2008 Primaries Thread

Anti-intellectualism in those campaigns doesn't preclude the possibility of misogyny in this one

i don't think kerry and gore were being 'intellectuals'. the fact that hillary is a woman doesn't preclude the possibility that she possesses character traits that people find unattractive in more than one gender.

srsly, i think if you think this is about her being a woman, you are fatally not getting it

the people for whom gender matters that much vote for the other side no matter what

theres def a ton of dudes madd cuz shes got tits but that doesnt mean disliking any woman ever is sexist, and accusing liberal obama supporters of this is veering towards GOP 'dems hate condi cuz shes a strong black woman!!' bullshit

BTW, on the GOP side, what happened to immigration, the new ''third rail of politics''? I mean, soft-on-immigration John McCain won going away.

ugh look at these senators giving poor alberto gonzales such a hard time... why do they hate mexicans??

http://i9.tinypic.com/71fgyvc.jpg

flattery will get you nowhere, CNN

I would instantly gain so much respect for HRC if she'd tell Bill to stay home and dump all her old '90s-minded staff. THAT'S the thing I hate about her.

people in new hampshire don't have to worry much about learning spanish, daniel

Of course it's not only about gender. Obama is a great communicator and Hillary is mediocre at it, no doubt. But that doesn't explain the hatred.

http://i9.tinypic.com/71fgyvc.jpg

^^ so gonna happen

Fair enough. It's hard for me to evaluate, having recently moved to Earth.

(xp)

holy shit daniel w/ a zing

in a few cases it's because he didn't ever support the war and she keeps voting yay on cheneystyle fearmonger bullshit

but it's hard to shake the feeling that people really have a lot less patience for the lady-wonk than they do for the masculine version of same

zing sustained

majority of hillary haters i know are broads tho... dudes respect her professionalism & hard-ass stance

esp. non-dems

majority of hillary haters i know are broads tho.

^^same

Dear msnbc: Please give Rachel Maddow her own show. I don't have time to listen to the radio.

broads be catty

hurting, i'm not a hillary hater as far as policy goes, but her campaign has been slimier than obama's in my mind, and i think that might piss people off

too moist

i've got to go.

haha my fiancee hates hrc, tho, adding on to the ladies hate cool h train

1 week til Nevada debate. Obama will be getting schooled, methinks.

loool @ ron paul's gender gap (11% male, 4% female)

98% racists

100% Sean Hannity haterz

yo bumrush the colmes

At least this will save us from all the Obama-is-the-12th-Imam slough. But a fine montage it is ...

http://home.att.net/~phildragoo/wsb/media/240742/site1119.JPG

wtf/lol @ 'NO ONE HAS REAL REASONS TO HATE HILLARY' try her war vote (still a big deal to me, fuck u dudes) and TRIANGULATING on EVERYTHING

My wife backs Hillary. I'm for Obama mainly because of the Iraq/Iran votes and a moment that turned me off in which Hillary made a really insensitive-sounding defense of the payroll tax cap.

I'm willing to take a gamble on the fact that an Obama presidency, would, in fact, be better than a Hillary presidency, but I'm skeptical. I'm not convinced Obama won't or hasn't made the same devil's bargains with corporate interests Hillary has. He's a better, more energetic speaker, and he talks a lot about hope and change, and he rattles off the same laundry list of problems any dem. candidate would and makes unrealistic claims that he's going to solve them. Which I forgive, to a extent, because he is campaigning.

Triangulating? Isn't Obama's whole "unity" and "non-partisan" schtick a re-branding of triangulation?

Triangulating? Isn't Obama's whole "unity" and "non-partisan" schtick a re-branding of triangulation?

-- Hurting 2, Tuesday, January 8, 2008 11:46 PM (19 seconds ago) Bookmark Link

no, not at all

deciding you're randomly against flag burning = triangulating
convincing republican lawmakers to go along with videotaping police interrogations = unity and nonpartisan 'schtick'

i don't see obama making the kind of moves that hillary has in the past that suggest she is much more prone to making decisions based on short-term political expediency.

so what's the tough talk on Pakistan if not triangulation?

convincing republican lawmakers to go along with videotaping police interrogations = unity and nonpartisan 'schtick'

-- deej, Tuesday, January 8, 2008 11:47 PM (2 minutes ago) Bookmark Link

in CHICAGO nonetheless, the city known for torturing black suspects up into the mid-1980s

so what's the tough talk on Pakistan if not triangulation?

-- Hurting 2, Tuesday, January 8, 2008 11:50 PM (20 seconds ago) Bookmark Link

real talk?
im going to reiterate it totally makes sense that, should pakistan be unable to squash independent groups that are threatening the u.s. and we have ACTIONABLE intelligence to that effect, we should take action.

and no this is nothing like bush's iraq war strategy

I've been wondering about that, Deej. Say it wasn't Pakistan. Say it was England. Would you feel the same way?

The number of aggro white dudes who still hate Hillary with a seething passion is kind of amazing.

ILX to ILX!! WTF

daria how would you feel if someone claimed the hillary campaign's near constant attacks on obama were because of her racism?

Nobody is claiming Obama's campaign going after Hillary is anything other than politics. It was just that Obama's cutting little remark had a moment of training all the massive anger I've had over the coverage of this race onto him, which isn't fair to him, but sometimes it's just visceral. The media's fucking sexist, though. She's shrill. She cackles. She's cold and calculating. Oh, wait, now she's playing the victim and saying waaah, poor me. She can't win. Fuck 'em.

Hey, I'm not saying women don't do it too. A (female) colleague of mine was just saying today, oh, I heard her at the debate and she was so shrill, and then my boss was like, oh, and then she was crying, I can't believe it, and I said well, too bad I'm still voting for her.

????
if the IRA was threatening to nuke the u.s. and the uk couldn't stop the ira, yes

xp

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/graphics/2007/12/14/wuspols114.jpg

wtf/lol @ 'NO ONE HAS REAL REASONS TO HATE HILLARY' try her war vote (still a big deal to me, fuck u dudes)

^^^

I got so caught up in defending my non-sexist position that I'd momentarily forgotten THIS. Her Clintonian campaign style is a distant second.

WAHT?!?!? xp

I also don't think Hillary would start a war like Iraq, even though she voted for it. Which, admittedly, reflects badly on her decision to vote for it.

maybe i'm assuming 'actionable intelligence' means something diff than u dudes do

"Actionable intelligence" = quick and precise strike, amirite?

hey daria, i can see why you'd want to take a break from ilx, but fwiw your posts on this thread are one of the only reasons i read it. and agreed on media coverage of clinton; sometimes i think i must be making it up.

????
if the IRA was threatening to nuke the u.s. and the uk couldn't stop the ira, yes

xp

-- deej, Wednesday, January 9, 2008 12:54 AM (3 minutes ago)

I think Daniel was probably more likely talking about the Islamic extremist groups that actually might conceivably threaten the U.S. from England. Like if the English P.M. claimed he was doing as much as we could and we said "that's not good enough" and sent in the bombers.

Of course we wouldn't do that because we couldn't and we might bomb Waziristan because we can.

PS, guys, the rabid Hillary hate started at least as far back as 1992. What pisses me off is seeing the so-called "liberal" bloggers picking it right back up because she might win an election.

Sorry I'm just not getting it, though. How would I know. There's always some reason to hate her, and it's never exactly sexism, but it's a funny thing how so many people at once find different reasons not just to not support, but to either hate, or just do the "lol this, lol that, hilarious" backhanded sarcastic shit, which is possibly more annoying.