The purpose built next generation interstellar Dawn Richard thread

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does 'blackout'-era britney have much crossover w/ this stuff? i'm listening to "radar" (love love love) right now and i could see the drama being pitched up slightly in a way that would totally fit w/ the 'LTTP sound'

pop the s1ock (J0rdan S.), Tuesday, 22 February 2011 06:42 (3 years ago) Permalink

"vibrate" is nuts

pop the s1ock (J0rdan S.), Tuesday, 22 February 2011 07:13 (3 years ago) Permalink

i'd love to hear a version of a tell tale heart where several of the songs didn't sound like they were recorded underwater

YES (i mean, i assume this will be the actual album if and when it emerges)

blackout's a good comparison point, i mentioned it in my LTTP review from the "constant surprising sonic thrillz" standpoint, but re: dawn specifically there's also that impulse to get drunk and curse and act out sexually running through it (though obv she's coming at it from a more controlled persona...)

lex pretend, Tuesday, 22 February 2011 08:08 (3 years ago) Permalink

Yeah she's interesting in that she's a controlled singer doing "unhinged" R&B - there are aspects of this album that remind me of K Michelle and Fantasia and J Hudson and Brooke Valentine in parts but it's mostly sonic rather than vocal.

This works for me though I'll have to think about why, can't come up with a neat explanation for it yet.

Tim F, Tuesday, 22 February 2011 10:03 (3 years ago) Permalink

i'm still unbelievably pissed off that my chat w/dawn and kalenna has been lost to the vagaries of hard drive death - they said some really interesting things, esp re: their differing singing/songwriting styles, and both generally came across as totally smart and totally on it, and a bit like...necessary to keep diddy down to earth?

tim, you heard the last danity kane album right? if not, omg you need it. (i probably need their first one! never heard it)

lex pretend, Tuesday, 22 February 2011 10:07 (3 years ago) Permalink

I think I heard and liked the singles? I can't remember now if I checked out the album or not.

In my head I kind of just slot Danity Kane as halfway between Dream and Pussycat Dolls and keep forgetting that this is based purely on pop-cultural arithmetic rather than what they actually sound like.

Tim F, Tuesday, 22 February 2011 10:11 (3 years ago) Permalink

it's not entirely offbase w/r/t what they sound like either

that was probably one of my favourites off the album, which made a really great companion piece at the time to...blackout, as it happens - danja helmed a good chunk of it and most of the beats were rather great.

lex pretend, Tuesday, 22 February 2011 10:14 (3 years ago) Permalink

"bulletproof" is so immense, steel pistons grinding into motion

lex pretend, Tuesday, 22 February 2011 12:20 (3 years ago) Permalink

Love "Superhero"

banjee trillness (The Reverend), Tuesday, 22 February 2011 20:46 (3 years ago) Permalink

http://www.cdbaby.com/cd/dawnangelique

Wrong-Way Willy (Andy K), Tuesday, 22 February 2011 21:33 (3 years ago) Permalink

any good?

kl0p's son (k3vin k.), Tuesday, 22 February 2011 21:49 (3 years ago) Permalink

booty in da pants

pop the s1ock (J0rdan S.), Tuesday, 22 February 2011 21:50 (3 years ago) Permalink

does 'blackout'-era britney have much crossover w/ this stuff? i'm listening to "radar" (love love love) right now and i could see the drama being pitched up slightly in a way that would totally fit w/ the 'LTTP sound'

― pop the s1ock (J0rdan S.), Tuesday, February 22, 2011 1:42 AM (15 hours ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

um aside from multiple beats by Danja on both albums i don't really see any connection beyond urban-leaning pop and pop-leaning rap/R&B kinda meeting each other halfway. also lol @ blackout-era britney like that's some kind of defining touchstone of anything outside the ilx hivemind.

some dude, Tuesday, 22 February 2011 21:57 (3 years ago) Permalink

it's a defining touchstone of the pop genre, i think - almost certainly the most critically acclaimed of her albums

lex pretend, Wednesday, 23 February 2011 00:02 (3 years ago) Permalink

the popjustice crowd (and most top 40/pop fans I've talked to) generally consider it to be the best pop album of at least the second half of the decade, if that means anything

prolego, Wednesday, 23 February 2011 00:23 (3 years ago) Permalink

yeah i was exaggerating about it being a big deal only on ilm but calling it her most critically acclaimed album is i think pretty off -- on metacritic it's 3% lower than Circus, 5% lower than In The Zone, 11% lower than Oops -- it's only put on a pedestal in a very particular internet bubble.

some dude, Wednesday, 23 February 2011 01:00 (3 years ago) Permalink

Eh, Metacritic only analyzes initial reviews, not an album's long-term legacy.

banjee trillness (The Reverend), Wednesday, 23 February 2011 01:24 (3 years ago) Permalink

yeah obviously there's a lot of nuance that it doesn't accurately measure -- i'm just saying there's this kind of assumption that it's universally regarded as the high point of her career that i don't think really holds water

some dude, Wednesday, 23 February 2011 01:36 (3 years ago) Permalink

Realistically though Dawn Richard is highly unlikely to attain any success outside of that internet bubble (or an overlapping one) so it's not so misfounded or misleading a point of comparison.

If I say "maybe Dawn Richard's album is gonna be the 2011 equiv of Chain Letter" it's no more ridic, really.

Tim F, Wednesday, 23 February 2011 03:29 (3 years ago) Permalink

yeah who knows if DR has any commercial potential (although LTTP might have legs enough to set her up well, who knows), but Blackout being singled out as a comparison point over all the other dancey Danja-produced R&B/pop albums of the last few years seemed kinda arbitrary.

some dude, Wednesday, 23 February 2011 03:36 (3 years ago) Permalink

what other notable danja-produced R&B/pop albums are out there? (honest q)

Neu! romancer (dayo), Wednesday, 23 February 2011 03:42 (3 years ago) Permalink

i wanna know if the first 20 seconds to "let love in" are supposed to be part of the song or if it's part of another one - sounds absolutely heavenly

kl0p's son (k3vin k.), Wednesday, 23 February 2011 03:48 (3 years ago) Permalink

Really enjoying this but the shitty mixtape sound quality is really harshing my buzz. Why do these songs not sound louder?

Matt DC, Wednesday, 23 February 2011 12:05 (3 years ago) Permalink

'Sounds louder' is usually a bad thing imo.

banjee trillness (The Reverend), Thursday, 24 February 2011 00:47 (3 years ago) Permalink

1 month passes...

i think he means the levels are quiet in an unmastered way that makes the whole thing sound less full/alive, which is a totally valid gripe and not at all an aesthetic thing.

"Hey" has not been singled out itt as a standout and that needs to be rectified.

dayo technology (some dude), Friday, 1 April 2011 20:57 (3 years ago) Permalink

what other notable danja-produced R&B/pop albums are out there? (honest q)

― Neu! romancer (dayo), Tuesday, February 22, 2011 10:42 PM (1 month ago) Bookmark

if we're talking stuff from when Danja was Timbaland's right hand man (and those should probably count since Danja had a huge influence on the sound of those records), Timberlake's FutureSex and Furtado's Loose. but i was referring to stuff heavy on Danja solo productions like Diddy's LTTP and Press Play, Keri Hilson's 1st album, Danity Kane's 2nd album, Katharine McPhee's 1st album.

dayo technology (some dude), Friday, 1 April 2011 21:02 (3 years ago) Permalink

"hey" is amazing yes

lex pretend, Saturday, 2 April 2011 08:27 (3 years ago) Permalink

ship otm

"runway" & "vibrate" are also the joints off this

J0rdan S., Saturday, 2 April 2011 08:39 (3 years ago) Permalink

i like how the art for this album could double as a los campesinos cover

J0rdan S., Saturday, 2 April 2011 08:46 (3 years ago) Permalink

kmt

lex pretend, Saturday, 2 April 2011 08:46 (3 years ago) Permalink

:D

J0rdan S., Saturday, 2 April 2011 08:47 (3 years ago) Permalink

i feel like an asshole for loving "vibrate" the most cuz it sounds like the one that terius & los would've done

J0rdan S., Saturday, 2 April 2011 08:48 (3 years ago) Permalink

do we actually have the production credits for this? i couldn't find them the other week. "vibrate" def in the "promise"/"devotion" lineage

lex pretend, Saturday, 2 April 2011 08:50 (3 years ago) Permalink

if anything i feel bad for loving the swagged-out ones so much. I'M ON MY SUPERMAN SHIT, WHIPPIN UP TOWN, BLOWIN UP SHIIEEET

lex pretend, Saturday, 2 April 2011 08:51 (3 years ago) Permalink

that's why "runway" is the best -- bragging about her hair being real

J0rdan S., Saturday, 2 April 2011 08:52 (3 years ago) Permalink

NO HORSES UP HERE

lex pretend, Saturday, 2 April 2011 08:52 (3 years ago) Permalink

exactly

J0rdan S., Saturday, 2 April 2011 08:53 (3 years ago) Permalink

they say they new guccis but i had em last year
i'm rocking everything that you really wanna wear

J0rdan S., Saturday, 2 April 2011 08:54 (3 years ago) Permalink

i also like to think that naomi campbell references in r&b have proliferated precisely because of her capacity for assault & battery with swarovski-encrusted blackberrys

lex pretend, Saturday, 2 April 2011 08:56 (3 years ago) Permalink

do we actually have the production credits for this? i couldn't find them the other week. "vibrate" def in the "promise"/"devotion" lineage

haha, no longer feel weird for suggesting to kev k that vibrate kinda sounds like promise

dayo, Saturday, 2 April 2011 10:01 (3 years ago) Permalink

props to Tim F for an excellent thread title that grabbed my attention and got me to listen to this, because I probably would've ignored it otherwise. listening for the first time now, and it's amazing!

I think I fell in love with her the second I saw there was a song called "Me Myself & Y" (not quite living up to the title, especially following up the excellent excellent "Hey", but still pretty good)

bernard snowy, Saturday, 2 April 2011 12:38 (3 years ago) Permalink

oh and now "Broken Record" is up next — poor lil "MMY", sandwiched in between these two motherfucking monsters

bernard snowy, Saturday, 2 April 2011 12:39 (3 years ago) Permalink

okay I realize that confessing this will probably make me public enemy #1 on this thread, but I still haven't listened to Last Train — just couldn't get excited about it, honestly. but if it's anywhere near Tell Tale Heart in terms of production and atmosphere/mood...

bernard snowy, Saturday, 2 April 2011 14:08 (3 years ago) Permalink

yeah TTH is very close to LTTP in sound and mood, definitely check it out. better late than never!

sarraghmaclachlan (some dude), Saturday, 2 April 2011 14:17 (3 years ago) Permalink

2 months pass...

dope:

doper:

The Brainwasher, Thursday, 23 June 2011 02:10 (3 years ago) Permalink

I really wish there was a CDQ version of Tell Tale Heart... or at least one that isn't so compressed and muddy sounding

The Brainwasher, Thursday, 23 June 2011 02:14 (3 years ago) Permalink

4 months pass...

^^^

i thought this was just gonna be a prelude to an album proper but everything's gone a bit quiet on the dawn richard front? this is still amazing though

HE ON ME LIKE BUTTER ON BREAD
FRONT ROW WHEN I'M DOIN MY DANCE

all i see is angels in my eyes (lex pretend), Monday, 14 November 2011 16:36 (3 years ago) Permalink

official title is the prelude to a tell tale heart, right?

all i see is angels in my eyes (lex pretend), Monday, 14 November 2011 16:36 (3 years ago) Permalink

so sad you bumped this when I didn't have any dawn richard synced to my iphone

ASPIE Rocky (dayo), Monday, 14 November 2011 18:02 (3 years ago) Permalink

haha i totally relate, h8 it when that happens

all i see is angels in my eyes (lex pretend), Monday, 14 November 2011 18:32 (3 years ago) Permalink

If you consider "reviewed on Pitchfork" to be the sum total of "critical discourse", then I suppose...

Branwell with an N, Wednesday, 28 January 2015 11:55 (4 days ago) Permalink

In fairness it is pretty much all that matters to some people.

Matt DC, Wednesday, 28 January 2015 11:56 (4 days ago) Permalink

As I said upthread her albums seem to uniformly get good reviews but there's evidently no hype bandwagon building in the same way that it might be for an artist like Twigs with proper label backing, a promotional machine and minimal career baggage.

The fact that Dawn releases her records herself is almost certainly an issue here as well.

Matt DC, Wednesday, 28 January 2015 11:59 (4 days ago) Permalink

It's kind of a relief that the only place I ever encounter "these people" is on ILX.

Branwell with an N, Wednesday, 28 January 2015 12:01 (4 days ago) Permalink

I don't think people who are listening FKA Twigs and not Dawn Richard would even necessarily remember that Danity Kane were a thing let alone immediately associate Dawn with them or reality tv - a lot of those discourses run entirely separate from and oblivious to each other except at the most obvious points of crossover (Beyonce, Taylor etc.).

Dawn's challenge to find an audience doesn't strike me as one particularly unique to R&B, but rather has a lot in common with that facing many female artists over the past few decades. There's a quality of earnestness to her which I think can really impair a female artist's crossover chances absent popular success (or, alternatively, "one of the boys" style aggression or androgyny).

Lex's reference to Imogen Heap upthread got me thinking that the best thing that could happen to Dawn would be to have a "Hide & Seek" style viral moment - something that crossed over to an audience open to what she's doing while bypassing both the usual critical and commercial gatekeepers.

But even then the boost that created for Imogen's career was only relative.

Tim F, Wednesday, 28 January 2015 12:07 (4 days ago) Permalink

...or she needs some kind of hit single that will work somewhat independently of her album or her persona. Asking people to take in a whole album to get an idea of who an artist really is feels like a tall order these days.

longneck, Wednesday, 28 January 2015 12:36 (4 days ago) Permalink

Sorry, skimmed Tim's post. That "viral moment" he is speaking of fits the bill. The thing with Dawn is that you need to create a feeling that the listener wants/needs to know more about her music. Taken as a whole there's just so much there that a lot of listeners will need a proper way in.

longneck, Wednesday, 28 January 2015 12:39 (4 days ago) Permalink

I'm on, like, my eighth listen of this album now, and I thought I'd be getting tired of it, but it's hit that "again, again, again" point where I don't want to listen to things that aren't it.

(I've got both Bjork and the lost Aphex SAWs sitting there, and don't want to go to them, want to go back to this album again.)

I dunno. Part of what's so *appealing* about this album is the cohesive *wholeness* of it. (Especially a relief after the unrelenting too-much-ness of Goldenheart.) Its sequencing is perfect, and more important, the *transitions* are amazing. Some of my favourite bits on this record are the supposed 'interludes' - like Titans into Warriors is astonishing, and then the slow, careful wind-down of the beat from Warriors to Projection is just... UH! Like, it's not *just* that the songs, individually are amazing, but the transitions, the liminal spaces between them are just so beautiful and perfectly planned out.

Like, this is what keeps making me think "prog" - it's not just the complexity of the music - those baroque harmonies! the technique of her arrangements is always, y'know WOW! - or the 'experimental' Aphexy sounds. It's the execution of Album Qua Album where you don't feel like you're listening to a collection of songs, you feel like you are listening to a self-contained suite, a symphony where each piece leads to the next. (This is far more noticeable now I'm not listening on Spotify with its awkward 2-second gaps between songs.)

Branwell with an N, Wednesday, 28 January 2015 13:27 (4 days ago) Permalink

i think my favourite transition might be one of the ones that isn't a transition, that actually marks one section finishing and another starting - the way "adderall/sold" DROPS into "swim free", it's vertiginous stuff. after how busy and head-spinning the first five tracks are, to suddenly be plunged into something as still and spare as "swim free" is, just, GASP

the transitions within "adderall/sold" are just spectacular build-and-release

lex pretend, Wednesday, 28 January 2015 13:39 (4 days ago) Permalink

SEE YOU IN MY HEEEEEEAAADD

guess that bundt gettin eaten (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Wednesday, 28 January 2015 13:55 (4 days ago) Permalink

this could be the album to unite us all

Ban Kil Moon (imago), Wednesday, 28 January 2015 14:04 (4 days ago) Permalink

There's this one transition (and of course I can't find it when I'm looking for it) where there's this pounding bass drum going at it 4-4, and I can't even describe what the EQ filter is doing, but it's like it suddenly drops from this pounding BOOM BOOM BOOM kick and it just... goes underwater and keeps sinking and getting more and more muffled and watery, and that's just like... wow. Damn. I love the details like that.

Branwell with an N, Wednesday, 28 January 2015 14:04 (4 days ago) Permalink

OK, yeah, it's the aforementioned end of Warriors. And the underwater drum turns into a heartbeat, then the gauzy shimmer of Projection starts, and that is just such a perfect moment.

IMPRINTED IN MY HEEEEAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAADDDDDD

Branwell with an N, Wednesday, 28 January 2015 14:09 (4 days ago) Permalink

So... is that mask on the cover going on or coming off?

― longneck, Friday, January 16, 2015 5:45 AM (1 week ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

still haven't worked out what i think the answer to this is

lex pretend, Wednesday, 28 January 2015 14:23 (4 days ago) Permalink

bought this the first day obv but I've been waiting for the right moment for the first spin; thread obv suggests I should just fuck it and put it on

droit au butt (Euler), Wednesday, 28 January 2015 14:24 (4 days ago) Permalink

Lex's reference to Imogen Heap upthread got me thinking that the best thing that could happen to Dawn would be to have a "Hide & Seek" style viral moment - something that crossed over to an audience open to what she's doing while bypassing both the usual critical and commercial gatekeepers.

But even then the boost that created for Imogen's career was only relative.

― Tim F, Wednesday, January 28, 2015 4:07 AM Bookmark

"Hide & Seek" was used as a tv theme tho.

The Reverend, Wednesday, 28 January 2015 20:30 (4 days ago) Permalink

Yes exactly! Or rather an end credits soundtrack right (The OC iirc)? I meant "usual gatekeepers" as in the usual ways that music becomes big. Obv there was some sort of executive who ultimately approved its use.

It's really "pre-viral" in the sense that it predates the ubiquity of social media but I feel like it's a good example of how some music / artists may have an audience out there for them but only if there is a means of communication and an appropriate context. For "Hide & Seek", connecting the song to an emotionally overwrought adolescent tv show cliffhanger was the best way to get past the idea of the song as ~My First Tori Amos does "O Superman"~ which was never gonna fly either critically or commercially.

I remember an Australian Idol contestant performed it the following year and all the judges were like "we were really concerned by this choice as we've never heard of this song before. But you've reassured us that everyone under the age of 20 knows this song."

I'm not sure what song you'd choose from Dawn's catalogue or what the means of communication would be but I do feel like she's an artist for whom those strategies would be more likely to work than others.

Tim F, Wednesday, 28 January 2015 21:40 (4 days ago) Permalink

~My First Tori Amos does "O Superman"~

ha

The Reverend, Wednesday, 28 January 2015 21:42 (4 days ago) Permalink

"Hide & Seek" got a little VH1 and pop radio airplay when it was new but yeah it only really gradually saturated pop culture through The OC and Jason DeRulo, etc.

some dude, Wednesday, 28 January 2015 21:44 (4 days ago) Permalink

oh god, I'd managed to block that Derulo song from memory

The Reverend, Wednesday, 28 January 2015 21:52 (4 days ago) Permalink

to be accurate, the only song where i feel dawn goes OTT with the heapisms is "86", which put me off it for a while

~My First Tori Amos does "O Superman"~

this is otm. i really quite dislike "hide & seek"

lex pretend, Wednesday, 28 January 2015 21:58 (4 days ago) Permalink

Yeah I didn't mean they're that similar as artists, more that it occurred to me that there's an entire chasm that female artists can fall into when they're 1) too earnest to be sirens; 2) not aggressive enough to be one of the boys; and 3) not already a popular success. The 90s is littered with the bones of artists who fell into this category and even when they found an audience or occasionally even managed some kind of crossover success it felt despite of, rather than because of, the existing patterns of commercial or critical support.

Tim F, Wednesday, 28 January 2015 22:03 (4 days ago) Permalink

earnestness is interesting bc obv someone like fka twigs is also earnest but in a completely different way?

actually, maybe a depressing reason is that dawn as a solo artist has been mostly unbothered about sounding sexy

lex pretend, Wednesday, 28 January 2015 22:08 (4 days ago) Permalink

to be accurate, the only song where i feel dawn goes OTT with the heapisms is "86", which put me off it for a while

"Superhero"! "86" just sounds like a Jam & Lewis ballad to me.

The Reverend, Wednesday, 28 January 2015 22:22 (4 days ago) Permalink

earnestness is interesting bc obv someone like fka twigs is also earnest but in a completely different way?

actually, maybe a depressing reason is that dawn as a solo artist has been mostly unbothered about sounding sexy

― lex pretend, Wednesday, January 28, 2015 10:08 PM (37 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

yeah I think with fka twigs even her earnestness is filtered through a "sensuousness of surfaces" aesthetic (AKA what artists mean when they namecheck Aaliyah) that allows her to be experienced as pure affect. It's not that dawn's surfaces aren't sensuous, but I think the music doesn't sit easily within that as a primary frame.

Tim F, Wednesday, 28 January 2015 22:53 (4 days ago) Permalink

Yay, new interview

http://www.factmag.com/2015/01/30/dawn-richard-interview/

Ned Raggett, Friday, 30 January 2015 15:48 (2 days ago) Permalink

really good interview. been wanting to read someone else (not a gossip site) interview her for a long time.

lex pretend, Friday, 30 January 2015 15:49 (2 days ago) Permalink

calypso (daughter of a titan) as in the greek myth, of course

lex pretend, Friday, 30 January 2015 15:50 (2 days ago) Permalink

Nice review, Lex.

longneck, Friday, 30 January 2015 16:37 (2 days ago) Permalink

I think I've had this Muhsinah EP on my hard drive for years but never listened to it til now cause the mp3s weren't tagged right, but the first three tracks are very Richardesque.

http://www.okayplayer.com/news/muhsinah-gone-double-ep-download.html

aybaybayfan (The Reverend), Friday, 30 January 2015 22:57 (2 days ago) Permalink


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