TS: Mo Tucker vs. Ringo Starr

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Ellis comparison makes no sense at all - it's backwards. And very few lyricists are interested in, or capable of, creating narrators radically different from themselves.

Irt main argument, I think there's a middleground between not giving a shit and throwing your CDs in the skip in outrage - degrees of discomfort and disappointment, varying according to your preconceptions about the artist. Just because it doesn't affect my love of VU doesn't mean I can't be a little bit pissed off. The problem with the piece is it starts with a personal POV - she doesn't give a shit, that's fine - and magnifies it into a general point about art, which doesn't really stand up.

The baby boomers have defined everything once and for all (Dorianlynskey), Wednesday, 6 October 2010 13:17 (3 years ago) Permalink

don't think mo has played on a record i've listened to since 1970

bit like [extended analogy involving brigitte bardot]

rmde @ the romo dumplings (history mayne), Wednesday, 6 October 2010 13:19 (3 years ago) Permalink

OK, I have met Mo. She seemed really nice.

I don't have any great impetus to throw all my MoSolo albums away, much less the VU stuff. She used to work at Walmart and got 'exploited' as cheap labour, so it would make sense to assume she'd be in favour of something that would redress the balance, but maybe she's not in that situation anymore....

It all looks like she's way misguided about what it all means. But I have not studied the US political situation, so I can't say otherwise anyway.

Mark G, Wednesday, 6 October 2010 13:29 (3 years ago) Permalink

wait are ppl giving a shit about this beyond o_O-ing at it? that would be weird. i thought everyone had quit being all up in arms over cred politics or whatever, but otoh i guess i've been retreating more and more into my own private vaccuum over the years, so idk!

arby's, Wednesday, 6 October 2010 22:32 (3 years ago) Permalink

And very few lyricists are interested in, or capable of, creating narrators radically different from themselves.

O RLY

this is a weird thing to say. I mean how do you even judge what the lyricist is REALLY LIKE, in comparison to the narrators they create?

crude interloper of a once august profession (Shakey Mo Collier), Wednesday, 6 October 2010 22:40 (3 years ago) Permalink

maybe a separate thread topic (if there isn't one already)

crude interloper of a once august profession (Shakey Mo Collier), Wednesday, 6 October 2010 22:41 (3 years ago) Permalink

I meant in the context of this argument that you can't just put a songwriter's politics in a box and pretend they don't filter into the songs because the songs are in "character". I don't see what's weird about saying that very few songwriters consistently create narrators that they have nothing at all in common with (and sometimes when they do, eg Holiday in Cambodia, it's abundantly clear that they hate the narrator). This isn't really relevant to Moe because she's a drummer, not a lyricist, but it is relevant to the NME article's example of Micah P Hinson.

The baby boomers have defined everything once and for all (Dorianlynskey), Thursday, 7 October 2010 10:05 (3 years ago) Permalink

narrators that they have nothing at all in common with (and sometimes when they do, eg Holiday in Cambodia, it's abundantly clear that they hate the narrator).

um, wha?

Mark G, Thursday, 7 October 2010 10:07 (3 years ago) Permalink

See, I always read "HolinCam" as a more aggressive version of "Streets of London"...

Mark G, Thursday, 7 October 2010 10:09 (3 years ago) Permalink

Sorry, distracted when I typed that. Obv not Holiday in Cambodia but Jello character songs like California Uber Alles, Kill the Poor, etc.

The baby boomers have defined everything once and for all (Dorianlynskey), Thursday, 7 October 2010 10:19 (3 years ago) Permalink

Ah, right. Thought I'd missed something.

Mark G, Thursday, 7 October 2010 10:21 (3 years ago) Permalink

Moe Tucker IS a songwriter; I Spent A Week There The Other Night is one of the best solo Velvets albums.

raging hetero lifechill (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Thursday, 7 October 2010 12:14 (3 years ago) Permalink

Oops again. I've been giving up smoking and withdrawal seems to have made part of my brain fall out. I hereby resign from this thread.

The baby boomers have defined everything once and for all (Dorianlynskey), Thursday, 7 October 2010 12:49 (3 years ago) Permalink

If Bret Easton Ellis were a teabagger, yes we would be talking about it.

Maxwell von Bismarck, Thursday, 7 October 2010 13:24 (3 years ago) Permalink

peace and love, peace and love

flockapella (crüt), Tuesday, 12 October 2010 10:05 (3 years ago) Permalink

http://blogs.riverfronttimes.com/atoz/2010/10/moe_tucker_interview_2010_politics_tea_party_velvet_underground_video.php

What are your feelings about the online reactions? Many people seem upset or outraged.

I'm stunned that so many people who call themselves liberal yet are completely intolerant. I thought liberals loved everyone: the poor, the immigrant, the gays, the handicapped, the minorities, dogs, cats, all eye colors, all hair colors! Peace, love, bull! Curious they have no tolerance whatsoever for anyone who doesn't think exactly as they do. You disagree and you're immediately called a fool, a Nazi, a racist. That's pretty f'd up!! I would never judge someone based on their political views. Their honesty, integrity, kindness to others, generosity? Yes. Politics? No!

Johnny Fever, Tuesday, 19 October 2010 15:45 (3 years ago) Permalink

Well, she's just doing it wrong then.

Unfrozen Caveman Board-Lawyer (WmC), Tuesday, 19 October 2010 15:48 (3 years ago) Permalink

Wait till her friends find out about the fag with the whip who danced in front of her in '67.

raging hetero lifechill (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Tuesday, 19 October 2010 15:50 (3 years ago) Permalink

Peace, love, bull!

She knows about this thread, doesn't she?

http://tinyurl.com/whitepony (Pleasant Plains), Tuesday, 19 October 2010 15:56 (3 years ago) Permalink

Interesting interview though.

Mark G, Tuesday, 19 October 2010 16:00 (3 years ago) Permalink

heh while i obv disagree with the thrust of her diatribe, that's actually one of the more cogent, thoughtful tea party memos i've read/ heard (i would like to see some of the specifics wrt 1" fish, turtle tunnels, etc). maybe mo should run for office.

the devil is in the dinosaur bones (will), Tuesday, 19 October 2010 16:09 (3 years ago) Permalink

:-/

the devil is in the dinosaur bones (will), Tuesday, 19 October 2010 16:09 (3 years ago) Permalink

I'm not quite sure that you have to agree with a musician's politics in order to enjoy that musician's music. Is it really that big a deal that she holds political views different than yours? Does anybody posting hear know what Ringo Starr's political affiliation is?

dressed up better than anyone within a mile (Bill Magill), Tuesday, 19 October 2010 16:12 (3 years ago) Permalink

peace and love, peace and love

da croupier, Tuesday, 19 October 2010 16:12 (3 years ago) Permalink

It's a small step through a turtle tunnel to an octopus' garden.

Mark G, Tuesday, 19 October 2010 16:13 (3 years ago) Permalink

Morbz Tucker

Ned Raggett, Tuesday, 19 October 2010 16:20 (3 years ago) Permalink

Ah, now that's low.

I mean, he might be 66-years-old, but he's not a tea partier.

http://tinyurl.com/whitepony (Pleasant Plains), Tuesday, 19 October 2010 16:31 (3 years ago) Permalink

I'm not quite sure that you have to agree with a musician's politics in order to enjoy that musician's music

Is anyone saying you have to? One thing that has annoyed me about some responses to this story is the idea that either you're some weird hardliner who throws away your VU records because you don't like the drummer's politics or you shouldn't care at all. Surely there's a huge middleground of disappointment/discomfort that is interesting to explore.

The baby boomers have defined everything once and for all (Dorianlynskey), Tuesday, 19 October 2010 16:35 (3 years ago) Permalink

xpost -- Haha I meant more like "Disappointment with the Obama administration, now who does that remind me of..."

Ned Raggett, Tuesday, 19 October 2010 16:53 (3 years ago) Permalink

I'm stunned that so many people who call themselves liberal yet are completely intolerant.

ALSO THEY ARE THE REAL RACISTS AMIRITE?

Tub Girl Time Machine (Phil D.), Tuesday, 19 October 2010 17:00 (3 years ago) Permalink

oops that's page 2

tylerw, Tuesday, 19 October 2010 19:25 (3 years ago) Permalink

she's right, bugs are to be feared

buzza, Tuesday, 19 October 2010 19:39 (3 years ago) Permalink

Are you still involved in Tea Party activities?

___________________________________

I do my own protesting via email and postcards

she should take her protests where they'll have a real impact: on message boards.

"DEAR INTERNET:"

Daniel, Esq., Tuesday, 19 October 2010 22:22 (3 years ago) Permalink

Mo would bring some pizazz to the US politics thread, & it would be tough to sb her.

Euler, Tuesday, 19 October 2010 22:27 (3 years ago) Permalink

that's actually one of the more cogent, thoughtful tea party memos i've read

except for it being incorrect in all points of fact, of course.

ledge, Tuesday, 19 October 2010 22:30 (3 years ago) Permalink

i wonder if she stands up when she posts on the internet

browns zero loss (brownie), Tuesday, 19 October 2010 22:32 (3 years ago) Permalink

except for it being incorrect in all points of fact, of course.

yeah, I can't speak to any of the claims she makes (salamanders, donkey museums, etc) but the rest of it is just a matter of rhetoric and degrees i suppose. (e.g. the govt "taking over" the auto industry etc.)

the devil is in the dinosaur bones (will), Tuesday, 19 October 2010 23:08 (3 years ago) Permalink

my biggest issue is this: "I started listening to what Obama was promising"

ok really? what did Obama say during the election that made you think he wasn't actually going to push for all the super magical things he's attempted (health care, financial reform, school loans, etc)? if anything he's been forced or spooked into scaling back. now to be fair, maybe Moe wasn't too thrilled from the moment an Obama admin became a viable prospect. but it's just something i've heard a lot of from people (moderates) who voted for him. which prob doesn;t include Ms. Tucker so i shut up now.

the devil is in the dinosaur bones (will), Tuesday, 19 October 2010 23:09 (3 years ago) Permalink

Her list is kind of astonishing as a compendium of talking points and canards she heard on Fox News - there's no distinction between justifiable concerns, petty complaints and bizarre phobias. As an insight into the garbled thinking of a Tea Partier it's fascinating.

The baby boomers have defined everything once and for all (Dorianlynskey), Wednesday, 20 October 2010 08:40 (3 years ago) Permalink

Can't believe a drummer out of a band wd have different political opinions to me tbh

Uncharted: Nick Drake's Fortune (Noodle Vague), Wednesday, 20 October 2010 09:30 (3 years ago) Permalink

Is anyone saying that at this point in the thread? I don't think so.

The baby boomers have defined everything once and for all (Dorianlynskey), Wednesday, 20 October 2010 10:39 (3 years ago) Permalink

Pretty sure that's all the recent portion of this and the other Mo T threads say but hey ho

Uncharted: Nick Drake's Fortune (Noodle Vague), Wednesday, 20 October 2010 10:40 (3 years ago) Permalink

Dorianlynsky's favorite response on this thread is to simply say "Is anybody saying that on this thread". A phenomenal debate technique.

dressed up better than anyone within a mile (Bill Magill), Wednesday, 20 October 2010 13:34 (3 years ago) Permalink

Her list is kind of astonishing as a compendium of talking points and canards she heard on Fox News - there's no distinction between justifiable concerns, petty complaints and bizarre phobias. As an insight into the garbled thinking of a Tea Partier it's fascinating.

― The baby boomers have defined everything once and for all (Dorianlynskey), Wednesday, October 20, 2010 4:40 AM (4 hours ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

Is anybody saying that on this thread?

dressed up better than anyone within a mile (Bill Magill), Wednesday, 20 October 2010 13:34 (3 years ago) Permalink

Is anybody saying that on this thread?

ledge, Wednesday, 20 October 2010 13:57 (3 years ago) Permalink

...maybe?

scaruffi kaleidoscope (Drugs A. Money), Wednesday, 20 October 2010 13:59 (3 years ago) Permalink

Ha, OK, obviously I haven't managed to make the distinction I was trying to make. To try again: I think you can discuss this, and be interested in what Moe's words reveal about how someone can end up aligning themselves with the Tea Party without perceiving themselves as right-wing, without it having anything to do with your enjoyment of that person's music - the VU didn't even cross my mind while I was reading this latest interview. I'm interested in this as a case study in Tea Party thinking so I find her language revealing. That's all. But I'll leave this thread to Bill Magill and his phenomenal "being a prick" debating technique.

The baby boomers have defined everything once and for all (Dorianlynskey), Wednesday, 20 October 2010 15:44 (3 years ago) Permalink

The working at Wal-Mart definitely influenced her anti-union stances. As a Wal-Mart employee, you're practically expected to NAME NAMES anytime the dreaded u-word comes up.

Telephoneface (Adam Bruneau), Wednesday, 20 October 2010 16:21 (3 years ago) Permalink


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