Great albums Robert Christgau hates

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j blount (papa la bas), Wednesday, 29 March 2006 19:35 (eighteen years ago) link

actually that mysterious purpose was pretty clear in the opening post (and had nothing to do with xgau aside from him being the source of a list of shitty albums). People just wanted to go on about xgau. Why are you bringing this up?

Zwan (miccio), Wednesday, 29 March 2006 19:46 (eighteen years ago) link

I dunno, I kind of liked that thread. And here it is Let the record show that the thread got a lot longer than this one before blount started posting images from sporting events.

The Day The World Turned Dayglo Redd (Ken L), Wednesday, 29 March 2006 19:48 (eighteen years ago) link

Richard Meltzer talking about getting free tickets to concerts in the early seventies because he was a rock critic from interview in the fanzine Osmotic Tongue Pressure ca. late nineties:

RM: If they sent you the ticket, rather than pick it up at the club, it'd be very easy to sell the tickets. I remember I sold Led Zeppelin and Black Sabbath.

OTP: Dude, you passed up a Sabbath show?

Tim Ellison (Tim Ellison), Wednesday, 29 March 2006 20:24 (eighteen years ago) link

A bored, quasi-trolling, conscious overreaction to a Christgau review of an album I like a lot, and suddenly there are 70 new posts.

Rockist_Scientist (RSLaRue), Wednesday, 29 March 2006 20:25 (eighteen years ago) link

And you're surprised by this, laRue?

The Day The World Turned Dayglo Redd (Ken L), Wednesday, 29 March 2006 20:27 (eighteen years ago) link

(Not that I am taking credit for anything. It's only to easy, just use the magic word, "Christgau.")

x-post:

No, not really, but it's amazing that it works so well.

Rockist_Scientist (RSLaRue), Wednesday, 29 March 2006 20:28 (eighteen years ago) link

I ponder at this thread revival.

Ned Raggett (Ned), Wednesday, 29 March 2006 20:30 (eighteen years ago) link

Haha, reading upthread from that Sparks review - Christgau himself on the hippie topic:

"'Never turn your back on mother earth', they chant or gibber in a style unnatural enough to end your current relationship or kill your cacti, and I must be a natural man after all, because I can't endure the contradiction."

Tim Ellison (Tim Ellison), Wednesday, 29 March 2006 20:30 (eighteen years ago) link

I wonder if Anthony still likes Sugar Ray. If so, I might be willing to spend the buck next time I see it in the used bin to find out why...

js (honestengine), Wednesday, 29 March 2006 20:38 (eighteen years ago) link

I still do, yes. If you didn't like the hits, I wouldn't bother checking out the rest, though.

Zwan (miccio), Wednesday, 29 March 2006 21:39 (eighteen years ago) link

I only really remember one of the hits (Fly), but that's a strong enough recommendation if I see it for a buck or under.

js (honestengine), Wednesday, 29 March 2006 21:46 (eighteen years ago) link

Taking Sides: Third Eye Blind vs. Sugar Ray

geeta (geeta), Wednesday, 29 March 2006 22:47 (eighteen years ago) link

Wimpy music makes him into such a baby!

Zwan (miccio), Wednesday, 29 March 2006 22:49 (eighteen years ago) link

five years pass...

The Ultimate Negative Christgau Review
http://blog.wfmu.org/freeform/2011/08/the-ultimate-negative-christgau-review.html

A born liar, showing all the imagination of an ATM in the process, a certain petty honesty and jerk-off humor, a man without a context, a pompous, overfed con artist, a preening panderer, mythologizing his rockin’ ‘50s with all the ignorant cynicism of a punk poser, a propulsive flagwaver attached to UNESCO lyrics about people all over the world joining hands, a simpleton, but also a genuine weirdo, a spoiled stud past his prime, so that while he was always sexy he wasn’t always seductive, a stinker, from Jesus-rock to studio jollity, a tedious ideologue with a hustle, a tough talker diddles teenpop’s love button. Act authentic for too long and it begins to sound like an act even if it isn’t.

“Adult” grit and phrasing, affluent spirituality cum cornball romanticism from a florid New Age keyb maestro, ain’t nobody gonna boogie to the moons of Saturn. Air-kiss soul, alienated patriotic, all clotted surrealism and Geddy Lee theatrics, all form and no conviction, except for the conviction that form is everything. All he proves is that when you dwell on suffering you get pompous. An archetypal indie whiner.

Another Wu mood record, anthemic grandiosity, antiquarianism permits him to use such words as “withers” and “blackguard.” Anyone naive enough to believe there’s nothing more distasteful than a middle-aged man pretending his hormones are too much for him has never encountered a middle-aged man trying to act cute. Arbitrary ebullience.
Are there really adults who find sustenance in folk-pop that blurs all distinctions between the lyrical and the moony? Arrogant and enervated all at once, arrogantly catchy, artificially ripened singing, which goes down like a store-bought banana daiquiri.

Ass man, schlockmeister, cosmic slimeball. Attracts admirers by means of a principled arrogance that has no relation to his actual talents or accomplishments. Attributes not present: wit, joy, jokes, hooks. Auteur, whatever that means. Cocaine slanger, catchy on jezebels and dull on world peace. Close observation is still Creative Writing. Compares himself to Picasso whilst suing black people who sample his hooks.

Double-hoohah, doubly coy, doubly tonic, down from 48 percent to 35 at amiannoying.com, doyen of depression, dramatic paradiddles and sculpted streams of molten garage guitar, draws his phony drawl so tight he sounds like a singing penis.

Even his haphazardness is getting predictable, even his unnecessarily ideological heterosexuality is more an expression of mood than a statement of policy, even in 1968 he had too much dinosaur in him. He’s a case study in the moral inadequacy of authenticity, he’s a pomo sociophobe of a familiar and tedious sort, he’s about as hip hop as Christian Marclay, or at best the Art Ensemble of Chicago, he’s big on locations, spends an entire song convincing her to do it in a chair, he’s convinced me that I’ll get off on a white R & B singer from Savile Row the same day I give up Jack Daniel’s for sherry and join the Dartmouth Club.

Expert on tenderoni, expert trivialization of murder, explores realms of vocal inexpressiveness undreamt by Stephin Merritt or the Handsome Family. Limp aural satire, literary malfeasance, logical successor to Shaun Cassidy.

Fizzle-prone chart charges, flute solo and a middle-aged man gasping in the throes of sexual excitation. For a dumb tribulations-of-a-rock-star epic, this isn’t bad.

Funnier than the Chipmunks, give him that. Furious negativist then, goofy nature mystic now, fusoid, fussy as Streisand, ugly as sin, touched with grace. Makes much more than most out of waving his dick, expanding his mind, makes music for stewardesses if ever there was such a thing, makes the sex life of an aging punk in an overgrown college town sound active, raunchy, and not without spiritual rewards, making callow belligerence seem an unmitigated virtue.

Generic American hunk, only whiter because he’s Canadian. Likable protest novelties, like an English Grand Funk gone disco, like Ian hunter or Roger Chapman though without their panache, like Kinky Friedman with a sense of humor, like most hereditary bohemians was brought up to think he’s better than normal people, like protest singers, novelty artists put too much strain on the words, like Star Wars or Windows 95, he unlocks the gate to a luxurious passivity. Limited sentiment in any case.

The motherfucker realizes that metalheads will throw money at you long after your hip cachet has gone the way of your hard-on. Minor popster, major wiseass, and great lost indie-rocker. Genius teensploitation, genuine Americana, gets chicken grease on a young thing’s pantyhose, gets sloppier and samier as his adolescence becomes more figurative. More dreck from your unfriendly doomsaying hitmaker, more entertaining than Anthony Braxton and Wallace Stevens put together.

Gosh, what a terrific idea—a concept album about a cocksure rock and roller who Cannot Love. Manipulative pseudocertainty, manly empathy and world-weary remorse of the big-rock balladeer, the mess a lesser talent would have barfed up years ago. The modernizations of sometime coproducer Dave Stewart mitigate the neoconservative aura somewhat. Has Indie Lifer stamped on its copyright notice.

Hayseed manqué, he chose metal over Vegas because Vegas wouldn’t have him. He denoodled. He even has jowls. Maybe he’s better off not aiming for masterpieces.

He grooves his overpaid pickup band, he tells Jeff Beck what to do, he writes love songs for every occasion, he hectors like a crank politician would hector if the politician were a rock singer, he makes with the free-love smarm, he may yet give a fuck, he pixilates his pseudosex with studio sensationalism, he reclaims his perpetually threatened manhood.

He shrivels into irrelevancy. I find his success very depressing. The work of a man who thinks he’s too big for music. The reactionary stratagems of one more crappy pop star. The rich are always with us.

He speeds up the schlock and, it still sounds like schlock, he still can’t resist ballads, a big mistake for a man who spells l-u-v like c-u-m.

New jack love man, he’s even more adenoidal than his worthy forebears, he’s the worst singer I’ve ever heard. Nastiest wimp since Ron Mael.

Label-changing ceremony, laid-back contagion, leftwing, hyperemotional, supercompetent persona, legacy beats, less experimental beatwise, lesser clichés, lesser horrors. Lets you know he has balls by singing as though someone is twisting them.

His amused, mildly funky self-involvement at its sharpest and sexiest, his breakthrough is a mutation, not a fruition, his child-voiced consort, his foil-wrapped condom turns out to be Chanukah gelt, his follow-up crossed PG-13 thug and subpar Luther Vandross, his imitation of Joe Cocker’s Ray Charles imitation is almost OK, his life in the bush of a fully-formed middle-class music scene. His PG rating isn’t scruples, it’s cowardice. Suffers from Jackson Browne’s syndrome. They’ve let him put some of his art therapy on the cover. Thinks up reasons why the planet should adjust to his mental reflexes.

Theoretical dandy, sounded hot, acted cold, ran out of riffs, sounds as if there’s more to a man’s life than the parlous fate of his latest erection, sounds like a strangling werewolf commercial, sounds like he should leave his therapist, not his group, sounds like Jello Biafra discovered the Stooges in 1977, sounds like Steve Miller bunny-hopping with Gary Lewis & the Playboys toward the Isle of Wimp. Stereo potato into overweight lover. Stevie Winwood is no longer the best Stevie Winwood in the world, this no-talent is masscult rock at its most brazen.

Takes the aimless vapidity of ambient another step toward total stasis, talk-sings like a demented trucker, drag racer, or metal animal tantrum set to music. Ten years of falling-down flakedom only a cultist could love or even appreciate.

His productivity isn’t exuberance, it’s greed, his purity is a candid affectation—a standard variation on late alt’s agoraphobic cultivation of ineptitude as a token of spiritual superiority, his record is a case study in the Europeanness of English heavy metal, his seducerama is in the manner of an aging matinee idol who isn’t quite as famous as he thinks he is. His short-lived “new-wave” bent surfaces. Sings as if he’s doing sitar impressions, sings like there’s a cattle prod at his scrotum.

Serves up his progress in modest and reliable doses, oversinging like Michael Bolton at a Perot rally, raps better than Rodney Dangerfield, and sings dull tunes landscaped with eerie licks, odd bridges, and a hyperactive rhythm section. Over-the-hill blowhards gotta stick together.

Song-doctored fabrications, songs are as pissed off as a millionaire can be, packs the voice of Merry Clayton into the body of Gertrude Stein. His wet croon, nuanced adenoids, historical anguish, histrionic understatement and vague specificity, hologram soul, homemade Beatles, hostile but not asocial. Pussy comes so easy now that he no longer bothers to hone his come-on. How little guitar gods know of the world.

Jocularly misogynist, now officially a menace, just a handsome dilettante enjoying his easy tunes and found beats, just another case of “substance” as novelty. No matter what your voice teachers tell you, wackiness is not something to modulate.

Populist intentions far outstrips the depth of his populist perceptions, poseur maudit, poster boy of the American Agony Association. One thing alt-rock produces in superfluity is nice guys, one thing’s sure—this is shitty background music. Oneness with nature under conditions of artificial gravity, one-sided masterpiece. Ooze is embraced. Rock bricolage, rock-or-die drums, romantic egoist of the old school, ruthlessly atypical young careerist.

Scarcely less pompous when servicing the marketplace than when expressing himself in the privacy of his own throwaways—schlock has roots, too. Sci-fi ecopessimism, self-congratulatory, self-consciously Artistic, self-consciously noncanonical market ploy. Wiggy abstraction of his self-regard. Whatever his significance, a cornball is a cornball is a cornball.

Sixties Schmixties, slacker version of the pretentious asshole, slightly salacious humanism, slogging toward stardom for so long he never noticed what happened to Shaun Cassidy. Slowly receding into alienated resignation, small but engrossing orgasms stretching into an infinite future, smarmy piece of sexist pseudosoul. Too-idealistic-for-this-world straight-edge avatar, smarter than Cat Stevens, sexier than Norman Vincent Peale. So R & B that for incomprehensibility’s sake he outsources some patois.

Sociopolitical inauthentic, solicitousness that’s strangely chilling, somehow sui generis and foreordained at the same time. Sometimes I think the little girls don’t understand a damn thing.

Vaguely anti-authoritarian, vaguely irritating pop exotics. Very few listeners actually enjoy songs in which snobbish dandies trot out their sexual egomania—actually seems to boast about how fast he can ejaculate.

Vocabulary of grunts, squeals, hiccups, moans, and asides is a vivid reminder that he’s grown up. Voices promise whipped-cream sex that’ll taste of mackerel in the morning. Wallowing in otiose thug fantasies and bathetic hater-hating, hiring big names who collect their checks and go, he is indeed hateful if not altogether devoid of musical ideas.

Weak-mindedness passing itself off as spirituality. Weird and tricky—you’ve been middle-aged and liberal since you were fifteen.

by another name (amateurist), Tuesday, 2 August 2011 23:00 (twelve years ago) link

From the comments:

Somehow this leaves out "On one tune, he turns into a salmon while masturbating in front of the fireplace."

His reivew of Neil Young's "Will to Love"?

I'm such a nerd.

livin in my own private Biden hole (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Tuesday, 2 August 2011 23:02 (twelve years ago) link

My favorite mean Christgau review:

Pornography [A&M, 1982]
"In books/And films/And in life/And in heaven/The sound of slaughter/As your body turns . . ."--no, I can't go on. I mean, why so glum, chum? Cheer up; look on the bright side. You got your contract, right? And your synthesizers, bet you'll have fun with them. Believe me, kid, it will pass. C

kornrulez6969, Wednesday, 3 August 2011 02:46 (twelve years ago) link

That ultimate negative xgau review is awesome. I bet the musical version of it would be amazing too.

lizard tails, a self-regenerating food source for survival (wk), Wednesday, 3 August 2011 04:41 (twelve years ago) link

you know you're through the looking glass when you read that Ultimate Negative Review and think "b-b-but the 'do it in a chair line' came from a positive review!"

da croupier, Wednesday, 3 August 2011 12:32 (twelve years ago) link

Would like to see a "Subterranean Homesick Blues"-style cue card throwaway video of that. With Weird Al playing Dylan/Xgau.

Scharlach Sometimes (James Redd and the Blecchs), Wednesday, 3 August 2011 12:56 (twelve years ago) link

Is every barb in that Ultimate Negative Review directed at a male?

Mark, Wednesday, 3 August 2011 13:46 (twelve years ago) link

They're practically in alphabetical order

frogbs, Wednesday, 3 August 2011 14:49 (twelve years ago) link

The female directed version would include gems like "I haven't found black leotards sexy since I broke up with Sheila in 1962."

waxing gibbous (Sanpaku), Wednesday, 3 August 2011 15:41 (twelve years ago) link

three years pass...

HAHA MUSIC CRITICS

"Dud of the Month

DR. DRE: The Chronic (Interscope) The crucial innovation of this benchmark album isn't its conscienceless naturalization of casual violence. It's Dre's escape from sampling. Other rappers, as they are called, have promised to create their own musical environments, usually without revealing how much art and how much publishing fuels their creative resolve. But Dre is the first to make the fantasy pay out big-time. The world he hears in his head isn't the up-to-date P-Funk fools say they hear--that would be too hard. Instead he lays bassline readymades under simulations of Bernie Worrell's high keyb sustain, a basically irritating sound that in context always signified fantasy, not reality--stoned self-loss or, at a best Dre never approaches, grandiose jive. This is bell-bottoms-and-Afros music, its spiritual source the blaxploitation soundtrack, and what it promises above all is boom times for third-rate flautists--sociopathic easy-listening. Even if it's "just pop music," as some rationalize, it's bad pop music. C PLUS "

He also included Doggystyle a "Dud" in his dud list:

http://www.robertchristgau.com/xg/cg/cgv294-94.php

Daukins (Arctic Noon Auk), Sunday, 19 April 2015 11:14 (nine years ago) link

Illmatic didn't warrant a review or score from him , just a mention:

http://www.robertchristgau.com/xg/cg/cgv794-94.php

Daukins (Arctic Noon Auk), Sunday, 19 April 2015 11:17 (nine years ago) link

critics who have individual, often baffling taste > critics who have a knack for reacting to things the way the larger culture does

Treeship, Sunday, 19 April 2015 14:15 (nine years ago) link

*the way the larger culture does will

Treeship, Sunday, 19 April 2015 14:16 (nine years ago) link

critics who have individual, often baffling taste > critics who have a knack for reacting to things the way the larger culture does

― Treeship, Sunday, April 19, 2015 3:15 PM (6 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

As long as it's not for the sake of being different, I can see your point.

I'm not anti Christgau.

This is just a funny complete misreading of the deeper cultural, musical importance of what he was listening to. He wasn't with it. He didn't see it. Or hear it. He essentially didn't get it.

And I'm not even a big fan of Doggystyle and Chronic. They're not albums I have been interested in listening to that much. But to put them both on his "DUDS" list at the time? Indicates a general level of cluelessness.

He defines Dud as "A Dud (Dud) is a bad record whose details rarely merit further thought. At the upper level it may merely be overrated, disappointing, or dull. Down below it may be contemptible. "

Arctic Noon Auk, Sunday, 19 April 2015 14:28 (nine years ago) link

5 mics in The Source aside, generalist critics all kinda dropped the ball on Illmatic at the time -- it placed at #33 on Pazz & Jop. that said, it is funny to see Christgau toss it out in a miscellaneous roundup behind the Flintstones soundtrack.

some dude, Sunday, 19 April 2015 14:31 (nine years ago) link

critics might not have grasped the enormity of illmatic but funny that all the people, musicians, that were involved in the album were totally aware of the hugeness of what they were taking part in. other rappers and producers looked at him as some messiah. even wu tang, and they hated everyone, especially rappers.

Arctic Noon Auk, Sunday, 19 April 2015 14:45 (nine years ago) link

basically Christgau was just another music critic of the 90s that simply didn't get hip hop or its impending influence. they were still looking down on it as much as was possible. there were some visionaries but a major flaw of Christgau's career is that he was just another white music critic that didn't forsee and value hip hop as an artform. I'm reading through his other rap reviews of the 90s and they're all as clueless so far.

Arctic Noon Auk, Sunday, 19 April 2015 14:51 (nine years ago) link

other classics i've stumbled upon that he didn't see as that great: gza's liquid swords, atcq's midnight marauders.

Arctic Noon Auk, Sunday, 19 April 2015 14:55 (nine years ago) link

visionaries but a major flaw of Christgau's career is that he was just another white music critic that didn't forsee and value hip hop as an artform

That's an unfair, lazy criticism. He was very early with recognizing hip hop. Look at his ballots for pazz and jop...

http://www.robertchristgau.com/xg/pnj/index.php

Picking out random records that he didn't rate as highly as you do now is a bit unfair, to put it mildly. Criticize him all you want, but you don't get to paint him as a racist because he didn't like GZA.

kornrulez6969, Sunday, 19 April 2015 15:02 (nine years ago) link

racist?

i've checked the list, I don't really see what it is you're pointing out.

Arctic Noon Auk, Sunday, 19 April 2015 15:39 (nine years ago) link

This argument is so old its like, "Chewie, we're home!" Except we never left.

da croupier, Sunday, 19 April 2015 15:41 (nine years ago) link

"Picking out random records that he didn't rate as highly as you do now is a bit unfair, to put it mildly."

Check the thread title homie.

Arctic Noon Auk, Sunday, 19 April 2015 15:47 (nine years ago) link

speaking of the dawn of the thread, i'm curious what lead you to reviving it. were you looking at xgau reviews, wanted to discuss it, and then searched for the appropriate thread? were you searching for christgau threads, found this one - started in 2002, last revived in 2011 - and then went looking for reviews that fit the bill?

da croupier, Sunday, 19 April 2015 15:53 (nine years ago) link

Wasn't xgau notably complaining about rockism back in the late 80s?

SurfaceKrystal, Sunday, 19 April 2015 15:57 (nine years ago) link

i think just made someone change screennames

da croupier, Sunday, 19 April 2015 15:59 (nine years ago) link

speaking of the dawn of the thread, i'm curious what lead you to reviving it. were you looking at xgau reviews, wanted to discuss it, and then searched for the appropriate thread? were you searching for christgau threads, found this one - started in 2002, last revived in 2011 - and then went looking for reviews that fit the bill?

― da croupier

i found this christgau site via wiki chronic page, and then searched for "christgau". why?

Arctic Noon Auk, Sunday, 19 April 2015 16:27 (nine years ago) link

Hadn't noticed his thing or thang against Bernie Worrell until now, but will choose to ignore it, as one has to sometimes do with the Dean. In other words, Treeship otm.

You Play The Redd And The Blecch Comes Up (James Redd and the Blecchs), Sunday, 19 April 2015 16:29 (nine years ago) link

i was curious, auk - there have been a lot of xgau threads over the years, and plenty in the last few months. for someone to open an old one with "HAHA Music Critics" with a piece of 20+ year old criticism - just wondered what would lead to that.

da croupier, Sunday, 19 April 2015 16:31 (nine years ago) link

because music criticism is really all a big joke, it should be laughed at, because it's funny. i'm not saying i'm anti it, or hating on it, it's just a thing not to take seriously.

Arctic Noon Auk, Sunday, 19 April 2015 16:50 (nine years ago) link

also not to say good music criticism isn't interesting. but when the most famous (?) music reviewer labels such albums as "duds" is funny.

Arctic Noon Auk, Sunday, 19 April 2015 16:59 (nine years ago) link

lots of people think music criticism is a joke - that doesn't lead to them posting 20 year old examples on 3 year old threads

da croupier, Sunday, 19 April 2015 17:04 (nine years ago) link

sorry, 13 year old threads last updated more than 3 years ago

da croupier, Sunday, 19 April 2015 17:04 (nine years ago) link

but anyway, yeah - xgau! what an ironically dismissive clown. makes weird word choices, has obvious biases. only nerds like him can even parse his shorthand. xgau!

da croupier, Sunday, 19 April 2015 17:05 (nine years ago) link

The scales have fallen

You Play The Redd And The Blecch Comes Up (James Redd and the Blecchs), Sunday, 19 April 2015 17:08 (nine years ago) link

And I'm not even a big fan of Doggystyle and Chronic. They're not albums I have been interested in listening to that much.

deej loaf (D-40), Sunday, 19 April 2015 17:32 (nine years ago) link

Dirty Dancing [RCA Victor, 1987]
Five pre-Beatle classics plus six postmodern horrors equals the soundtrack to the world's longest rock video, a brutally depressing top-forty apotheosis. The comparisons are torture--revolting as the contempo material is, it sounds even worse in among the Five Satins and Mickey & Sylvia, who are in turn rendered unlistenable by the commercial manipulations that bring them back to commercial life. Even accessory before the fact Phil Spector sounds not just innocent but simple up against the technocratic ardors of Medley & Warnes's Grammy/Oscar-validated "(I've Had) The Time of My Life" or Eric Carmen's merely radio-validated "Hungry Eyes." The new songs epitomize AOR as CHR, turning everything rock and roll taught us about rhythm and emotion into the melodrama that prerock schlock left behind when it abandoned operetta and the drawing-room ballad. They're almost as good a reason to hate mass culture as Ronald Reagan. D

Mr. Snrub, Monday, 20 April 2015 11:33 (nine years ago) link


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