Pretend you have a ballot for the 2012 edition of Sight & Sound's top 10 movies of all time list

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I know you don't agree--we went over this on a different thread--but I think you have to accept, or at least recognize, that for some of us they exist as a single film. Especially as you get farther and farther away from them. I'm sure they seemed very distinct when they were first released; now, for me, they blur into one another. The fairness issue in the real poll is another issue, as is the problem for anyone who has a marked preference for one of them

clemenza, Monday, 13 September 2010 02:12 (4 years ago) Permalink

tbh i'm with eric on this one

k¸ (darraghmac), Monday, 13 September 2010 02:15 (4 years ago) Permalink

I don't like the Kill Bills at all, but if they start turning up double-listed on polls 15 years from now (please no...), it'll make sense to me. But I do get your objection.

clemenza, Monday, 13 September 2010 02:15 (4 years ago) Permalink

back to the futures, then? how d'you make the call?

k¸ (darraghmac), Monday, 13 September 2010 02:17 (4 years ago) Permalink

Well...realistically, there are probably very few candidates for these kinds of polls that present a similar problem. The first two Godfathers might not be unique, but they're close.

clemenza, Monday, 13 September 2010 02:21 (4 years ago) Permalink

Merging the two Godfathers was nothing but a callous move by S&S to stiff them up in the rankings. They were not filmed concurrently.

That said, no rules on these ballots.

Eric H., Monday, 13 September 2010 02:22 (4 years ago) Permalink

That said, do I feel this way because I think they're both overrated? Probably.

Eric H., Monday, 13 September 2010 02:23 (4 years ago) Permalink

I've got the print issue somewhere around here. I can't remember if you did this or not, but I'm going to take a quick count of separate votes tomorrow. Why do you think they had a vested interest in bumping up GF's totals--to get something more current in the Top 10? You may be right, I'm just not sure what their motivation would be.

clemenza, Monday, 13 September 2010 02:36 (4 years ago) Permalink

I did split the votes out, and The Godfather would've made the top 10 (just barely) and Part II would've been, I think, 11th.

Eric H., Monday, 13 September 2010 02:38 (4 years ago) Permalink

I guess that would rule out currency as a cause. I dunno, maybe they did it to engineer at least one major shake-up in the rankings.

Eric H., Monday, 13 September 2010 02:39 (4 years ago) Permalink

That's even weirder...It tells me that the decision was based on the unusual 10th/11th finish, for better or worse. If they finish 6th and 17th, or 8th and 29th, I don't think they would have done it.

clemenza, Monday, 13 September 2010 02:41 (4 years ago) Permalink

Watch The Godfather Parts I & II ascend to the number one slot in '12.

Eric H., Monday, 13 September 2010 02:43 (4 years ago) Permalink

When you present it that way, I may have come around to your way of thinking. Here's what I think: that if, like me, you want to cast a double-vote, and only use up one slot, you should be allowed to, and each one should have that vote counted towards its total. I know that gives some people 11 votes if they want to exercise that, but so be it. But if x number of people voted for I and it finished 10th, and y number of people voted for II and it finished 11th, and it's two different sets of people, then combining them into one total makes some huge assumptions. So I agree, that's not right. I think I thought that people were actually sending in ballots that had I & II as one film

clemenza, Monday, 13 September 2010 02:53 (4 years ago) Permalink

I'm pretty sure they weren't. If, for instance, you think the first one is one of the 10 greatest movies of all time and the second one is merely a really good sequel, or vice versa, it's sort of disingenuous to have your vote for the former end up going toward the totals of the latter.

But I admit there probably aren't that many people who really love one and really dislike the other.

Eric H., Monday, 13 September 2010 02:58 (4 years ago) Permalink

Now I'm suddenly worried that they're going to combine votes for Barely Legal #14 and Barely Legal #15.

Good night all.

clemenza, Monday, 13 September 2010 03:06 (4 years ago) Permalink

I favor merging Tokyo Story and Vertigo into one movie.

❽ (M.V.), Monday, 13 September 2010 03:08 (4 years ago) Permalink

i know ppl that really love part one and have no use for the sequels and obv 'part two is better than part one' is almost conventional wisdom now, though that's not the same as dismissing part one. i've pretty much always leaned towards two (and if clemenza had been in it it might be a runaway decision), but lately the pulp blockbuster novel roots that show in one and the somewhat unmet higher aspirations toward a higher station in two make me lean toward the first one (plus brando).

balls, Monday, 13 September 2010 03:15 (4 years ago) Permalink

to be fair barely legal 14 and 15 were shot concurrently.

balls, Monday, 13 September 2010 03:16 (4 years ago) Permalink

Well...realistically, there are probably very few candidates for these kinds of polls that present a similar problem. The first two Godfathers might not be unique, but they're close - hello ivan the terrible

balls, Monday, 13 September 2010 03:17 (4 years ago) Permalink

they were cumshot cumcurrentwatly

Eric H., Monday, 13 September 2010 03:17 (4 years ago) Permalink

i haven't seen it, but is the inclusion of showgirls on two lists anything other than challops?

Mordy, Monday, 13 September 2010 03:21 (4 years ago) Permalink

berkely's second best role until curse of the jade scorpion.

balls, Monday, 13 September 2010 03:24 (4 years ago) Permalink

No way, First Wives Club was way better than Jade Scorpion.

Eric H., Monday, 13 September 2010 03:29 (4 years ago) Permalink

Love that we've had Air Bud, Naked Gun 2 1/2 and actual porn on ballots and it's Showgirls that gets called out.

Eric H., Monday, 13 September 2010 03:29 (4 years ago) Permalink

Other MGM musicals are deeper.

How does this matter?

― Eric H., Sunday

grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr

kind of shrill and very self-righteous (Dr Morbius), Monday, 13 September 2010 11:45 (4 years ago) Permalink

bcuz deeper films are better, Mr. The Fury

kind of shrill and very self-righteous (Dr Morbius), Monday, 13 September 2010 11:46 (4 years ago) Permalink

Love that we've had Air Bud, Naked Gun 2 1/2 and actual porn on ballots and it's Showgirls that gets called out

But is that because it's any better, or because they're all equivalent?

k¸ (darraghmac), Monday, 13 September 2010 11:46 (4 years ago) Permalink

Showgirls is deeper.

Eejit Piaf (Noodle Vague), Monday, 13 September 2010 12:57 (4 years ago) Permalink

Go deeper into Showgirls.

Eric H., Monday, 13 September 2010 13:00 (4 years ago) Permalink

Also, I'm pretty tired of hearing how The Band Wagon is somehow deeper than Singin' in the Rain. The reason I like The Band Wagon is that it ends with the admission that it's all about the show, g-d it.

Eric H., Monday, 13 September 2010 13:01 (4 years ago) Permalink

morbs, diff strokes and all that, but the funny thing is, Suspiria sorta has more in common w a musical than it does trad narrative cinema - its all about colour, light, stylised movement, and the interrelationship btween image and soundtrack, imho - its like the Red Shoes w added blud! The Shining also is an incredibly CHOREOGRAPHED film

Ward Fowler, Monday, 13 September 2010 13:05 (4 years ago) Permalink

'Showgirls is deeper' is verging on some non sequitur truthbomb fundamental meaning shit

k¸ (darraghmac), Monday, 13 September 2010 13:16 (4 years ago) Permalink

tbh it wasn't really a joke

Eejit Piaf (Noodle Vague), Monday, 13 September 2010 13:18 (4 years ago) Permalink

Ward, Morbs has no use for choreogriffany.

Eric H., Monday, 13 September 2010 13:20 (4 years ago) Permalink

I was waiting to see how long I could get away with The Naked Gun 2 1/2. Airplane! was Gore Vidal's favorite comedy, so.

Gucci Mane hermeneuticist (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Monday, 13 September 2010 13:22 (4 years ago) Permalink

I'm just way more partial to the first Naked Gun. Tho the third one has that great Academy Awards setpiece.

Eric H., Monday, 13 September 2010 13:33 (4 years ago) Permalink

Thin Red Line
The Passenger
L'avventura
8 1/2
Seven Samurai
Stalker
Vertigo
Magnificent Ambersons
Au Hasard Balthazar
Tokyo Story

ryan, Monday, 13 September 2010 14:35 (4 years ago) Permalink

Love that Kane is on a grand total of 1 ballots. The ballot with Esteban Buttez: The First Ten Posts on it.

Eric H., Monday, 13 September 2010 14:42 (4 years ago) Permalink

took Naked Gun 2 1/2 as a troll of every great film comedian ever

kind of shrill and very self-righteous (Dr Morbius), Monday, 13 September 2010 14:54 (4 years ago) Permalink

Kane is in my second 10

acoleuthic, Monday, 13 September 2010 14:55 (4 years ago) Permalink

Eyes Wide Shut is at least as "choreographed" as The Shining and much less dumb.

kind of shrill and very self-righteous (Dr Morbius), Monday, 13 September 2010 14:57 (4 years ago) Permalink

i haven't seen it, but is the inclusion of showgirls on two lists anything other than challops?

No more than the fucking Godfather.

C0L1N B..., Monday, 13 September 2010 15:06 (4 years ago) Permalink

^ challops

k¸ (darraghmac), Monday, 13 September 2010 15:10 (4 years ago) Permalink

Well sure, but The Godfather is some lugubrious garbage, and unless you're Michael Medved, it shouldn't be all that surprising that a lot of people like Paul Verhoeven.

C0L1N B..., Monday, 13 September 2010 15:28 (4 years ago) Permalink

this is what I came up thinking about for about 5 min

A Woman Under The Influence
2001: A Space Odyssey
Persona
Aguirre: The Wrath of God
Le Mépris
Mulholland Dr
Andrei Rublev
There Will Be Blood
Tokyo Story
Blade Runner

peter in montreal, Monday, 13 September 2010 15:34 (4 years ago) Permalink

oh shit- blade runner definitely gets in for me, prob at expense of serpico

k¸ (darraghmac), Monday, 13 September 2010 15:36 (4 years ago) Permalink

The Godfather is some lugubrious garbage

I think I'm guilty of detouring too many threads into Godfather talk, so we're lettin' that one pass!

clemenza, Monday, 13 September 2010 15:55 (4 years ago) Permalink

Leave the post. Take the cannoli.

Shock and Awe High School (Phil D.), Monday, 13 September 2010 16:08 (4 years ago) Permalink

I can understand lots of reasons for not being into the Godfather movies, but being "lugubrious" is the most WTF flown-in-on-a-meteor-from-the-other-side-of-the-galaxy reason I've ever heard.

Eejit Piaf (Noodle Vague), Monday, 13 September 2010 16:49 (4 years ago) Permalink

it insists upon itself

The sulky expression from the hilarious "Aubrey Plaza" persona (history mayne), Monday, 13 September 2010 16:49 (4 years ago) Permalink


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