I just bought "Fresh" by Sly & the Family Stone and . . .

Riot: 5 stars
Fresh: 4 and a half

I don't think it would effect his reputation in the slightest. Look at all the "Buy the best of" comments in the thread. Sly's rep is totally made from his hit singles, and Riot only contains "Family Affair", all the others came before it. As much as I love the album, the general population isn't basing their love of him on that record.

(FWIW, I'd say similar things aboot the Stones and Exile on Main Street.)

I like "Back on the Right Track" a lot.

please. of course it would. riot is the one critics write weighty essays about, and the one that shows up highest in lists of greatest records. when it comes to "reputations," that stuff matters just as much if not more than sales.

And as I said, I don't think that matters to the general population. I hear "Hot Fun in the Summertime" and "Thank You" on the radio far more than I hear "Family Affair". If greatest albums list meant shit to most people, Forever Again and The Velvet Undergound and Nico would be anchoring classic rock weekends the world over, or at least played on oldies stations with some regularity.

yet somehow, las if by magic, ou reed is a far more legendary figure in rock n' roll than, say, boston

reputation isn't about radio play or "most people"

How would we think of his (their) career if you take Riot out of the picture?

I don't think it would effect his reputation in the slightest. Look at all the "Buy the best of" comments in the thread. Sly's rep is totally made from his hit singles, and Riot only contains "Family Affair", all the others came before it. As much as I love the album, the general population isn't basing their love of him on that record.

I totally agree. I was more trying to counter the people who said Fresh was not a drop from previous records.

Cool description. I actually listen to Fresh more than Stand

None of which is to say I don't like it. In fact one of my favorites on the elpee.

And they were an inspiration for Miles Davis's On the Corner, if I'm correct...

-- howell huser (chaki.tim...), December 14th, 2005.

OTM

Instrumentation is kinda blah

??!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?

-natin'

that fairly well sums up my feelings, too.

i think its a case of you having no soul!

xpost do you mean soul in the Motown sense or in the Grim Reaper sense? cause I'm with you on the latter.

Some people swear by it, but apart from "Que Sera Sera" I can't feel any affection or awe for Fresh at all.
feel the opposite way. i love all of this record, except que sera sera.

it's pretty much a throwaway. the vocal is kinda funny.

thanks for the link shakey!

but i really don't think que sera is throwaway! i find it really moving!

I still wanna know if the "que sera sera" cover sparked the Sly/Doris Day romance rumour, or if it was an ironic comment on it

weird rumor, wouldn't doris day have been over 50 at the time?

ok, important blog post:
Sly Stone, Doris Day, and the breakup with Larry Graham (repost)
http://aaronjjohnson.com/blog/2011/05/12/sly-stone-doris-day-and-the-breakup-with-larry-graham-repost/

according to the Sly "Off the Record" book (the greatest rock bio ever btw) it was an ironic comment on it, and the only reason there was a rumor at all was because of the Terry Melcher connection

ha xp

Damn, I've really gotta read "Off The Record" someday - I know you've made that "best bio ever" claim before on another Sly thread

yeah me too. looks like it's pretty cheap used on amazon...

Thanks Shakey!

"For the Record" is great - dunno about "best rock bio ever" (as a technical matter, it's actually an oral history, predictably with zero involvement from Sly himself) but it's a brisk and devastating read. Sure as shit beats the recent, Sly-approved tome "I Want to Take You Higher" by Jeff Kaliss.

I still rate Riot the highest, yet I've probably played and enjoyed Fresh more over the years. Around 2005 I picked up the new box set of just about all the reissued albums for just $35. Awesome.

I guess it was 2007. And yeah it's annoyingly missing "Hot Fun in the Summertime," "Everybody is a Star," and "Thank You (Falettinme Be Mice Elf Agin)" but hey, it was 7 albums for $35.

grr, those ommissions make me so furious! Such a stupid, pointless flaw, especially when they bothered to include redundant mono-edited mixes of other singles. That's why people hate record companies. It's like the doctor says "Congratulations, you have a beautiful healthy baby girl...of course, we accidentally severed her baby toe through sheer stupid negligence, but other than that she's 97% healthy"

...but yeah, $35 is a great bargain.

Sure as shit beats the recent, Sly-approved tome "I Want to Take You Higher" by Jeff Kaliss.

lol kinda don't want to read anything that's Sly-approved tbh

the whole record sounds so modern

jordan so otm, i can't even really think about this as a 1973 record even though the sound says somehow i should

brian eno also otm

http://beatpatrol.wordpress.com/2010/02/10/brian-eno-the-studio-as-compositional-tool-1983/

Then, from the time of Sly and the Family Stone’s Fresh album, there’s a flip over, where the rhythm instruments, particularly the bass drum and bass, suddenly become the important instruments in the mix. A timbral change also takes place. The bass becomes a very defined instrument; by the use of amplitude control filters, the bass actually begins to take on a very vocal attack. The bass drum gains a more physical sound, and also has a click to it; generally you’ll find that bass drums are equalized very heavily, something like 1000-1500 cycles, to give a real sharp click. It becomes the loudest instrument in disco — watch the vu meter while a disco track is playing, and you’ll see the needle peak each time the bass drum hits.

The hi-hats on "In-Time" blow me away (both playing-wise and recording/EQ-wise). The 16ths are so light and subtle and then the barks just scream (er, bark) out of the mix.
― Jordan (Jordan), Wednesday, December 14, 2005 2:02 PM (8 years ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

yeah these type of drums are basically my favorite thing

Ha, I just randomly heard a song from this record the other day on the radio and totally though it was new song.

Thanks for that essay j

Goddamnit, if you don't think this album is classic YOU'RE FUCKING WRONG

It's the personal, sort of optimistic twin to Riot IMO. It's an album I want to make the whole world listen to and then I want them to fill out questionnaires about it and if I think you don't get its greatness, you'll listen again and again. Because its beautiful and sad and happy and funky and weird and that goddamn BASS and those fucking DRUMS man.

Their best album.

Eno otm about the centrality of the rhythm. Another Green World's "Over Fire Island" sounds like a product of this album.

My favourite Sly. Especially (as I've doubtless said already in this thread) the later mix that Sony accidentally pressed on CD in 91.

You are all right. And we need a deluxe 2cd version with both mixes and whatever else they can find. I'd pay for a third disc of just isolated drum and bass tracks.

I'd be happy if someone just pressed that alt mix on vinyl