da DeRogatis thread

http://www.chicagomag.com/pressbox/pressbox_story.htm

"We were excluded because we were young and threatening. At the ripe old age of 25, they didn't want to hear what a 22-year-old or a 20-year-old thought about Husker Du."

It's horseshit because there WERE 22-year-olds writing about Husker Du (or bands of Husker Du's ilk) at the time, in the very publications Derogatis mentions. (The ones that he says "excluded" him.) And it's horseshit because Jim's criticism has NEVER been especially threatening (or especially good, for that matter.) Unless you think there's something threatening about finding reasons not to like Third Eye Blind or Hootie and the Blowfish, anyway. (Well, I suppose Hootie and Third Eye Blind fans might be threatened by him. But big deal, you know?)

"The Village Voice has this kind of pretentious vision of what they are . . . the last word in hipness in American underground music, and they don't give a fuck about New York, to the point where, they didn't care about the Strokes, then the Strokes happened, then they don't cover the Strokes because now the Strokes are too big for them. So [Village Voice] readers never got [to read about the Strokes] at all."


Between the Regulars column, SOTC, listings, features, and all the locals who get covered in the section proper, I really don't understand how anybody could believe the Voice ignores the rock-and-otherwise scene in New York (even if local-scene boosterism IS pretty pointless, per se'.) But the REAL horseshit above, though is the stuff about the Strokes, whose first import EP was reviewed both in Christgau's consumer guide and (while they were touring the UK) given a 600-word sidebar by Christina Rees in the section itself, and whose album was the subject of a lead review by Nick Catucci when it came out. So why Jim thinks Voice readers never got to read about the band is beyond me. (And yeah, I'm not really Jeri Curlan. Who cares?)

Jim was also in Speed The Plough, a Trypes/Feelies offshoot who made some beautiful records in the '80s. For that alone, he gets a pass.

try this one instead (i hope):

http://www.chicagomag.com/pressbox/112802pressbox.htm

Last fall, I had occasion to send an e-mail to Chicago Sun-Times rock critic Jim DeRogatis that said, in part: “Frankly, movie critics, book reviewers, etc. are, well, maybe not a dime a dozen, but in abundance. Really good rock critics are so rare, more than they should be considering how passionate so many people feel about music.

Maybe that’s because being a rock critic is even more complex than being, say, a movie critic. It takes more original thinking, there’s less outside guidance, and it’s harder to describe why something is good or bad. Why isn’t there more, better rock criticism?”

That's so fucking ridiculous, it's not even funny!

Chamberlain: I don’t have a writing background at all. My degree is in Russian and Slavic literature . . . .I [started] as receptionist at Newcity.

Last I checked, Dave-y, you had to have some sort of "writing background" to major in literature. This guy is HANDS-DOWN the WORST crit in Chicago. He once referred to John Fahey in print as "Joshua Fahey" or "Matthew Fahey" or some such nonsense. Some writers need editors because of clarity and content, he needs one to wipe his ass.

Kot: Three major musical movements started in Chicago. Three major movements that changed the course of music history, and you rarely heard about it here. Nobody made a big deal about it. I’m talking about house music, I’m talking about industrial music, and I’m talking about that whole noise rock thing that Big Black was doing, [Steve] Albini and people like that. Those movements are still very much alive today, and have sort of been co-opted by other people who figured out how to make the money, but the creativity was here in Chicago. And then there’s blues and jazz. This town is incredible, but it doesn’t make a big deal about itself. And that’s a really appealing combination.

"And then there's blues and jazz?" Yeah, so when it's black people, it only warrants barely a sentence? What a fucking idiot.

DeRotGut: In Chicago, we go to a big show at Metro and there’s a table for Peter, me, Greg, and Dave. And the other 996 people who paid to get in, paid to get in! And what’s more, they know who we are, and on the way in they’re gonna stop us and say, “Peter, what a fucking piece of shit column you wrote, man! Can’t you do better than that? I want your job!” I got it twice on the way in here.

He's smoking crack if he thinks that they're the only industry flacks at shows. I used to see lots of press, p.r., record company, girlfriends, hanger-ons (like myself), lucky kids and other people at Metro shows that didn't pay.

Regardless, the fact that nobody made "a big deal" about those things has a lot to do with why Chicago sucks (although it sucked much, much harder in the 80s).

Why must anyone promoting Chicago put down New York by way of contrast? And what is wrong with a modicum of self-promotion? (BTW, numerous local bands have of course made very big deals of themselves, or rather the labels have done it for them. Latest example, OKGo.) There is naturally much to love and hate in both cities. New York can be a wonderful place, save for the rents. That seems self-evident to me.

Anyways, he must be missing all the tourist traps that are the blues clubs, and how every Chicago tourist brochure boasts Muddy Waters and Buddy Guy and Chuck Berry. Or every pizza ad that opens with a few bars from "Sweet Home Chicago."

That said, people could stand to know more about Lester Melrose and the '30s/'40s Bluebird blues scene; Big Bill Broonzy, Memphis Minnie, and so forth. I suppose it seems like ancient history to so many people now. http://www.doctorjazz.freeserve.co.uk/portlater.html

OK Go suck donkey ballz.

For one thing, I wouldn't be so sure that lots of fans of the Dave Matthews Band (who are basically an art-rock band, after all -- more or less the missing like between Peter Gabriel and the Dismemberment Plan) don't consider Dave's music "art." Second, I wouldn't be so certain that fans of Dave Matthews (whose music Derogatis way-too-predictably compares to McDonald's) are any more set in their ways, or any less open to criticism of their hero, than fans of, say, Nirvana or Sleater-Kinney or Tori Amos or Bright Eyes or D'Angelo or Tool or Lauryn Hill or Ani Difranco or Flaming Lips or Wilco (all of whose music has also been surpassed by precedents) or whoever.

Alright, I'll shut up now.

i don't quite get the level of hate derogatis inspires. i mean, he's a terrible writer, not an original idea in his head, he's smug, self-satisfied, and bloated (writing wise, people!). but you can say that about a lot of critics. also, he doesn't seem all that ubiquitous, although keep in mind i don't read any of the major rock/pop mags or most weeklies. is it just a case of "this horrible fucker is in my paper every week"? (cf. my hatred for joey sweeney. and the seattle weekly and the stranger, fucking abominations both.)

(p.s. stencil i picked up that kevin drumm disc on yr recommendation on another thread. nice.)

That said, 'ere's Jim vs. the Hootie Machine: http://www.furious.com/perfect/hootie.html

Yeah, I know. Just considering the long, long history of blues and jazz in Chicago, and the subsequent contributions that Chicagoans have made to both forms, I found it odd he only gives them a token mention.

(which drumm? the mego one? he's got a new one coming out on hanson in january.)

What sort of wiggle can we imagine Jim D.R. does at Wire shows?

Okay, I'll stop with the fat jokes now.

What is a "white-person wiggle"? Are blacks and other nonwhites incapable of wiggling? Is the wiggle of an African-American inherently different from that of a Caucasian?

http://www.jimdero.com/Vortis/Vortis1.htm

Highlights: "Maybe someone starts out listening to the Prodigy's hit single "Firestarter" and ends up searching out the more challenging Aphex Twin, Orb, or Headrillaz"; "bassist Leeroy Thornhill"; "Maxim Reality's frequently repeated boast, 'Change my pitch up/Smack my bitch up'"; "while it might not have struck you before, "Firestarter" is a song about an arsonist who really loves his work."

Actually, that's pretty *funny*, Nate! (Maybe even intentionally.)

But anyway, to answer Jess, what's really most despicable about Derogatis--what most sets him apart from all the other hacks putting in a an honest day's work covering rock music for dailies around this great nation of ours -- is his bizarre and entirely unfounded belief that he's some kind of renegade going against the grain. As somebody (I forget who, or maybe I don't) pointed out, as a writer he's way, way closer to Anthony Decurtis than to Lester Bangs. Which would be no big deal, of course, except, hey, guess which one of those two guys he wrote a book about? (And the book has some fun stories in it, don't get me wrong. But nowhere in it does Jim D. really talk about Lester's ideas--which are why he might deserve a bio the first place!)

JDR was in that band? I bought their alb because of the Feelies connection but I couldn't stand it.

Oh for fucks sake!

This is not to mention the band's lead singer, a sociology professor whose professed "role model" is the Unabomber and whose preferred attitude is "Raucous contempt."

Does this make anyone else sad? I found these sort of radical-chic poseurs unbearable and not a little pathetic in high school. But these guys are (temporally speaking) all grown up.

I like "Astral Weeks" but . . . gag.

i recall the evening i turned on the radio and heard j.d.r. reviewing a bottle rockets album: "ewww, some of this sounds like lynyrd skynyrd."

I live in Chicago, post on the SoundOpinions message board regularly, and I have a lot of experience reading Jim's work and listening to him on the radio. I must admit he does piss me off a lot. I recently called into the radio show to try and defend Think Tank (you know he's got me pisst when I gotta call into to defend a 6/10 record) just because of his review was so ridiculous. Maybe people outside the city don't read/listen to him enough to pick up on this but his neverending references to the Flaming Lips is enough to make a kid cry. He name drops them in reviews of everything from Super Furry Animals to Longwave (who he astoundingly included on his mid year top ten of 03) to his recent review of Hail To The Thief. When I saw Beck and The Lips last fall I met Wayne before the show and actually asked him about Jim...he played it real cool and said that even though people may disagree with him he is a passionate guy who really cares about music. I wouldn't be surprised if he ends up writing a book on them.

Another thing that nobody has brought up is Jim's rejection of all hip hop music made post-NWA. He is still writing off people like Jay-Z and Nas as nihilist gangsta rappers who should be ignored. He actually champions PM Dawn as an example of when all was right in hip hop.

All in all, I think it's pretty much already been settled by this thread. Jim is a nice guy who loves rock music but doesn't really care about being objective or covering everything fairly. He is going to harp on things that bug him and hype things that excite him...endlessly. So I end up asking myself...why read him?

I, however, will go to the mat for one Greg Kot. He consistantly puts out quality columns on rock music. He wrote _the_ definitive and first piece on Wilco's split from Nonesuch that was read by every person working in the industry. His writing for the Trib is much more rooted in traditional journalism than critical rhetoric and provides the reader with multiple perspectives on a broad range of issues in popular music. However, he's isn't exactly the most cutting edge critic around when it comes to record and concert reviews...but he does a solid job. I very much enjoyed his Hail To The Thief review. He is also a better writer than Derogatis who puts out a lot of trashy filler columns and QandA interviews with whoever is in town. Kot's column is almost always quality and he goes out of his way to expose a lot of different artists in his frequent Friday profiles. In the last year, off the top of my head, I've enjoyed his profiles on Camper Von Beethoven, Tomahawk, and Alexandro Escevedo (sp?). He's the only rock critic I've ever encountered who has such a balance between critical and journalistic writing. In the last year, again off the top of my head, he's had good journalistic type pieces about Protest music post-911, the file sharing debacle, and the FCC derregulation...all well written and with balanced and insightful sources.

Also, DeRo was writing about The Fire Show...remember that.

i take it back. DIE

What's wrong with listing Veruca Salt? (They were better than Ride.)

I don't know, I don't remember reading too many rave reviews of the new Ministry album (though that choice could be put down to vestigial Chicago loyalty, even if Al does live in Texas now).

http://idolator.com/355487/rock-critics-escape-from-behind-keyboards-onto-late-night-tv-wga-strike-ends

May 30 2008 4:11 PM EDT

R. Kelly Trial: Reporter Jim DeRogatis Ordered To Testify About Sex Tape

Defense wants to prove Chicago Sun-Times writer tampered with or created evidence.
By Jennifer Vineyard

CHICAGO — Though he tried to fight it, Chicago Sun-Times reporter Jim DeRogatis will be forced to testify in R. Kelly's child-pornography trial, Judge Vincent Gaughan ruled when he issued a subpoena for the reporter on Friday (May 30). The defense, however, will not be allowed to ask DeRogatis about his sources.

In February 2002, DeRogatis (along with fellow Sun-Times reporter Abdon Pallasch) broke the story about the existence of the alleged Kelly sex tape, a copy of which he received from an anonymous source and later turned in to the police. Defense attorney Marc Martin argued that since the tape had been in DeRogatis' "sole and exclusive possession," they needed the reporter's testimony to establish chain of custody. But more than that, he argued, the defense needed to establish whether DeRogatis tampered with or even created the evidence as part of his "extreme bias" against Kelly.

"Mr. Kelly has a constitutional right to show that this person has a bias, a bias so strong that it helped a reporter violate the law," Martin said.

"Did a reporter morph [the sex tape]?" Sun-Times lawyer Damon Dunn countered. "First you'd have to show that the tape was in fact morphed. And then you'd have to show that the technology necessary to do that was available to the reporter. And then you'd have to show that the reporter superimposed the images and got the contemporaneous soundtrack from radio broadcasts made years prior for this purpose. And then you'd have to show that this reporter distributed this videotape to other witnesses."

Regardless, Dunn added, "Whether or not DeRogatis has a bias against pedophiles is of no importance to this case," since it is not a defamation case.

Martin also claimed that in allegedly making a copy of the tape and showing it to witness Stephanie "Sparkle" Edwards in February 2002, DeRogatis committed a felony: possession of child pornography (which would seem to contradict the defense's claim that the tape does not constitute child pornography). If a crime were committed, Dunn countered, prosecution of that crime should come from the state, not the defense.

"What does this have to do with chain of custody?" Dunn asked rhetorically. "Nothing."

Whether DeRogatis possessed a copy in February 2002 or not, he could not be charged, since the statute of limitations would have passed. That also means the reporter could not rely upon Fifth Amendment protection against self-incrimination.

"The law is clear," Martin said. "The Fifth Amendment does not apply."

Gaughan said the defense could seek DeRogatis' testimony, within limits. The defense would not be permitted to ask him about how the tape was placed in his mailbox, or by whom. The defense would also have to narrow its question about whether DeRogatis possessed a copy of the tape other than the one he gave the police to just whether he had a copy, period. Any notes or memos made prior to and including February 1, 2002, would not be allowed, since that could put the source in jeopardy, but any materials relating to Sparkle would be allowed, "since she's not the source," Gaughan said.

Martin agreed that the defense would not seek DeRogatis' source, "unless of course DeRogatis took the position that he lied in his articles and lied to the police and there is a known source."

While the state and the defense were in the judge's chambers discussing a separate matter, a fan approached Kelly sitting alone at the defense table and tried to give the singer a couple of CDs. Introducing himself as "a lawyer and a musician," Mike Roman attempted to give the singer two albums for what he described as a Santana-like band. With an apologetic look on his face, Kelly refused to accept the CDs, telling Roman that there was a court decorum order and he wasn't even allowed to talk to him. Bailiffs escorted Roman out of the courthouse when they realized he was talking to the defendant.

Find a review of the major players in the R. Kelly trial here. For full coverage of the R. Kelly case, see the R. Kelly Reports and check out this complete timeline of the events leading up to the trial.

yah bizarre

Regardless, Dunn added, "Whether or not DeRogatis has a bias against pedophiles is of no importance to this case," since it is not a defamation case.

THIS ^^^^^

*insert fat joke*

*insert rapist joke*

*don't forget the "kenan is a pedo" joke*

http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=254389793362&ref=mf

Ick.

Jim DeRogatis has a problem with new media:

http://bit.ly/d6li28

I don't really need to read another article about DeRo, so that link probably explains this, but isn't "new media" how he makes most of his money these days?

Sounds like he's just mad at Whiney and wants some of that action.

A punk rocker to the core, DeRogatis strongly encourages a little heckling during the lecture.

thanks!

Will he get made if you hock a loogie on him?

yes, if you spit on him he goes gangsta

A punk rocker to the core, DeRogatis strongly encourages Third Eye Blind lead singer Stephen Jenkins to kiss him wetly behind the ear