics as those of "a more mature gay man, having come to terms with x and y, in an era of z" or some such thing. It was mentioned in passing in a matter-of-fact fashion, such that I remember thinking I must have been inattentive to have not picked up on this previously. Not sure it felt like anything more than a piece of interesting trivia, as their sexuality was not something I had pondered up to that point either.

I was still relatively young and it may have had more resonance if I was gay myself. I suspect it changed my perceptions of them only insofar as certain lines in "Rent" or "It's A Sin" or "Being Boring" might suddenly have been open to different intepretations. Actually, it may have seemed kind of apt more broadly, as the one other fan I knew, my slightly older neighbour whose PSB 12"s I borrowed, was widely understood to be gay himself.

Anyway, I did, circumspectly, bring up the dreaded question, and got an icy stare and evasive answer from Tennant.

I've learned that their policy with most journalists before '93 was to admit Tennant's sexuality off the record.

as someone who only discovered the group through Bilingual and Nightlife as an out gay teenager, their evasiveness seems silly and anachronistic. Only a gay man would write and perform the songs they did in the way they did; it takes what feels like an almost willful ignorance to separate their music from their sexuality. Of course times were different back then.

As a straight kid living with a gay dad (who only did his business outside the house), PSB were about as oblique and transparent as everything else around me. I bought Please when I was 15-16 and loved it; my Dad, mostly a folk and new-age guy, came home one day with the Opportunities 12".

xpost It takes what feels like an almost willful ignorance now, but yeah, times are different. If they weren't, they likely would never have had much chart success in the US, I bet. I mean, even Boy George's sexuality was more often than not totally elided back then.

John Gill's "Queer Noises" has a section on the Pet Shop Boys - I remember thinking at the time that it was well-written and thoughtful but that was a few years ago. IIRC he takes a pretty negative view about their semi-non-closeted status.

^^^ YES. That was the journalist I was trying to remember. He was very offended.

It didn't change my own perception but what I really, really hated after "Very" and Tennant's coming out was that the general public/media perception (at least in North America) immediately went to "lol the gay duo who makes gay music for gay people" and that was pretty much that. So sometimes I wish Tennant hadn't come out, but then it would've probably not make much difference.

In America their profile is "lol the gay duo who did 'West End Girls.'"

I recall a friend recounting telling me, "It must be obvious? well it wasn't to me."

Well I kind of see why it wasn't obvious to everyone. I mean in the eighties everyone looked (and acted) gayer than the PSB.

That was part of the joke too: they were less, er, flamboyant than their peers.