rolling "Is This Racist?" thread

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Yeah, I guess exploitative and colonialist (is that the right word?) more than captial-R RACIST, but still like; who does a video treatment that;'s like "OK, you're hugging black kids for four minutes"

obv the answer is "the dude who directed the new Kings of Leon video, whose name somehow has not yet made it to the bits of the Internet you can hit within 5 minutes of using Google"

(that more than anything else is making me lol, like whoever this was basically went "I'll do this for you and it will be awesome! I don't want any credit tho" *waits for shitstorm*)

juggalo iglesias (HI DERE), Monday, 20 September 2010 19:27 (3 years ago) Permalink

carles is slippin -- passion pit already did the "hire a choir of underprivileged minority youths" thing

J0rdan S., Monday, 20 September 2010 19:28 (3 years ago) Permalink

he's not even listed on the mtv site, which is usually v good about putting directors up in there

Whiney G. Weingarten, Monday, 20 September 2010 19:33 (3 years ago) Permalink

gonna lol if it was Hype Williams

juggalo iglesias (HI DERE), Monday, 20 September 2010 19:41 (3 years ago) Permalink

the video and song are both unmentionably terrible w/ stupid and retrograde notions about race but i don't think they are simply ~racist~

Chinedu "Edu" Obasi Ogbuke (nakhchivan), Monday, 20 September 2010 19:46 (3 years ago) Permalink

Sophie Muller directed it.

Kerm, Monday, 20 September 2010 19:56 (3 years ago) Permalink

more offensive for not being funny

bnw, Tuesday, 21 September 2010 01:54 (3 years ago) Permalink

http://tinyurl.com/vrrr0000m (Pleasant Plains), Tuesday, 21 September 2010 03:49 (3 years ago) Permalink

that was a fake

J0rdan S., Tuesday, 21 September 2010 03:51 (3 years ago) Permalink

but it was racist because someone realized that they could spell "nigger" by a video game and they set up a soccer video game and took a photo of it and sent it all over the internet

so yes, racist

J0rdan S., Tuesday, 21 September 2010 03:52 (3 years ago) Permalink

this isn't a thread for lol racism, fyi. keep that shit to "encyclopedia of racist products" or, like, 4chan

my friend flocka (Whiney G. Weingarten), Tuesday, 21 September 2010 03:55 (3 years ago) Permalink

strictly concern trolling in here.

Kerm, Tuesday, 21 September 2010 03:57 (3 years ago) Permalink

I figured it was some soccer thing. Wouldn't have been surprised if it had been real.

http://tinyurl.com/vrrr0000m (Pleasant Plains), Tuesday, 21 September 2010 03:58 (3 years ago) Permalink

take it to i love footy

p.m.s.b. (pre-mall smoke bomb) (zorn_bond.mp3), Tuesday, 21 September 2010 04:50 (3 years ago) Permalink

love the gawker update where they act like they understood the joke from the beginning

jeff, Tuesday, 21 September 2010 05:30 (3 years ago) Permalink

barf

maybe LJ is right about ilx being the smartest message board

my friend flocka (Whiney G. Weingarten), Tuesday, 21 September 2010 05:35 (3 years ago) Permalink

http://hipsterhitler.com/

p.m.s.b. (pre-mall smoke bomb) (zorn_bond.mp3), Tuesday, 21 September 2010 05:40 (3 years ago) Permalink

gawker isnt a message board

J0rdan S., Tuesday, 21 September 2010 05:42 (3 years ago) Permalink

ilx is my favorite blog

markers, Tuesday, 21 September 2010 05:44 (3 years ago) Permalink

MIXMASTER
RACE

EASTSIDE
WESTSIDE
GENOCIDE

p.m.s.b. (pre-mall smoke bomb) (zorn_bond.mp3), Tuesday, 21 September 2010 05:45 (3 years ago) Permalink

is anti-semitism racist or not, because this guy at the bar I frequent is convinced that Birth Of A Nation was produced by Jews & that the Jews control the media etc etc

I know it sucks either way just wanted 2 know ur opinions

4 my muthafuckin mods (crüt), Tuesday, 21 September 2010 06:02 (3 years ago) Permalink

Of course anti-semitism is racism. It's just that racism against Jews has acquired a term of its own, probably because discriminating them has been so prominent historically.

Where it gets tricky is when anti-Israel or anti-Zionist statements are equated with anti-semitism; of course some anti-Israel/anti-Zionist people are also anti-semitists/racists, but many of them aren't. But your case is pretty obviously racist because the target is Jews as a whole, not Israeli politics or anything.

Tuomas, Tuesday, 21 September 2010 06:56 (3 years ago) Permalink

are the finns a race?

mookieproof, Tuesday, 21 September 2010 06:59 (3 years ago) Permalink

Ca. 300 Finnish Jews fought in the War alongside the German Army[3][4]. The field synagogue operated by the Finnish army was probably a unique phenomenon in Europe.

Guess they didn't have Google then either.

http://tinyurl.com/vrrr0000m (Pleasant Plains), Tuesday, 21 September 2010 14:00 (3 years ago) Permalink

take it to i love footy

― p.m.s.b. (pre-mall smoke bomb) (zorn_bond.mp3),

jesus way to zing an entire bord of innocents wtf

i dont love everything, i love football (darraghmac), Tuesday, 21 September 2010 14:02 (3 years ago) Permalink

Subtle "Americans don't like soocer and aren't racist" undertones there

Tom A. (Tom B.) (Tom C.) (Tom D.), Tuesday, 21 September 2010 14:04 (3 years ago) Permalink

yeah really i'm getting some prety bad vibes offa this zorn character. bet he's norwegian/icelandic thor worshipper

i dont love everything, i love football (darraghmac), Tuesday, 21 September 2010 14:05 (3 years ago) Permalink

zorn smash

p.m.s.b. (pre-mall smoke bomb) (zorn_bond.mp3), Tuesday, 21 September 2010 15:55 (3 years ago) Permalink

is this chorus racist?

J0rdan S., Tuesday, 21 September 2010 18:57 (3 years ago) Permalink

?

my friend flocka (Whiney G. Weingarten), Tuesday, 21 September 2010 19:01 (3 years ago) Permalink

http://dasracist.net/

am0n, Tuesday, 21 September 2010 19:02 (3 years ago) Permalink

idk singing about sippin syrup like three 6 and getting "slizzered"

it's a bit 3oh3 minstrel

J0rdan S., Tuesday, 21 September 2010 19:02 (3 years ago) Permalink

i can def see that

my friend flocka (Whiney G. Weingarten), Tuesday, 21 September 2010 19:04 (3 years ago) Permalink

Man, if it's wrong to make fun of people who drink cough syrup to get high, I don't wanna get high.

doobieborther, Tuesday, 21 September 2010 19:07 (3 years ago) Permalink

How does all the lol ghetto retard stuff on lamebook.com fit into this thread? Not sure if I'd rather it be real or fake.

zomg_bong.mp3 (Kerm), Tuesday, 21 September 2010 19:09 (3 years ago) Permalink

i think a bunch of well-off white people looking at it on their MacBook Pros and laughing at it through a mouthful of Whole Foods salad bar is pretty racist

my friend flocka (Whiney G. Weingarten), Tuesday, 21 September 2010 19:14 (3 years ago) Permalink

glad I'm broke, on a dell, and had chili for lunch then.

zomg_bong.mp3 (Kerm), Tuesday, 21 September 2010 19:18 (3 years ago) Permalink

black people eat Whole Foods salad bar, too

sarahel, Tuesday, 21 September 2010 19:19 (3 years ago) Permalink

so like, on a pitchfork scale of 0.0 to 10.0, where 10.0 is a lynching, and 0.0 is Martin Luther King Jr. enjoying a cup of coffee while making breakfast, in his pajamas, humming a soft song to himself, where would the MacBook Pro thing fall? where does this comment fall?

I think this thread, while started with the noblest of intentions, has been a failure. And the reason I believe it has failed is that we (as a society) are so resigned to simply declaring something racist or not, as if it's binary, instead of attempting to quantify exactly how racist something really is, using numerical scales.

del griffith, Tuesday, 21 September 2010 19:23 (3 years ago) Permalink

that scene from Louie where the school bus breaks down in Harlem and he reassigns the black kids the window seats: greater than 1.2?

*folds hands, rests elbows on desk, places chin on fingertips, looks up and slightly to the left, thinks*

del griffith, Tuesday, 21 September 2010 19:27 (3 years ago) Permalink

i think you've anticipated an exciting new direction for Pitchfork Reviews Reviews

sarahel, Tuesday, 21 September 2010 19:28 (3 years ago) Permalink

God, this fucking thread. Is this racist? Is it? Well? I need something to be outraged about, fuckin' tell me!!! Ugh.

SourPatchCorpse, Tuesday, 21 September 2010 19:35 (3 years ago) Permalink

i dont think anyone is really all that outraged tbh

J0rdan S., Tuesday, 21 September 2010 19:36 (3 years ago) Permalink

Was Dr. King's morning coffee fair trade or unregulated?

http://tinyurl.com/vrrr0000m (Pleasant Plains), Tuesday, 21 September 2010 19:38 (3 years ago) Permalink

Exactly, this thread isn't about being outraged at these things, it's about discussing them, and learning from them, and analyzing peoples motivations, gaining valuable insight into contemporary race relations, and proposing solutions for a more equitable society. Which is why it is essentially ineffectual, and why we should focus on merely assigning submitted material a score.

del griffith, Tuesday, 21 September 2010 19:40 (3 years ago) Permalink

we can't be sure, can we, so let's kick it up to 0.8

('_') (omar little), Tuesday, 21 September 2010 19:40 (3 years ago) Permalink

xp that is not for me, as a MacBook Pro owner, to say

del griffith, Tuesday, 21 September 2010 19:40 (3 years ago) Permalink

jk i don't really own one of those racist fuckin computers ;p

del griffith, Tuesday, 21 September 2010 19:42 (3 years ago) Permalink

venti frap all over the keyboard

jeff, Tuesday, 21 September 2010 20:24 (3 years ago) Permalink

- "So great to be here in Nigeria. Just look at all these people of color."

- "You know, we just call ourselves 'people' here. Perhaps it is you with the peachy pink hues that's so colorful."

- "Yes. Together we make quite the rainbow."

- "Rainbow? If you ever see a pink and brown rainbow in the sky, you'd better get a gas mask."

pplains, Thursday, 10 July 2014 14:36 (2 weeks ago) Permalink

google results for "BME people" are all for biomedical engineering depts.

Orson Wellies (in orbit), Thursday, 10 July 2014 14:37 (2 weeks ago) Permalink

I have no idea what BME stands for <------ so says an actual British person

Tommy McTommy (Tom D.), Thursday, 10 July 2014 14:39 (2 weeks ago) Permalink

I gotta BME

Look at this joke I've recognised, do you recognise it as well? (forksclovetofu), Thursday, 10 July 2014 14:44 (2 weeks ago) Permalink

Black / Minority Ethnic.

Wristy Hurlington (ShariVari), Thursday, 10 July 2014 14:45 (2 weeks ago) Permalink

all these terms are primarily useful in societies/institutions/environments that are dominated by white ppl, it's never going to be a general term bc most of the world has little use for a concept of 'non-white ppl in general' however its phrased

ogmor, Thursday, 10 July 2014 14:46 (2 weeks ago) Permalink

google results for "BME people" are all for biomedical engineering depts.

ah yeah, we'd probably use it more in phrases like "BME families", "BME communities" etc.

Eyeball Kicks, Thursday, 10 July 2014 14:46 (2 weeks ago) Permalink

Does BME include Irish?

Tommy McTommy (Tom D.), Thursday, 10 July 2014 14:48 (2 weeks ago) Permalink

Not usually.

Eyeball Kicks, Thursday, 10 July 2014 14:50 (2 weeks ago) Permalink

Well I was joking but being Irish is usually a category on its own when filling out Equal Opportunity forms.

Tommy McTommy (Tom D.), Thursday, 10 July 2014 14:53 (2 weeks ago) Permalink

LOL UK amirite?

Tommy McTommy (Tom D.), Thursday, 10 July 2014 14:54 (2 weeks ago) Permalink

xpost dunno but it did sign Chyna Whyte

relentlessly pecking at peace (President Keyes), Thursday, 10 July 2014 14:54 (2 weeks ago) Permalink

Sometimes Irish are listed as BME. Depends on circumstances.

Wristy Hurlington (ShariVari), Thursday, 10 July 2014 14:55 (2 weeks ago) Permalink

Think there's probably residual admiration for Germany too pouring over from admiration for German brands too

Probably a racial component too, Germany happens to be the 'right kind if white' but IDK if it'd be articulated in that way

Idk, I can ask my cousin - she's a big fan of Germany

― 龜, Thursday, 10 July 2014 14:45 (10 minutes ago) Permalink

conrad, Thursday, 10 July 2014 14:56 (2 weeks ago) Permalink

pplains otm. I mean I don't waste time objecting to the term because I don't think derailing conversations about race is valuable unless that's your sole aim, just seemed worth mentioning cause ppl were talking about how terrible p.o.ethnicity is, and I don't see that this phrase frames whiteness as the default any less. but I don't use it & nor does anyone I know. Lots of ppl doing important work like the term, fine, I find it awkward & mealy-mouthed. As long as nobody's saying that activists necessarily get the final say on how everyone should feel about these terms, it's not really a thing.

Lots of xps

when there's no more room in heㄥㄥ the thread will walk the earth (wins), Thursday, 10 July 2014 15:10 (2 weeks ago) Permalink

interesting that "POC" came into wide american usage thru fanon, but i don't think he's the originator of the term -- iirc (dimly) it's a french coinage from its own colonial times -- meant as a catch-all term for the varieties of people descended from both french and africans

but tbh i'm getting this from this book: http://www.tomreiss.com/node/18 and it's only touched upon glancingly in the explicit connection. he uses "people of color" because it's the term extant in all the legal documents from the era

goole, Thursday, 10 July 2014 16:03 (2 weeks ago) Permalink

I'm glad we can all agree that the real problem is activists telling people how to feel a way.

Orson Wellies (in orbit), Thursday, 10 July 2014 16:57 (2 weeks ago) Permalink

"People of ethnicity" is not a term used in the UK. The usual phrase is "BME people".

An HR person in the UK used it when talking specifically about 'diversity awareness training' and it jarred. I was wondering if this was the new POC, which to me as a Brit does sound odd on its own but as IO says, it seems to have been widely accepted so who am I to object.

kinder, Thursday, 10 July 2014 18:23 (2 weeks ago) Permalink

NME people?

how's life, Thursday, 10 July 2014 18:26 (2 weeks ago) Permalink

I'm glad we can all agree that the real problem is activists telling people how to feel a way.

― Orson Wellies (in orbit), Thursday, July 10, 2014 5:57 PM (5 hours ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

yeah don't be a d*ck

when there's no more room in heㄥㄥ the thread will walk the earth (wins), Thursday, 10 July 2014 22:28 (2 weeks ago) Permalink

or ok I guess I phrased it badly, sorry

this is a verrrry unperfect phrase being used to describe a giant fucking mass of people, I was saying that when some of them feel a bit iffy about that phrase then it'd be uncool to argue "well these people like it so nobody gets to argue" and then acknowledged that prob nobody itt was making that argument

when there's no more room in heㄥㄥ the thread will walk the earth (wins), Thursday, 10 July 2014 22:31 (2 weeks ago) Permalink

When I was younger a lot of older australians called migrants "ethnics", fwiw. The other quaint old phrase boomers used was "new Australians".

the Bronski Review (Trayce), Friday, 11 July 2014 04:21 (1 week ago) Permalink

Wonder if it's a uk/us divide - iirc lex is not too happy w the term either

― 龜, Thursday, July 10, 2014 11:26 AM (2 days ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

more like an activist/non-activist divide ime. i still dislike "POC" but end up using it for the sake of convenience these days. instinctively prefer "non-white" because yeah, it centres whiteness, but it also reminds us that whiteness is centred anyway, and whiteness being centred is the reason disparate non-white ethnicities have any reason to be lumped together at all.

"BME" in the uk is more the language of non-offensive officialdom than common parlance.

lex pretend, Saturday, 12 July 2014 14:54 (1 week ago) Permalink

not really the thread for it but there are similar arguments about "people with disabilities" as mentioned earlier - social model activists would say that this construction places the disability in the individual as opposed to "disabled people" which tries to indicate that people are disabled by the social structures around them

Daphnis Celesta, Saturday, 12 July 2014 15:15 (1 week ago) Permalink

I thought there was a Rolling "This IS Racist" thread? Anyway, that's where this belongs

Tommy McTommy (Tom D.), Saturday, 12 July 2014 15:55 (1 week ago) Permalink

From the HR dept that brought us 'people of ethnicity', a whole salespitch about how great 'diversity management' is. With no definition of that term anywhere - at face value it sounds like 'ethnic cleansing' or something. They also stated that some people are non-ethnic (despite defining 'ethnicity' elsewhere in the expected way).

kinder, Wednesday, 23 July 2014 18:14 (Yesterday) Permalink

diversity management: you know, infiltrating their organizations, paying for more riot patrol overtime, defunding preschool programs

j., Wednesday, 23 July 2014 19:09 (Yesterday) Permalink

i'm hispanic and i use 'people of color' regularly. my dad who is an immigrant HATES 'people of color' to him it's exactly the same as "colored people." when my brother went to college, he received a letter of welcome from the students of color organization and my dad flipped out and was so offended that they were labeling my brother as "colored." i tried to explain to him that the term "people of color" is widely used by anti-racism activists as a way to promote solidarity among nonwhite people but he didn't really get it. in the same conversation i told my mom that "queer" was reclaimed similarly by LGBT communities and she was very surprised.

i also use 'non-white' fairly often too.

i understand why someone would find 'people of color' just as meaningless as 'people of ethnicity' but i find the latter to be very clunky. but yet all of these terms locate whiteness as the norm/center, and i don't know if you can get away from that in a world where whiteness is exactly that.

marcos, Wednesday, 23 July 2014 19:22 (Yesterday) Permalink

i don't know if you can get away from that in a world where whiteness is exactly that.

eh not that whiteness is the norm but that it is the "perceived norm", maybe "center" is really the better word

marcos, Wednesday, 23 July 2014 19:23 (Yesterday) Permalink

yeah definitely. i don't really get the issue, whiteness affects all "non-whiteness" in specific, massive infrastructural ways, and a term like "poc" is sort of necessary to address that. like a lot of things i think a lot of resistance to it is because it strikes people as new and tacky. especially if they mentally link it to tumblr. never underestimate perceived tackiness.

otoh a lot of people cling to "POC" when they're really just talking about one race. i've seen a lot of people use it when they're really only talking about black people, i guess bc people treat it as the "sensitive" term to use rather than a term with a specific purpose, and in that way it can be used to unintentionally whitewash things by failing to address specific issues that don't apply to all POC.

i don't get "people of ethnicity" doesn't everyone have ethnicity? i think i am a people of ethnicity. that seems built off of a misuse of the word. usually regarding cuisine. university "department of ethnicity"s make sense to me cause i've always interpreted that as being the sort of study of ethnicities in relation to each other, and it's difficult for an entire dept to study minority ethnicities without confronting majority ones.

linda cardellini (zachlyon), Wednesday, 23 July 2014 22:55 (Yesterday) Permalink

Ethnicity makes all sort of sense in the Asian American context, "Asian" not being a 'race' in the same way that being 'white' or 'black' is, although people will often try to use it in that way

I imagine it is the same with the descriptor Latin@

, Wednesday, 23 July 2014 23:26 (Yesterday) Permalink

oh god "department of ethnicity" what is wrong with me

linda cardellini (zachlyon), Thursday, 24 July 2014 00:30 (7 hours ago) Permalink


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