The Cure: Classic or Dud?

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Not at all, Paul. There's something about The Cure and The Preachers that triggers fervour of a disturbing religiosity in people's heads, well, in my experience anyway. And if you wanna put that to the test, gently question a more avid fan and watch them twist like they was shackled to the cross.

Hmm, having said that, I do get riled when someone fails to 'get' my favourite bands and indulges in the kind of mindless attack I have already posted against The Cure. Yet, I feel that certain bands are wont to attract a more dependent following, who hang the band's music like metaphorical rosaries. And I'm not sure that even among my most beloved artists, there are those which I could hold in such equally mindless esteem.

What say you?

Roger fascist, Tuesday, 30 July 2002 00:00 (fourteen years ago) Permalink

two months pass...
If i brooded around and had a aweful voice, would i be as good as the cure, which coincidently, isnt even good to begin with

DUD

Hayward, Thursday, 3 October 2002 02:11 (fourteen years ago) Permalink

Oddly enough, I've never really sought out their albums; I'm sure I'll get around to it, but I'm pretty sure they'll always be available... Pretty much all of their singles, though, are flat-out amazing - how could they not be classic?

Clarke B., Thursday, 3 October 2002 04:37 (fourteen years ago) Permalink

The albums are SO WORTH IT, Clarke.

Dan Perry (Dan Perry), Thursday, 3 October 2002 11:13 (fourteen years ago) Permalink

Quite.

Ned Raggett (Ned), Thursday, 3 October 2002 23:38 (fourteen years ago) Permalink

hmmmmmmm .............
dud

donna (donna), Friday, 4 October 2002 01:02 (fourteen years ago) Permalink

I'm exactly like Clarke. Always loved what I heard, but only own 'Kiss Me Kiss Me Kiss Me'... Last year I told a friend of mine that the reason for this is because I pretty much know that I'll like them and am just 'saving it'. Is this like some weird Cure phenomena?

Kim (Kim), Friday, 4 October 2002 01:39 (fourteen years ago) Permalink

I LOVE THE CURE. They fill a niche that no other band does. From the acutely depresso Pornography stuff to the silly dance stuff to the haunting gothy Faith stuff to the blatant sunshine pop... they've done all this convincingly and well. Did they invent the drugged up goofy romantic miserable goth ecstatic giddy thing?

Yet I do wonder how much my own nosatlgia plays a role. I still think Wish is great, despite every. review. ever. written. Maybe if I hadn't listened to it for the 1st time as a teenager travelling thru Europe with schoomates I'd think differently.

Aaron A., Friday, 4 October 2002 03:43 (fourteen years ago) Permalink

Where to start, Ned and Dan? I'm thinking _Pornography_, but some of their _Disintegration_-era stuff kills me (esp. "Lovesong").

Also, I really really like the Wolfgang Press song on _Lonely is an Eyesore_, but I've heard their recordings are pretty patchy. Any recommendations there?

Clarke B., Friday, 4 October 2002 05:30 (fourteen years ago) Permalink

In your place I'd start with 17 Seconds, Clarke. It has their greatest song on it, "A Forest" and I find it the darkest and most powerful of their records. A lot of their stuff didn't age too well (even Disintegration), but this record definitely stood the test of time.

alex in mainhattan (alex63), Friday, 4 October 2002 07:03 (fourteen years ago) Permalink

I wouldn't go for _Pornography_ first; I think I'd get _Kiss Me, Kiss Me, Kiss Me_ and the cassette version of _Standing On A Beach_ in order to get the b-sides.

Dan Perry (Dan Perry), Friday, 4 October 2002 11:04 (fourteen years ago) Permalink

Classic until "Stranding on a Beach" came out, after which they descended into the depths of self-parody.

TMFTML (TMFTML), Friday, 4 October 2002 17:37 (fourteen years ago) Permalink

I kinda saved them also, Kim - owned the two singles compilations for years before actually buying my first proper album (Disintegration) just this year. Though I do like it, it hasn't swayed me into snatching up the others yet. Maybe in another four years I'll get another one.

Vinnie (vprabhu), Friday, 4 October 2002 17:51 (fourteen years ago) Permalink

They fill(ed?) a niche no one else did (which I usually characterize as "Harlequin romance rock") and they did a perfectly accomplished and unique job of it most of the time but it's not one I care to listen to much at all. I can play Pornography maybe a couple times per year and it's sometimes nice to hear the singles on the radio but overall there's not a big connection. And I couldn't imagine sitting through a whole album of stuff like "In Between Days" or "Let's Go to Bed". The singles comp (Staring At the Sea?) is probably as much as I'd need of that. I'd buy Disintegration if I thought I'd ever listen to it. Wish and Wild Mood Swings were awful.

sundar subramanian, Friday, 4 October 2002 18:32 (fourteen years ago) Permalink

I honestly cannot comprehend how _Wish_ is AWFUL.

Dan Perry (Dan Perry), Friday, 4 October 2002 18:34 (fourteen years ago) Permalink

the cure were/are one of the best bands for dancing to whilst only wearing underwear...hopefully not by yourself...

g (graysonlane), Friday, 4 October 2002 18:47 (fourteen years ago) Permalink

Ok, I'm a liar. I totally forgot that I also had 'Standing on a Beach' on cassette - played it to death. I don't have it anymore though. I think my brother "borrowed" it and never gave it back! Ooooh...that little...

Kim (Kim), Friday, 4 October 2002 20:39 (fourteen years ago) Permalink

I like just like heaven, I'm going to get Kiss me times 3.

jel -- (jel), Friday, 4 October 2002 20:43 (fourteen years ago) Permalink

classic classic classic and why should you not dance to the cure in underwear by yourself! unless you are wearing the underwear out to the goth dance club, of course.

teeny (teeny), Friday, 4 October 2002 20:44 (fourteen years ago) Permalink

Have you ever been to a goth dance club? Underwear as outerwear is pretty much de rigeur.

Kim (Kim), Friday, 4 October 2002 20:48 (fourteen years ago) Permalink

Clarke, start with Disintegration first, and then try Seventeen Seconds and then Pornography. I've argued elsethread about this already so I won't go into the details here...just click the link, cause there's a lot of other good talk there anyhow.

Sean Carruthers (SeanC), Friday, 4 October 2002 20:55 (fourteen years ago) Permalink

Pretend that there's a smiley at the end of my last post. I sound like a meanie otherwise.

Kim (Kim), Friday, 4 October 2002 20:57 (fourteen years ago) Permalink

ten months pass...
"And yet Robert Smith - the Chatterton of Crawley - had created if not a wall of sound then a very high hedge of sound, over which he seemed to peer at the world like a boy who couldn't be bothered to ask for his ball back."

the "cure=suburbia" part of Michael Bracewell's England Is Mine is one of the best things ever!

etc, Wednesday, 20 August 2003 08:54 (thirteen years ago) Permalink

"Join the Dots" (B Sides and rarities) is out on October 21st. I presume it'll have the much talked about Cassette b sides from Standing on a Beach on it, but does anyone know that actual tracklisting is?

flowersdie (flowersdie), Wednesday, 20 August 2003 09:05 (thirteen years ago) Permalink

Hopefully it'll have the stuff off "curiosity", too. And that soundtrack they did.

Classic, BTW. Again, my mid-teens coincided with Disintegration and I was full-on obsessed for a couple of years. I bought a shedload of albums at Oxfam last year, and a friend and I drove our GF/wives insane by listening, back to back, to 17 Seconds, Faith, Pornography and the Top. Divorce was on the horizon by the end of that evening.

Jim Eaton-Terry (Jim E-T), Wednesday, 20 August 2003 13:04 (thirteen years ago) Permalink

Hopefully it'll have the stuff off "curiosity", too. And that soundtrack they did.

Thing is, there are SO many B-sides and rarities which have officially surfaced that they'd have to put out a box set. As it is, if the remasters that are surfacing next year are going to include bonus discs for each with room for other oddities, then that will partially settle the problem.

Thy Lethal Zen Ned (Ned), Wednesday, 20 August 2003 13:42 (thirteen years ago) Permalink

This news makes me very, very happy.

Jay Vee (Manon_70), Wednesday, 20 August 2003 13:53 (thirteen years ago) Permalink

won't come out on Oct. 21st though. That info was wrong

Fabrice (Fabfunk), Wednesday, 20 August 2003 13:55 (thirteen years ago) Permalink

When is it out then?

flowersdie (flowersdie), Wednesday, 20 August 2003 13:56 (thirteen years ago) Permalink

No official release date..

Fabrice (Fabfunk), Wednesday, 20 August 2003 14:01 (thirteen years ago) Permalink

I kind of like the guitars in "Pictures of You".

sundar subramanian (sundar), Wednesday, 20 August 2003 14:04 (thirteen years ago) Permalink

Recently listened to Dark Side of the Moon and then Disintegration back to back. Confirmed what I already knew.
Fuck the Canon and the Keepers it rode in on. The Cure > Pink Floyd.

Lord Custos Epsilon (Lord Custos Epsilon), Wednesday, 20 August 2003 14:18 (thirteen years ago) Permalink

Just adding to the calls of "Classic" (up to, and including, Wish, that is).

David A. (Davant), Wednesday, 20 August 2003 19:47 (thirteen years ago) Permalink

six months pass...
Shall I expound at great length here about The Cure's gig at the Barfly last night? Or does it warrant its own thread?

CharlieNo4 (Charlie), Saturday, 6 March 2004 12:31 (thirteen years ago) Permalink

either way, spill!

teeny (teeny), Saturday, 6 March 2004 16:25 (thirteen years ago) Permalink

Yes. Now please. Or else.

Ned Raggett (Ned), Saturday, 6 March 2004 16:30 (thirteen years ago) Permalink

Giz it.

Lynskey (Lynskey), Saturday, 6 March 2004 16:34 (thirteen years ago) Permalink

You don't want to make The Raggett angry.

El Diablo Robotico (Nicole), Saturday, 6 March 2004 16:34 (thirteen years ago) Permalink

I'm trying to envision whether turning into a green Lou Ferrigno is merely a lateral move.

Ned Raggett (Ned), Saturday, 6 March 2004 16:35 (thirteen years ago) Permalink

Pretty much.

El Diablo Robotico (Nicole), Saturday, 6 March 2004 16:51 (thirteen years ago) Permalink

Ah well, the downsides.

Ned Raggett (Ned), Saturday, 6 March 2004 16:52 (thirteen years ago) Permalink

Sorry, too busy right now, but will gush like a geyser tomorrow. In the meantime, drooooool over the setlist...

Shake Dog Shake
Fascination Street
A Strange Day
A Night Like This
Lovesong
Push
Sinking
Pictures Of You
Lullaby
Lovecats
Maybe Someday
In Your House
From The Edge Of The Deep Green Sea
M
Charlotte Sometimes
Inbetween Days
Just Like Heaven
Hey You!!!
Play For Today
A Forest

Fire In Cairo (as a 3 piece)
Grinding Halt (as a 3 piece)
10.15 Saturday Night
Boys Don't Cry
I Dig You (with Porl Thompson and Frank The Postman)
I'm A Cult Hero (with Porl Thompson and Frank The Postman),
Close To Me
Let's Go To Bed
Why Can't I Be You
Friday I'm In Love

Fucking hell, just reading that through sends me into space. I'm still shellshocked.

CharlieNo4 (Charlie), Sunday, 7 March 2004 19:38 (thirteen years ago) Permalink

WAH! *whimpers and hopes for bootleg...somewhere...ANYWHERE*

Ned Raggett (Ned), Sunday, 7 March 2004 22:03 (thirteen years ago) Permalink

THEY DID CULT HERO MATERIAL???????

Dan Perry (Dan Perry), Sunday, 7 March 2004 23:05 (thirteen years ago) Permalink

With Porl and Frank no less. And was not Charlie saying some months back about how the band has fallen off recently? UNDESERVING INFIDEL! But I will not bear a grudge. Yet.

Ned Raggett (Ned), Sunday, 7 March 2004 23:07 (thirteen years ago) Permalink

Fire In Cairo (as a 3 piece)
Grinding Halt (as a 3 piece)

Genius.

Chris Ott (Chris Ott), Sunday, 7 March 2004 23:23 (thirteen years ago) Permalink

porl!

!!!!!!

teeny (teeny), Sunday, 7 March 2004 23:48 (thirteen years ago) Permalink

Porl, remarkably, is now jobbing as the band's guitar tech!

And yes, Frank the postman showed up in all his voluminous glory, the first time they've done any Cult Hero material in (10 years according to Robert).

And was not Charlie saying some months back about how the band has fallen off recently? UNDESERVING INFIDEL! But I will not bear a grudge. Yet.

And I maintain my viewpoint, no doubt. Friday's only iffy moment came 11 songs in, when some (relatively) unfamiliar chords struck up - "What is this," I thought to myself with a grimace, "Joan Osborne's 'One Of Us'?" But no, it was in fact "Maybe Someday".

The Cure should've stopped recording new music after Wish (or more specifically, if you like, after "Fear Of Ghosts"). I love them still, but I shall not be moved on this matter.

CharlieNo4 (Charlie), Tuesday, 9 March 2004 01:01 (thirteen years ago) Permalink

I forgive you. Since you're going to help me find someone who recorded the show OH PLEASE OH PLEASE OH PLEASE...

Porl, remarkably, is now jobbing as the band's guitar tech!

Wait, what? So essentially he and Perry B. have completed the circle.

Anyway. First batch of reissues in a month. EXCITED!

Ned Raggett (Ned), Tuesday, 9 March 2004 01:04 (thirteen years ago) Permalink

Oh, and Perry's brother is their manager.

I am naturally using all my spider-senses to procure a mixing desk feed of the show. I'll be absolutely amazed if nobody recorded it, but nothing yet. Ned, you will be the f...oooh, among the first to know when I find it!

CharlieNo4 (Charlie), Tuesday, 9 March 2004 01:09 (thirteen years ago) Permalink

I mean, I'm kinda surprised anyone's surprised Roger's nonplussed here! What was expected?

Ned Raggett, Monday, 19 December 2016 14:33 (three months ago) Permalink

Well, Lol's book is a memoir of his time in the band (rather than a history of The Cure) and I think it says a lot how little he seems to remember about the latter years, so no surprise that he wouldn't have much to say about Roger. How is that an issue and how does that taint the book? It's pretty obvious from the book that after the 82-83 reboot of the band, Lol had very little involvement in the creative side of things, hence the focus on addiction in that section. Having said that, I wouldn't be surprised if the lawsuit and eventual redemption were a bit embellished in the story.

licorice oratorio (baaderonixx), Monday, 19 December 2016 20:53 (three months ago) Permalink

Well, Lol's book is a memoir of his time in the band (rather than a history of The Cure) and I think it says a lot how little he seems to remember about the latter years, so no surprise that he wouldn't have much to say about Roger. How is that an issue and how does that taint the book?

Hey, I'm not disagreeing -- my interpretation of choice is the first of the two, that he was that far gone and barely remembers 87 to 89. Again, I say as much well earlier in this thread; this is not a new point I'm trying to make:

But it's very telling to realize that Roger O'Donnell wasn't mentioned *once* during the Kiss Me/Disintegration stretch, and only is mentioned a bit casually near the end. Given he was drafted during the KM release/tour phase to back up Tolhurst and was part of the Disintegration sessions and all that, I can't tell if it's an intentional downplaying by silence on Tolhurst's part or, as I kinda feel is more the case, a kind of admission he was so incredibly out of it that he almost didn't even notice. (O'Donnell for his part kinda confirmed this a few years back via his own memories of the sessions; look for the paragraph that starts: "I think it's pretty much common knowledge how Lol was treated in those days...")

Where it becomes an issue -- and why I'm not surprised Roger's annoyed -- is that the book can be read as Lol saying Roger was not involved at all during those years. Which...is not true, especially when Roger was specifically added precisely so they could have a functional keyboard player. Honestly even a short paragraph in the relevant section saying "To give you an idea about how bad things were..." with the basic details would have been enough.

Ned Raggett, Monday, 19 December 2016 21:05 (three months ago) Permalink

two months pass...

Listening to Wish for the first time in ages and 'From the Edge of the Deep Green Sea' is completely bowling me over all over again. Surely one of their best ever tracks.

Coolio Iglesias (Turrican), Friday, 10 March 2017 23:35 (two weeks ago) Permalink

Absolutely.

ArchCarrier, Friday, 10 March 2017 23:36 (two weeks ago) Permalink

Yep.

The burrito of ennui (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Friday, 10 March 2017 23:38 (two weeks ago) Permalink

It makes me wanna scream along to every lyric.

Coolio Iglesias (Turrican), Friday, 10 March 2017 23:41 (two weeks ago) Permalink

not only are the Cure my all-time favorite band, i also voted "From the Edge of the Deep Green Sea" as my number one song in our Cure poll: POLLography: The Cure poll results, ILM artist poll #23

Bee OK, Saturday, 11 March 2017 03:24 (two weeks ago) Permalink

i see it didn't do to well overall:

#67 - From The Edge Of The Deep Green Sea, 165 points, 8 votes, 1 #1 votes

Bee OK, Saturday, 11 March 2017 03:27 (two weeks ago) Permalink

Song's great, but especially those live versions from the era, wow.

Josh in Chicago, Saturday, 11 March 2017 04:55 (two weeks ago) Permalink

Josh in Chicago, Saturday, 11 March 2017 04:57 (two weeks ago) Permalink

All of their finest songs are over 6 minutes long

beamish13, Saturday, 11 March 2017 23:21 (two weeks ago) Permalink

Nope. Entirety of "Standing on a Beach" / "Staring at the Sea" and the highlights of the first six albums utterly refute that. In fact they were pretty much done once they were releasing six minute epics.

attention vampire (MatthewK), Sunday, 12 March 2017 03:34 (two weeks ago) Permalink

Well, actually they were pretty great at both... for every 'Play For Today', there was an equally excellent 'One Hundred Years' or 'Disintegration' ... they could also be not so great at both on occasion, like on 'Bananafishbones' and 'The Same Deep Water As You', to keep it in the limits of pre-1995 Cure.

Coolio Iglesias (Turrican), Sunday, 12 March 2017 12:56 (two weeks ago) Permalink

xxpost Last Cure song I truly loved.

Acid Hose (Capitaine Jay Vee), Sunday, 12 March 2017 16:56 (two weeks ago) Permalink

I think the last one I loved was 'The Scream' ...

Coolio Iglesias (Turrican), Sunday, 12 March 2017 22:37 (two weeks ago) Permalink

Classic.

I feel like the last great Cure songs are all the b-sides from 'Wish'. All good shit: "Halo", "The Big Hand", "This Twilight Garden" and "Play".

I was really excited back in the day by the "Never Enough / Harold and Joe" 12". THAT record showed the Cure ready to take off to totally unexplored territory that would have made Kiss Me, Kiss Me, Kiss Me look like a conservative dry run. I mean, go back and listen to those two - WTF is that?!?! "Never Enough" just has guitar solo wankery that actually kinda works that they never tried before or ever again.

Instead they were like hey, not hungry anymore, let's keep chasing 'Disintegration'. Boo.

yesca, Monday, 13 March 2017 06:38 (two weeks ago) Permalink

I notice that "Scared of You" and "A Foolish Arrangement" are conspicuously absent from your Wish b-sides list.

Rachel Luther Queen (DJP), Monday, 13 March 2017 14:17 (two weeks ago) Permalink

Agree RE: 'Never Enough.' For a long time I had a sort of irrational resistance towards it, but the melting pot nature of the tune is really something to behold. And, obviously, it's one of Simon's shining moments.

Austin, Monday, 13 March 2017 14:26 (two weeks ago) Permalink

I think in retrospect the Cure, like REM, were one of those bands not necessarily greater than the sum of its parts but, at least during the Boris years, exactly the sum of its parts.

Josh in Chicago, Monday, 13 March 2017 14:36 (two weeks ago) Permalink

TBH I attribute the post-Wish decline mainly to worse production, worse lyrics and worse vocals - ie all on Robert

licorice oratorio (baaderonixx), Monday, 13 March 2017 15:30 (two weeks ago) Permalink

When they put out Wild Mood Swings, their popularity was easily at its lowest here in the UK. I remember them being on all of the "right" TV shows, but there seemed to be this sense that the game was up.

Coolio Iglesias (Turrican), Monday, 13 March 2017 20:16 (two weeks ago) Permalink

They just seemed to be another in a line of bands that were popular in the '80s that seemed to be on their way out: U2 (with Pop), Pet Shop Boys (with Bilingual), OMD (with Universal) ... this didn't affect Depeche Mode so much because Gahan had had his smack overdose and the British music press at that point loved to write about "rock'n'roll" things like that.

Coolio Iglesias (Turrican), Monday, 13 March 2017 20:20 (two weeks ago) Permalink

What's really kind of funny about that (in a dark way) is that Wish contains a rather large number of references to heroin use.

Austin, Monday, 13 March 2017 21:15 (two weeks ago) Permalink

I never saw PSB as part of that collection of 80's bands. Nor did they, really - if you read their book 'Literally' you'll discover that they were really surprised to be lumped in with "rad" bands like OMD and U2 when they came to States and instead considered themselves more in the lineage of club music and Madonna. Perhaps they faded out of the alternative music view over time but for the global gay community they remained urgent and they still managed to craft a great contemporary dance pop track ever few years or so.

In comparison, U2 and the Cure have basically been inert since the mid 90s, totally comfortable being touring businesses.

yesca, Monday, 13 March 2017 23:52 (two weeks ago) Permalink

The era surrounding Bilingual was probably the first time I can really remember reading anything negative about the Pet Shop Boys. Of course, it wasn't the end: they've given us Fundamental and Electric and Bilingual itself is actually a great record. At the time, though, they'd been releasing records for over 10 years, so did feel like a veteran band.

Coolio Iglesias (Turrican), Tuesday, 14 March 2017 00:09 (two weeks ago) Permalink


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