The Sundays : C or D

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But Blind is much better than anything the Cocteau Twins ever did.

― ryan, Monday, 29 July 2002 00:00 (10 years ago) Permalink

But isn't "Cry" a lovely song? Even if the mandolin solo is perhaps one egg too much for the pudding.

― Venga, Wednesday, 31 July 2002 00:00 (10 years ago) Permalink

1 year passes...

Where are they from?

― Mary (Mary), Thursday, 21 August 2003 02:10 (9 years ago) Permalink

the UK

― electric sound of jim (electricsound), Thursday, 21 August 2003 02:23 (9 years ago) Permalink

There was a time I was absolutely mad for the Sundays. That time ended approximately two weeks ago, when "mad" gave way to a more gentile "wild."

Seriously, Harriet Wheeler has the most beautiful female voice I've ever heard. Going against conventional rockist wisdom, I'd pick her over Aretha, Dusty, Nina, Billie or any other highly regarded musical woman in pop's history.

It's hard to believe it's been six years since Static & Silence came out (a full five years after Blind). I'm hoping there will be a 4th album by 2010, but I fear that will forever remain a daydream.

― Andrew Frye (paul cox), Thursday, 21 August 2003 02:25 (9 years ago) Permalink

7 months pass...

are there even any rumours anymore? Where have the Sundays gone?

― derrick (derrick), Sunday, 28 March 2004 07:48 (9 years ago) Permalink

I find it difficult to believe I never noticed this thread before.

I am touched by Gareth's reference to Stevenage back there. But it's difficult to reconcile the wistful charms of Wheeler with the damply grim banality of the town. In fact they remind me of Norwich, party because that was where I was studying when I heard them and partly because they seem more appropriate to that slightly sleepy market town setting.

Harriet Wheeler once kissed me. I will take that memory to the grave.

― Jerry the Nipper (Jerrynipper), Sunday, 28 March 2004 09:37 (9 years ago) Permalink

Harriet Wheeler once kissed me. I will take that memory to the grave.

She once waited at the same bus stop as me in Camden with David G, child and shopping. I will take that memory to Safeway.

― Michael Jones (MichaelJ), Sunday, 28 March 2004 11:05 (9 years ago) Permalink

Well - it takes all sorts to make a world - for me "Static and Silence" is their best record.

I don't know if "Cry" is about the death of Harriet's dad, but I KNOW it's about the death of mine: I have to programme it out if I don't want to burst into tears.

But how about "Monochrome"? What an extraordinarily atmospheric song. It's so visual; I see these two little girls looking at the moon landings on a television, and Armstrong and Aldrin dancing through the air, and then the girls looking out the window at the moon.

They're dancing around -
slow puppets, silver ground,
and the stars and stripes in the sand.
We hear a voice from above,
and it's history.
And we stayed awake
all night.

They're dancing around.
It sends a shiver down my spine,
and I run to look in the sky,
and I half expect to hear them asking to come down.

That song sure sends a shiver down *my* spine.

― Baravelli. (Jake Proudlock), Sunday, 28 March 2004 13:21 (9 years ago) Permalink

I want to improve on Mike's pay-off... but it just can't be done.

― the pinefox, Tuesday, 30 March 2004 15:08 (9 years ago) Permalink

I feel for you.

― Ally C (Ally C), Tuesday, 30 March 2004 15:51 (9 years ago) Permalink

I think I love you.

― Michael Jones (MichaelJ), Tuesday, 30 March 2004 15:56 (9 years ago) Permalink

Both of us?

― Ally C (Ally C), Tuesday, 30 March 2004 16:24 (9 years ago) Permalink

I've enjoyed "Blind" a lot more over the years. Especially the Wild Horses cover. Very underrated album. Plus, it has my favorite Morrissey lyric not written by Morrissey:

"This is my life and it's all very well, but never never ever again...."

― kickitcricket, Tuesday, 30 March 2004 18:38 (9 years ago) Permalink

That's what I get for not signing my posts (all my posts from now on, on every thread) Chaka Khan.

reading, writing and arithmetic does seem out on its own - sonically, lyrically - and Blind has a closer relation in Static and Silence I think. rwa is such a chilly, bare-floored record for all its talk of woollen things.

I recall the mixed reception Blind received on its release from the UK inkies. MM, which seemed to have thrown its lot in with the resurgent US rock scene and Brit rave culture with a little more gusto than indie centrale NME, embraced Blind as a wilful anomaly, a wistful gem - there was ET's glowing LP review, Mueller gushing over "Medicine" on the radio and a Quebecois live review in strips of purple. Lamacq gave the album a desultory three, maybe four out of ten in the NME, sad that the band he'd championed had somehow lost the power to jangle.

I saw them that December in Wolverhampton. Winter recast in the Wulfrun Hall, icicles on the lighting rig.

― Michael Jones (MichaelJ), Wednesday, 31 March 2004 08:32 (9 years ago) Permalink

She had very nice hair IIRC.

― Dr. C (Dr. C), Wednesday, 31 March 2004 08:51 (9 years ago) Permalink

I find the continuing support for Harriet's hair, and the Sundays generally, I find somewhat bemusing.

"This is my life and it's all very well, but never never ever again...."

This is a bad line that illustrates their weakness. It's nothing like Morrissey, or not like good Morrissey anyway.

― N. (nickdastoor), Wednesday, 31 March 2004 09:12 (9 years ago) Permalink

they did a bbc sesh which i only found out about recently, as the version of 'my finest hour' was on bbc6. had different words and everything. it was probably done before the album for like kid jensen or whoever.

― piscesboy, Wednesday, 31 March 2004 09:43 (9 years ago) Permalink

Mark Goodier, prob. (Kid Jensen long gone).

― N. (nickdastoor), Wednesday, 31 March 2004 09:51 (9 years ago) Permalink

Harriet Wheeler once sang happy birthday to me during a radio interview I did many years ago. I will take that with me. Don't know where, but it's coming along for the ride.

― Rob Bolton (Rob Bolton), Wednesday, 31 March 2004 10:20 (9 years ago) Permalink

Weren't they the cover stars on the first NME of the 1990s, the issue after the Roses on Top of The World Christmas double edition? Fuck, that brings me back. Everything seemed so much more precious back then. The days when indie meant more than life or death! "Can't Be Sure" was one of the big buzz singles throughout 1989 in the inklies but I remember alright the mixed reception the album then got. It did sound a little flat however aside from the 2 or 3 classics.

― David Gunnip (David Gunnip), Wednesday, 31 March 2004 13:02 (9 years ago) Permalink

They had a little cake.

― N. (nickdastoor), Wednesday, 31 March 2004 13:23 (9 years ago) Permalink

I think RWA is just about perfect from top to bottom. I don't really listen to the other two that much.

I've been on vacation. Can someone please clue me in on what IIRC means?

― rainman (rainman), Wednesday, 31 March 2004 13:29 (9 years ago) Permalink

Classic.

― Tico Tico (Tico Tico), Wednesday, 31 March 2004 13:37 (9 years ago) Permalink

Sorry that's misleading. I think the Sundays are Classic.

IIRC means "if I remember correctly".

― Tico Tico (Tico Tico), Wednesday, 31 March 2004 13:38 (9 years ago) Permalink

Harriet Wheeler once kissed me

how did we let this go by without more explanation?????

― anthony kyle monday (akmonday), Wednesday, 31 March 2004 15:05 (9 years ago) Permalink

Weren't they the cover stars on the first NME of the 1990s?
Melody Maker.
and maybe NME as well, but MM yes.

― zebedee (zebedee), Wednesday, 31 March 2004 15:11 (9 years ago) Permalink

NME yes.

― N. (nickdastoor), Wednesday, 31 March 2004 15:12 (9 years ago) Permalink

N.'s facts are customarily correct. Yet it's a fact that in MM the Sundays LED THE CHARGE INTO TOMORROW'S WHIRL. Do you people remember nothing?

I tried to post to this thread yesterday and things went wrong. So now, again, I will say, perhaps dully:

Careminted phrases pay the rent, and Jones delivers.

That sentence was far better the first time I sent it.

I *think* it was 'careminted'. If you have any better ideas, post them... below.

― the bellefox, Thursday, 1 April 2004 17:16 (9 years ago) Permalink

2 months pass...

I ended up digging out "Reading, Writing..." yesterday, because it was driving me crazy trying to figure out exactly what GURL the bloke from Delays sounds like. And Harriet Wheeler would be the answer to that question.

What a beautiful, poignant, delicious album. It has so many elements that have irritated me senseless in other bands (Cranberries, "Torn", Sixpence) but somehow it's all just charming and perfect and bicycles and cardigans and a dress, dress, dress that I've been sick on.

― People love Gravity and Evolution! (kate), Wednesday, 23 June 2004 08:28 (8 years ago) Permalink

it's psychedelic!

― pete b. (pete b.), Wednesday, 23 June 2004 08:43 (8 years ago) Permalink

But it isn't psychedelic. The Smiths are perhaps more psychedelic cause at least they had that tremolo. It's all about the jangle, that the jangle occasionally dares to be dissonant instead of just mindlessly pleasant.

― People love Gravity and Evolution! (kate), Wednesday, 23 June 2004 08:47 (8 years ago) Permalink

i'm mostly joking. it's just that i was quite surprised when i first heard the album (not long ago) because i was expecting, like you say, a pleasant jangle, and a sort of dull monochrome sonic palette. the dissonance (in the vocals as well as guitars?) was quite jarring, and i think it's this jarring sound that makes the record sound very vivid, very colourful to me. i remember on another thread someone comparing the sundays to boards of canada and i think there is a kind of homespun, dancing-in-the-meadows, very british trippiness to both of them.

― pete b. (pete b.), Wednesday, 23 June 2004 09:03 (8 years ago) Permalink

Boards of Canada + The Sundays = ?

― charltonlido (gareth), Wednesday, 23 June 2004 09:15 (8 years ago) Permalink

'dress, dress, dress that I've been sick on' - 'sitting on', surely?

― bham, Wednesday, 23 June 2004 11:15 (8 years ago) Permalink

No! Don't ruin the song for me. I've always believe that it was "sick on". Please don't tell me it's not, it will destroy it for me!

― People love Gravity and Evolution! (kate), Wednesday, 23 June 2004 11:17 (8 years ago) Permalink

FWIW I've also always heard it as "sick on"!

― Hanna (Hanna), Wednesday, 23 June 2004 11:20 (8 years ago) Permalink

That's the beauty of the Sundays, that line sums it all up for me. The juxtaposition of "In a cardigan..." (twee as fuck) "...and I dress that I've been sick on" (throwing up from booze or worse, not very twee at all) and still you love her for it.

― People love Gravity and Evolution! (kate), Wednesday, 23 June 2004 11:23 (8 years ago) Permalink

the Bic Runga track that radcliffe keeps playing reminds me, somehow, of the Sundays.

― koogs (koogs), Wednesday, 23 June 2004 11:23 (8 years ago) Permalink

http://www.lyricsfreak.com/s/sundays/133613.html says 'Sick On'

― koogs (koogs), Wednesday, 23 June 2004 11:26 (8 years ago) Permalink

Phew!

― People love Gravity and Evolution! (kate), Wednesday, 23 June 2004 11:27 (8 years ago) Permalink

This lyrics page says "sick on", phew!
http://www.huan.com/sundays/sound/reading/

I also love the lyrics for "I kicked a boy", kind of the same violent un-twee-ness, sung in Wheeler's wonderfully girlish voice that has some sort of hidden madness to it deep down somewhere.

Oh x-post! :-)

― Hanna (Hanna), Wednesday, 23 June 2004 11:30 (8 years ago) Permalink

Harriet is one of my favourite lyricists ever.

― Tim Finney (Tim Finney), Wednesday, 23 June 2004 12:18 (8 years ago) Permalink

Doesn't David write the words?

― Jerry the Nipper (Jerrynipper), Wednesday, 23 June 2004 12:23 (8 years ago) Permalink

Argh no please don't say that this is one of my few "they really mean it" illusions!

― Tim Finney (Tim Finney), Wednesday, 23 June 2004 12:24 (8 years ago) Permalink

"Words and music by Gauvin/Wheeler" - doesn't actually say who does what.

I assume that Gauvin has never worn a dress, so it's probably safe to assume that particular lyric is Wheeler's. ;-)

― People love Gravity and Evolution! (kate), Wednesday, 23 June 2004 12:25 (8 years ago) Permalink

When I met them back in 92 or 93, I had a query about a particular lyric from the first album and it was certainly David who had written it.

― Jerry the Nipper (Jerrynipper), Wednesday, 23 June 2004 12:27 (8 years ago) Permalink

(btw that lyric referring to a dress also says "I'm a better man than others by far")

― Jerry the Nipper (Jerrynipper), Wednesday, 23 June 2004 12:28 (8 years ago) Permalink

I always thought that was a cute gender bending moment/feminist statement.

― Tim Finney (Tim Finney), Wednesday, 23 June 2004 12:33 (8 years ago) Permalink

It took me a while before I realized that she was singing "hideous towns make me throw up" (in keeping with the "sick on" vein).

I heard "Here's Where the Story Ends" in a grocery store the other day, making my sandwich-purchasing experience just perfect.

― Ernest P. (ernestp), Wednesday, 23 June 2004 12:46 (8 years ago) Permalink

Skipping 180 messages at this point... Click here if you want to load them all.

Thank you once again, Spotify, for stuff like this: an absolutely gorgeous song, which should have been on Static and Silence, consigned to the b-side of the Cry single.

See how it's shining through the dark
As the teardrops fall and it illuminates the room
And we can't stop staring for a moment

― that mustardless plate (Bill A), Friday, 30 September 2011 12:42 (1 year ago) Permalink

6 months pass...

Static & Silence sounds lovely tonight.

― Tim F, Tuesday, 17 April 2012 13:37 (1 year ago) Permalink

"I used to be really frustrated about the lack of a lyric sheet on, at least, the vinyl, and actually wrote to Rough Trade asking them for this (or anything else Sundays-related). A white envelope came through the door a few weeks later with the lyrics to the LP photocopied by someone in the office, nothing else, no note or acknowledgement as I recall. I was looking for that envelope the other day but goodness knows just where it is now."

Reading this made me think "I miss the days when I'd do this kind of thing" but when I thought about it, I don't ever think I've written to a record company for lyrics ... A weird nostalgia for something that never actually happened.

― djh, Tuesday, 17 April 2012 22:58 (1 year ago) Permalink

I think I might now know where that envelope is.

― the pinefox, Wednesday, 18 April 2012 14:37 (1 year ago) Permalink

I think Reading Writing and Arithmetic is pretty solid, though I'm not as crazy about Wheeler's voice as some. It's that fashion for faux-naive, girlish-sounding voices in early '90s alternative music that dates it a bit. Cf. Kim Deal and Edie Brickell.

― o. nate, Thursday, 19 April 2012 15:30 (1 year ago) Permalink

faux-naive, girlish-sounding voices in early '90s alternative music that dates it a bit

One of the only styles from the 90s I'm still fond of and wish was as widespread now as it was then.

― Johnny Fever, Thursday, 19 April 2012 15:36 (1 year ago) Permalink

And yet, if the Sundays came back, they would still have a massive amount of goodwill.

― Mark G, Thursday, 19 April 2012 15:40 (1 year ago) Permalink

ha that's a great story about the lyrics sheet! very Rough Trade.

― piscesx, Thursday, 19 April 2012 16:45 (1 year ago) Permalink

9 months pass...

their cover of Wild Horses is ... somethin else

― surm, Tuesday, 29 January 2013 17:26 (3 months ago) Permalink

just imagine Mark Wahlberg and Reese Witherspoon necking

― the little prince of inane false binary hype (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Tuesday, 29 January 2013 17:29 (3 months ago) Permalink

ok now what

― ( ͡° ͜ʖ͡°) (sic), Tuesday, 29 January 2013 19:49 (3 months ago) Permalink

Now take your shirt off.

― Gollum: "Hot, Ready and Smeagol!" (Phil D.), Tuesday, 29 January 2013 19:51 (3 months ago) Permalink

Always makes me think of Buffy's prom

― Tim F, Tuesday, 29 January 2013 21:08 (3 months ago) Permalink

Glad pop culture never ruined this song for me. I still think of just listening to it in my room and pining for Harriet.

― Johnny Fever, Tuesday, 29 January 2013 21:09 (3 months ago) Permalink

ditto

― Cunga, Tuesday, 29 January 2013 21:23 (3 months ago) Permalink

it breaks my heart

― surm, Tuesday, 29 January 2013 21:27 (3 months ago) Permalink

Where did they go?

― Mark G, Tuesday, 29 January 2013 21:44 (3 months ago) Permalink

READING, WRITING & ARITHMETIC is one of my favorite albums of all time. Equivalent in quality, IMO, to The Smiths' or The Stone Roses' debut LPs.

― Tyler Burns (burns46824@yahoo.com), Tuesday, 29 January 2013 21:51 (3 months ago) Permalink

mmeeeeee too

― surm, Tuesday, 29 January 2013 21:52 (3 months ago) Permalink

Equivalent in quality, IMO, to The Smiths' or The Stone Roses' debut LPs.

I am offended on behalf of The Sundays.

― Tim F, Tuesday, 29 January 2013 21:52 (3 months ago) Permalink

o SNAP!

― surm, Tuesday, 29 January 2013 21:53 (3 months ago) Permalink

Correct, though, that this is one of the finest albums.

― Tim F, Tuesday, 29 January 2013 21:59 (3 months ago) Permalink

Blind gets a lot of stick but imo Goodbye is the best thing they ever did. It has serious bite, none of the whimsy of the debut that doesn't really appeal, and the multiple guitars at the end absolutely slay me.

― ledge, Thursday, 31 January 2013 16:18 (3 months ago) Permalink

I love them so much that I even think Static & Silence is great, adult contempo synth horns and all.

― The Apple Dumpling Gangbang (Old Lunch), Thursday, 31 January 2013 16:22 (3 months ago) Permalink

agree that "goodbye" is an all-time great song! "those stories were a good read... they were dumb as well" is undeniably classic.

― the girl from spirea x (f. hazel), Thursday, 31 January 2013 16:41 (3 months ago) Permalink

I've listened to RW&A a few times recently, influenced by the fact that it was released 23 years ago this month. 23 years. That's a lot of memories, but every time I listen I still remember listening to it when it first came out; it was my getting ready to go out music, of all things. And, as dear old Bimble wrote in this thread: "I'm 18 years old again when I hear this music.", but it sparkles with the same quiet power even now, and Harriet's voice is pretty, but never drippy or girlish - there's a steeliness to it, and, although her lyrics can be somewhat impressionistic, they also contain lines that are straightforward, brusque or barbed. I do love her phrasing, though. This go around I'm being particularly haunted by "Joy", and how she sings the line "Well you saw him/and you can hardly know", which gives me shivers.

― DavidM, Thursday, 31 January 2013 19:13 (3 months ago) Permalink

― DavidM, Thursday, 31 January 2013 19:18 (3 months ago) Permalink

I don't anticipate them ever falling out of my all-time top five artists.

― The Apple Dumpling Gangbang (Old Lunch), Thursday, 31 January 2013 20:38 (3 months ago) Permalink

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