Kanye West - Dark Twisted Fantasy

well, kanye's done 3 mil per album in the US, with not much more around the world - up until 808s, which only did 2 mil US. not saying he's not a big deal, but he's not up there among the very biggest sellers of his era. otoh, he's running very close behind. again, this isn't to suggest that he isn't a star, isn't deserving, but rather that the supposed inevitability of MBDTF's ecstatic reception is a little strange.

Hmm...certainly by the end of 2009 and start of 2009 the Fearless singles guaranteed someone somewhere had heard something by Swift. I was one of them; I'd barely heard "Tim McGraw" in 2006 or 2007.

of course, Kanye's solo career peaked later than Em or 50, a little after album sales started to slide, but even on something like the Billboard decade-end charts, where chart placement matters and changes in overall sales don't really effect things, Kanye's highest up album is only #42 on the hip hop/R&B list:

http://www.billboard.com/charts-decade-end#/charts-decade-end/r-b-hip-hop-albums?year=2009&begin=1&order=position

well, kanye's done 3 mil per album in the US, with not much more around the world - up until 808s, which only did 2 mil US. not saying he's not a big deal, but he's not up there among the very biggest sellers of his era. otoh, he's running very close behind.

Also: his production credits.

but rather that the supposed inevitability of MBDTF's ecstatic reception is a little strange

that inevitability isn't purely sales-based though, it's that spot in the venn diagram where a certain amount of critical cred intersects with high sales

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kanye_West_production_discography

is it maybe apples/oranges to compare the record sales of swift and west? like she may sell TONS of records, but its mostly to pop country consumers, who evidently buy records en masse that literally never make it to the ears of many radio listeners. whereas: someone who's a pop star and is played on several different stations in a major market will at least be ~known~

that is, if i go tuning through the radio and stop at stations i deem tolerable, there's a good chance i'll hear/get familiar with kanye's latest. i never EVER listen to country radio so the chances of hearing swift (or any other mega country star) is basically nil. and i don't think i'm alone here.

also wow, i didn't realise this but "power" and "runaway" both flopped hard in the UK - peaks of no 36 and no 56 respectively, then they disappeared. cf 808s - two top 10 hits, both of which hung around for ages.

is it maybe apples/oranges to compare the record sales of swift and west? like she may sell TONS of records, but its mostly to pop country consumers, who evidently buy records en masse that literally never make it to the ears of many radio listeners

on my local Clear Channel station, Taylor Swift got massive airplay in 2009 -- as much as Rihanna, Eminem, Soulja Boy, etc

i.e. she hasn't been a pop country rep since 2007.

i mean if you just ask someone on the street "does the name kanye west mean anything to you, and what is his occupation?" more ppl would be able to answer the question correctly before they'd get "taylor swift" right

(NB - pre-VMAs. now everyone knows who she is)

xp nevermind!

if you would really like to see a reason for destroying America, look at how many albums Carrie Underwood has sold

i do find it somewhat hard to believe that Kanye isn't going to sell considerably more than Nicki

― some dude, Tuesday, November 23, 2010 4:19 PM (14 minutes ago) Bookmark

me too, but hits daily double is usually pretty accurate

yeah taylor is on pop radio plenty -- i mean, "you belong with me" alone

Carrie Underwood has sold

who

man i guess i am just waaaay more disconnected from pop culture than i thought.

as usual I think we (I include myself) are basing our assertions on our own radio experiences. In South Florida, Swift was inescapable before the VMA's.

who

Season 4 American Idol winner, aka "country artist who cannot fucking sing a single note yet is still multiplatinum because people are fucking idiots"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WaSy8yy-mr8

this is the most bearable song she's done and it's still horrible

hmmmm. doubt she was getting much airplay on the MN pop stations for the VMAs, but i have no basis for that assertion, other than that there are well-established country stations that probably played her plenty. basically i know nothing

xp

how far we've come: just blaze vs. kanye west

eh -- I don't mind Underwood. Much more nefarious forces at work on the charts.

This is a generalization, but if you listened to pop radio in 2009 you heard Taylor Swift.

I guess it doesn't add up to the discussion since we're speaking American sales but in Mexico and Spain noone I've talked to knows who Taylor Swift is or recognize any of her most popular songs (none of her songs got any radio airplay on the pop radio stations over here as far as Im concerned) whereas Kanye West is pretty wide known by people in my age rank (20-30).

basically as far as I'm concerned the only good thing Carrie Underwood did was save America from BO BICE

otherwise she can go straight into the riverbound rock-filled sack with Owl City

i look at the interior of my sack and feel sad

when is that happening, btw, if they're going into the straight river i wanna score tickets, owatonna's only an hour away

xp

i mean, kanye the performer doesn't even place among the 20 top selling artists/albums of the decade in terms of US sales, according to what i've been able to dig up. that's unfairly skewed by the late-decade "death of the music industry," of course, but nor is he single-handedly dominating the singles charts.

also, the idea that kanye is better known than swift in general may be due more to the bubble effect of our limited personal experience than any external reality. gbx says: "like she may sell TONS of records, but its mostly to pop country consumers, who evidently buy records en masse that literally never make it to the ears of many radio listeners. whereas: someone who's a pop star and is played on several different stations in a major market will at least be ~known~."

known to who? i suspect that many of the markets in which taylor swift is all over the radio actually are major markets and that many people know kanye west primarily as "that asshole who was rude to taylor" (and/or george bush). we all get myopic about the universality of our own private realities from time to time.

we all get myopic about the universality of our own private realities from time to time.

basically full-time over here

so should I bother dling this

hell yeah

i mean, kanye the performer doesn't even place among the 20 top selling artists/albums of the decade in terms of US sales, according to what i've been able to dig up. that's unfairly skewed by the late-decade "death of the music industry," of course, but nor is he single-handedly dominating the singles charts.

on the Billboard decade-end charts I referred to earlier, which are not skewed by lower sales in the 2nd half of the decade, he's #45, just ahead of Rod Stewart, Ja Rule and (drumroll) Taylor Swift:

http://www.billboard.com/charts-decade-end#/charts-decade-end/billboard-200-artists?year=2009

the only good thing Carrie Underwood did was save America from BO BICE

how can this be a real person? sounds like a baby trying to say obie trice

Record sales data trainspotting is like the duddest thing ever.

sorry dude, i know chart nerd shit is of limited interest even here

Eh I'm mostly just being a dick, but it all just seems irrelevant and meaningless.

i mean u can boggle at the idea that ppl think hes a great artist but yr not just talking about ryan dombal & pfork editors, yr talking about lots & lots of music listeners

rememberin the good old days when deej was busting this line out on the garth brooks thread

on ilx baseless assumptions will always trump hard data

eh, sure chart & sales states are boring, but i wanted some perspective on the "kanye quaffs beverage, chokes woman, celebrates mastery of western civilization" storyline

loooool

This thread doesn't inspire confidence in the album, does it.

I'm still deciding whether to pick this one up. I dunno about as rap albums but as albums I enjoyed his last two more than the first two, & loved 808s a lot. Still, time's always short & this sounds like a hassle from what's said here.

hey speaking of that storyline has anyone written a good piece on this record working in axl rose and eminem (maybe john lennon and kurt cobain too) yet. have avoided reading any reviews (EVEN NABISCO'S), though that 10.0 did prompt a dl. i've barely listened to it but from what i've heard i think my take is gonna be like hansel re: sting.

im glad i heard this & greatly enjoy parts of it & think its an interesting phenomenon, from a distance
dont think his actual celeb personality is an interesting phenomenon (a somewhat defensible position for loving this album is if u DO) and i definitely dont think the album is as artistically significant as he thinks it is in the way he thinks it is (an almost indefensible position -- like hearing Drake ruminate on the lyrical brilliance of his hashtag raps, or minaj talking about chilling with kanye in hawaii & dreaming up ways to come up with better raps, or jay-z's "off that") YET. it retains some interest to me simply by being such a spectacle. Also I sorta go for the baroque-ness of it in parts, if only to listen to once or twice, like a movie, then rarely ever play again

also 'monster' is still a banger imo

okay guys, can we really not figure out that the "choking" mention in "Blame Game" is a reference to deep throating

i'm pretty sure he means having rough sex

Been a long time since I spoke to you
in a bathroom gripping you up and choking you

i think "gripping" pretty much indicates that he's choking her w/ his hand

good morning

okay guys, can we really not figure out that the "choking" mention in "Blame Game" is a reference to deep throating

if yr deep throater chokes he/she is doin it wrong

^^^ I don't know anything about it this is just a rhyme from one of my unreleased raps

are we going to debate the meaning of the "I bruised her esophagus" line now to