funky house sceptics, let me draw your attention to this

Hope it doesn't keep you up at night titchy.

I can only assume Lex is now posting obviously-not-funky stuff in this thread as a point of principle...

i didn't post it and am only ever vaguely aware of what thread i'm on ever. shrug. it's a great ep, rtc is wrong here.

i'm assuming that dj nate is not the juke dj nate.

i am actually going through the trax tim recommended a few days ago, no specific thoughts yet but i pretty much love them all except "house girls", when i played the youtube i was like...is that it? this is what y'all have been hyping up so much? and then i listened to "hey hey" instead. i particularly loved mj cole's "volcano riddim" (after his dreadful set at bloc, i doubt i'd have ever checked for his own material off my own bat again), those smi joints and weirdly that drake remix. not even ill blu can save cheryl cole's drabness though.

has everyone heard this by smi?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yBcZx8FHyXo

all except "house girls", when i played the youtube i was like...is that it? this is what y'all have been hyping up so much?

Dancefloor bomb of the year IMO. Only Ill Blu's (actually similar) unnamed/unreleased epic can match it for sheer destructive energy.

also feeling:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cf0rClaKxC4

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yalSdDD_zow

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=krY_7kv8uDE

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F6JpQ4VJH2k

and xara's new s.chu-produced single "peep show" (and his own prelim ep)...

"Sea Sick" is great, one of my favourite Naughty productions, though someone's gotta put his remix of D'Explicit's "Follow Me" on youtube as that's his finest moment I think.

hmm, the dexplicit mix is choice but i tend to think of it as an inferior sibling to his 'omg' one.

picking a fave production seems daunting but the h20 'falling' mix and 'it's you' w/ miss fire ("wishing, waiting, an / ticipating the..." <3<3) are up there for sure. and yeah 'sea sick' is terrific also.

it's difficult because the rare thing about naughty is that his "lesser" productions shore up this impression of his peculiar sensibility permeating through any given other - the hush of the ma1 mix, almost cartoonishly mournful 'i need love' with sascha, 'love lockdown' (slyly his most inspired tune?), and then all the shuffling bangers like 'quicktime', '5th gear', trouble's back'... even 'goosebumps' (which i thing he's putting out next, weirdly) i wouldnt really be a massive fan of on the face of it but still seems admissable to the naughty canon somehow.

btw if anyone ever ripped or downloaded his all-naughty mixes for pioneer and cameo i'd be much obliged if you could put them up - kicking myself for not going to the trouble

weighing up the 'omg' mixes is still endlessly rewarding - love the way the swooping "uh huh hey" that's so huge and crucial in the ill blu mix is almost just like a knackered sober pause for breath in the naughty; whereas the "i'm bout to have a nervous breakdown" line is centrepiece to the naughty but negligible in the ill blu

It is is similar to the "OMG" remix but I think the way it builds from chopped-up vocals to that none-more-ravey chorus is kinda amazing.

Yeah "It's You" and "Falling" are classics. Naughty's grooves and Miss Fire's voice go so well together.

I'm also a massive massive fan of what I always thought was "Energy" by the woman who sang "You Me She" but according to Marcus's Rinse CD is apparently Nitro & Plague's "Inside Pushing Up Flowers (Naughty Remix)"

The one that goes "Get up get up! Stand to attention, wind down low to the vibes that I mention!"; Get up get up! Quick on the double! He's in the place and I know I'm trouble!"; and "Supreme! The main attraction, like the London Eye!"

Funk Butcher's "OMG" and Sound Boy's "OMG" feel like an entirely different song again BTW (though similar to each other). It's like "OMG" gave so much to being a bottomless toolkit for remixers (like Mary Poppins' travel bag) that it had no energy to be a good song itself.
^^^^ Top shelf lyricism

Argh meant to say that the lines from "Inside Pushing Up Flowers" are top shelf lyricism.

haha don't lie

I'm pretty sure that unnamed Ill Blu epic is called "Meltdown".

yes i believe that's correct.

http://www.zshare.net/audio/78728833c5af4c53/

here's a clip of it for ppl to be unimpressed by!

Wait are you mocking me or lex there.

that is the question.

no ok yes it was lex. i mean i can see how a layperson could shrug listening to either like that out of context, but this is ilm.

hadn't heard this funky butcher mix of 'omg' b4 - appalled to hear him stoop so low as the tried n mistrusted post-wonky 8-bit nostalgisynthtone :(

Yeah it's pretty awful!

See also his rather pointless remix of MAW's "Work" (though that might be better than Lil' Silva's maybe).

Speaking of Lil Silva, I'm really feeling this. Kind of like a slowed down version of his excellent Better Off as Friends Remix..

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gAwMDjfAq1Q

That is totally bizarre and I love it.

can we just lash up file links on here, i was wary of the protocol...?

http://www.mediafire.com/?3b4ub2eucqagqw9

neway fuck it here is that mindcrumpling altered natives samba banger!!

I put up links to stuff I assume can no longer be bought... this is like a standing presumption for uk funky past/present/future I think??

Anyway thank a million!

yeah maybs i got a bit too excited, mods feel free to delete if they want

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DHx06IC1biY

I think that for stuff that's not commercialy available (or very very difficult to come by) I kind of turn a blind eye. Same goes for if it's a constructive point in a discussion (ie Tim's EOY round-ups). That's not official mod policy though.

Any "could you please YSI this?" and links to commercially available tracks purely for the intention of giving them away for free get zapped.

"meltdown" is on this ill blu minimix too - http://www.urb.com/2010/07/23/ill-blu-exclusive-qa-minimix-via-kcrw/ - it's ok!

i think my favourite altered natives track is prob the last on their album, "rage of aquarius", the really acidy one with those "i'm a bad girl" samples, this is lots of fun too - similar bass action.

"i pretty much love them all except "house girls", when i played the youtube i was like...is that it? this is what y'all have been hyping up so much?"

if you dont like house girls you dont really like funky.

haha awes - marcus & bassboy's 'you dirty shitta' now features mc majestic doing his old "silly billy chlamyddi" safe sex lyric on top

wish cooly g would stop singing.

for that reason dont much like her new track up in my head (though it has some nice relaxed jungle techno vibes about it). phat si is the one.

haha awes - marcus & bassboy's 'you dirty shitta' now features mc majestic doing his old "silly billy chlamyddi" safe sex lyric on top

I know exactly what this will sound like but still... when can I hear this.

"up in my head" is cooly doing what cooly does, "phat si" is amazing though.

her voice is almost always flat though.

idk, it just sounds crap to me. like an imitation of vocal samples from sampling cds for producers.

well it's decoration rather than Singing Songs innit, like what cassy does (and miss kittin live)

I would rather hear Cooly G singing everytime without fail, than the bland and infantile attempts at romance that seem to dominate female vocals in funky. I mean, how old are you guys - or is it just some crypto-pedo, voyeuristic pleasure you take in listening to children court each other.

Anyway, exactly what is cool about Cooly's her voice is that she makes it sound like samples.

I would rather hear Cooly G singing everytime without fail, than the bland and infantile attempts at romance that seem to dominate female vocals in funky. I mean, how old are you guys - or is it just some crypto-pedo, voyeuristic pleasure you take in listening to children court each other.

This is a really bad argumentative strategy.

"Anyway, exactly what is cool about Cooly's her voice is that she makes it sound like samples."

except she doesnt.
she just tries to.
its sort of like the roots attempting to sound like their tracks are made from samples, instead of sounding like the band that everyone can plainly hear they are.

@ titchy

You're just wrong!

@ tim

Is that any better ;)

you know what, the main thing i dislike about them, is that she seems so self conscious in trying to generate 'soulfulness' and a certain dreaminess with her singing. more than that, i dont really buy it. shes just a bedroom singer. if it was something where its meant to be rough, i wouldnt care so much. but cos shes trying to convey Real Feeling and do it professionally, im a bit tougher on her. all the tracks people liked of hers originally were instrumental so idk why hyperdub keep releasing these ones.

What's wrong with bedroom singers? At least she has the scruples to not unleash a full vocal on the world, which is more than you can say for some of the vocals in this thread.

I think lots of people really liked 'love dub' as well. I've heard enough people play it out.

Maybe the label likes the tracks. that would be an obvious answer to your conundrum.

I don't have a problem with Cooly G's singing - with a very few exceptions her vocals seem to be the kind of thing that would neither define nor "undo" her tracks really, and focusing on them excessively (whether positively or negatively) looks a bit fetishistic IMO but yr mileage may vary.

But jon the kind of exceptionalist argument you're making here (to borrow a tag from Tom E) totally works against you. I know you think that I hate dubstep et al but consistently coming onto the thread and bashing funky for being funky kinda erodes yr credibility to make pronouncements on the topic. "At least its better than (insert thing I disapprove of)" is both a lame defence and kinda small-minded and moralistic (only about something to which no actual moral code really applies). If Cooly's singing is awesome then you should be able to come up with a positive explanation as to why this is the case rather than simply congratulating her for not being an R&B diva.

FTR Farah and Miss Fire and Katy B are all amazing and blow Cooly's singing out of the water, but that isn't necessarily a rod for Cooly's back given she's a producer first and a singer way way way second.

I have my criticisms of dubstep, sure, but I could very easily put together a mix-tape which extols the virtues of each track for being an example of dubstep qua dubstep. I find it difficult to take seriously any position which appears to consist entirely of "if this is a good example of genre X it's because it avoids the pitfalls which typify genre X."

"I would rather hear Cooly G singing everytime without fail, than the bland and infantile attempts at romance that seem to dominate female vocals in funky. I mean, how old are you guys - or is it just some crypto-pedo, voyeuristic pleasure you take in listening to children court each other."

argument also falls flat in lieu of do you mind which has one of the most adolescent girl next door vocals ever but is also maybe still the best funky song ever (sorry tim, i know you probably have lots of recent tracks you think that about!).

I am interested in this hypothetical mix tape.

Would/could be a mixture of tracks from Horsepower Productions, DJ Abstract, Hatcha, Mark One, Mala/DMZ, Skream, D1, Scuba, Burial, Pinch, Kode 9, Peverelist, Silkie & Quest, 2562, Ramadanman, Martyn, Vaccine, Toasty, Jus Wan, Pangaea, TRG, Geiom, SLT Mob, Shackleton, Forsaken, Kromestar (this is not a blanket endorsement of everything done by all of these artists BTW).

I wouldn't characterise myself as a dubstep "fan", and there's definitely certain, um, choices, it has made as a genre which I would consider to be sub-optimal. But I still think I can get a lot out of a broad swathe of the genre operating on its own terms. Martin has suggested in the past (and i'm paraphrasing here but i think this was his gist) that the fact that i've never really liked Loefah basically means that I don't like dubstep (assuming Loefah = dubstep ground zero in certain ways). But I wouldn't suggest that someone wasn't a funky fan if they disliked Crazy Cousinz but liked stuff by (say) Fuzzy Logick, Devine Collective and Major Notes. Dubstep and funky are both broad enough - and have been for long enough - that you can pick and choose among a variety of strands.

Whereas I think (and I'm reluctant to start this whole argument again but...) talking about a style as if it's only successful when it deviates from the style's "standard" approaches is basically saying "I don't really like this style."

But I could be misreading Jon's position. I've invited him previously to identify any funky he enjoys outside of Cooly/Roska/Scratcha, and talk about what he likes in it.

I really like Cooly G's singing, it works on a bunch of levels for me. focusing on them isnt fetishistic, it's fair as they are one of her unique selling points (otherwise she just makes dark percussive house). Where so many uk funky singers fall down for me is they aspire to be some hyperpolished r&b singer, usually by over embellishing everything badly, and pale in comparison. some of them succeed and when they do its amazing but many dont.

But this is my positive explanation: Cooly by contrast just samples herself and buries in the sample in the mix, it's quite dubby and especially burial approach which is probably why dubsteppers have taken to her and perhaps funky purists see this as a failing of some kind but at least it's an alternative take for the genre.

i also like her london rudeness, in her accent and use of slang. it's a real strength for me and adds identity, makes it local rather than global and adds some feminine pressure.

talking about a style as if it's only successful when it deviates from the style's "standard" approaches is basically saying "I don't really like this style.... "if this is a good example of genre X it's because it avoids the pitfalls which typify genre X."

You may hate this argument but why not avoid pitfalls? everyone has parts of genres they don't care for? you can like a style but see how you could like it more. i'm far more interested in uk funky being uk funky than uk funky trying to be the worst end of r&b.

this whole argument assumes a genre has a "standard". some do and some dont to a lesser degree and most go through a transition from "dont" to "do" as they emerge. so the concept of "deviation" depends on how tightly the "standard" has been put into place at a given time. in this case funky is so broad right now that i think it's fair to say you can like non-standards without implying you dont like funky as a whole surely?

the trackier end of funky has been trumping the vocal end for a while now imo. and i dont even mean the stuff that fact/RA/dubstep people like, im talking what you hear on a marcus/other pirate show.

the trouble with referring to a genre's "standards" is that everyone seems to have different ones (some like the r&b vox, some don't, some like radio MCs, some don't &c &c). hence why this thread constantly devolves into hysterical "that's not funky!!!" policing or unpleasant "if you don't like this you don't like funky!!!" accusations. i mean tim, didn't you write not long ago that part of funky's thrill is that it was a genre in flux and you didn't know where it'd head next?

i don't think any of the specific traits we're talking about are inherently good or bad, it's about what you do with them. the tracks that have caught my ear the most this year pretty much range across the spectrum of funky.

Haha Lex I think you ARE actually posting things that are totally outside funky eg that Kingdom EP and the Benga track (and I think you are doing this deliberately in as a bit of "my genre boundaries are wider than yours" friendly one-upmanship). It's be a bit like posting a load of Stanton Warriors MP3s on a 2-step thread ten years ago.

I mean, surely we all agree that funky is essentially anchored by a particular kind of beat and everything is in flux around that basic rhythmic framework? Ie it can be anything sonically but not rhythmically.

I think the problem with a lot of funky diva vocals is that, to paraphrase Tim from some other thread I've forgotten, there's maybe a bit too much swoon at the expense of the snap. This is why Egypt rules, basically.

i didn't post the kingdom ep!! and wouldn't have posted it here anyway.

I mean, surely we all agree that funky is essentially anchored by a particular kind of beat and everything is in flux around that basic rhythmic framework? Ie it can be anything sonically but not rhythmically.

this doesn't really feel intuitively right, though i can't really think of examples as i'm much more interested in the sonix. i still think the fact that "stupid" and "katy on a mission" have different tempos is negligible compared to the many similarities - sonic, thematic, the similar vocal approaches of roses gabor and katy b to the track.

Yes but Redlight is an outlier anyway, so saying that 'Katy On A Mission' is funky because it bares some similarity to 'Stupid' doesn't hold, it's taking that one extra jump out of the genre. You're using false genre unifiers.

Themes, vocals approaches and bass noises aren't really core elements of funky so you can't use them to draw those sort of connections. There's not really any thread that connects 'Get Low', 'Can You Kiss Me There', 'Holy Ghost' and 'Heads Shoulders Knees & Toes' other than a rhythmic one.