Sea Devils And Die: GeroniMoffat's Doctor Who In The 2010s

Do people really count whether or not the companion is returning next series as a potential spoiler?
Thing is, Aldo obv did, as he was complaining about the BBC doing it. If he thinks it's bad form, then it's bad form to do it here as well, surely?

(Also: aldo, if you're still here, it's not like I'm always talking ex cathedra or something. It's just personal (but not personal, like!)).

SNAPE KILLS AMY

I haven't watched this week's ep yet but am in a neighbourhood cafe to watch brazil-cotedivoire game and am maybe too thrilled that one of the wifi networks that comes up is called Bad Wolf :) (it is locked, of course!)

I mean apart from anything else, spoilers aren't democratic. It doesn't matter how many people think something wasn't a spoiler, if one person does then the rest are wrong.

(also, heh, this is from two years ago - POLL: What constitues a "spoiler"? JimD and aldo disagree. Take sides here! )

yeah but if only one person thinks its a spoiler then they should not read about the show on the internet

By next week, aldo will have found a way to blame the BP oil crisis on Karen Gillan.

Think that one was actually Steven Gerrard and Jamie Carragher.

Honestly, I had no idea about this, and I do avoid Doctor Who story/casting news as much as possible. Considering the last two seasons I had no reason to expect it. I really don't think it's too much to assume that people like to talk about a show as it airs, but not necessarily stay in touch with behind-the-scenes developments, spoilers, casting news, and so on. Just because I like a TV show and I am on the internet doesn't mean I'm going to look for everything. But yeah I don't think Aldo was intentionally trying to ruin our fun, just being a little absent-minded; lesson learned.

I like that they brought Rory back like everyone expected only for him to not be Rory.

I thought that was clever as well. Nice bit of twisting the knife to have Amy remember him just in time for it to turn out that it's not even him, oh, and he's going to try to kill her against his own will. Lovely.

Also Alex Kingston rules the school.

I'm wondering if she might be Moffat's spinoff. Would watch River Song's Torchwood.

picked up elsewhere but neat tip-off re Rory's Autonage: watch that scene where The Doctor pokes Rory in the chest. He sways back and forward, but makes a very plastic-sounding noise as her sways.

This Alex Kingston rules the school.

but not this Would watch River Song's Torchwood.

would rather they kept River's story deliberately vague, then you can imagine all the Han-Solo type shit she gets up to.

^ cheers for Blossom theme tune in my head

Return of Rory was great. When he appeared, the group I was watching with were all so "OMG YAY RORY!!!" that we had to rewind to actually see what he said - the twist that he wasn't even Rory was ace. Otherwise I have little speculation because I'm accepting that I'm only half-way through a two part story, and not at the end of an arc that's just coming together.

(many xposts, JimD, I tried to find that thread earlier...)
And, yeah, <3 Alex Kingston.

Regarding the Sontaran, apparently the chap played by Chris Ryan in this episode was called STARK, while he was STAAL last time round, so he looks the same because he's a clone, not because he's the same guy.

Even setting aside the lol mingmong anatomy of a Cyberman nonsense upthread the idea of one being killed by a Roman sword seemed kind of odd except of course IT DOESN'T FUCKING MATTER. Unless you're the sort of person who watches this solely to pick holes in it, and in fairness there seem to be a lot of them.

I watched this twice, once last night after getting back drunk (where it seemed overwhelming and overcrowded and sort of incomprehensible) and once just now (when it was fantastic). Just so much better than any Rusty final-story cliffhanger since the first series. It was totally obvious from the start that the Doctor was going to end up imprisoned inside the Pandorica, but that didn't stop the end being great.

The "only the Doctor can pilot the Tardis" seemed like a big, big hint being dropped given that River had been flying the thing a scene earlier. My prediction = River is imprisoned because she's killed a future Doctor, her dicking around in time is what's causing the cracks. Because, y'know, the Doctor's quite important with that whole repeatedly saving the universe thing. The aliens are all wrong.

Not sure where Amy fits in at all. Still think it's possible that's, in some way, the real Rory. Given he has all his old memories and everything. Maybe the Pandorica opens several thousand years in the future - ie on Amy's wedding day?

But yeah, this is EXACTLY what I wanted from a Moffatt finale, total sense of mystery keeping you hanging on rather than more THE END OF TIME ITSELF bollocks.

And the big baddie really can't be Davros, as he WANTED to destroy all of time and space.

Add some (more) vowels to this and you have my guess: OMG.

The big baddie - i.e. the silence will fall dude - has surely been playing the Alliance? Waits till the Doctor is out of the TARDIS (and in the clutches of the Alliance) before taking control of it and sending it to the explosion site.

(Though I'm not sure why he/it sends River to Amy's House first for her to uncover the plot. Great scene though.)

I'm starting to think Aldo's suggestion upthread - that we're not actually going to get a big bad reveal next week, it'll be held over to season 6 - isn't a bad one: a bit of longer-term planning wouldn't hurt the series at all.

That was kind of batshit, huh? Not sure it all made sense, but it certainly was enjoyable.

would rather they kept River's story deliberately vague, then you can imagine all the Han-Solo type shit she gets up to.

I agree. Jack stopped being an interesting character once he ended up on Torchwood and we learned his boring emo backstory.

Speaking of Jack, kind of lol'ed when Blue Jabba said that he lifted the time vortex off a handsome time traveler. (I've never seen Torchwood, so don't know if Jack's been keeping it Luke Skywalkery.)

picked up elsewhere but neat tip-off re Rory's Autonage: watch that scene where The Doctor pokes Rory in the chest. He sways back and forward, but makes a very plastic-sounding noise as her sways.

Plastic, or leather?

I don't know, this episode didn't really quite make it for me -- maybe because the Doctor seemed a step behind everything else in the story?

Would be v. pleased if there was no reveal of the chief baddie and he was the arch nemesis next season.

^ yes yes yes

I AM NOT COMPLAINING ABOUT SPOILERS, I AM COMPLAINING ABOUT BAD JOURNALISTIC STANDARDS AT THE BEEB. Delete what you like upthread. I am also assuming this means none of you ever watch the 'Next time' section in multi-part episodes

Yeah, I don’t.

(which always undoes the cliffhanger) or will be watching the trailers for The Big Bang on Monday and Tuesday in case it resolves something ahead of the episode.

WTF is The Big Bang? A British chat show? As it is already Monday afternoon, I'm v unlikely to fly to the UK in time to catch a 30-second promo for something on telly tomorrow, yeah.

(Ta for Next Doctor recap. It definitely makes no sense in terms of continuity with what’s actually been shown onscreen though, lol rtd)

FWIW if certain info appears on Wiki or on a broadcaster's website, it's pretty much impossible to cocoon ILX from comments relating to that.

Bullshit.

I like that they brought Rory back like everyone expected only for him to not be Rory.

Yes!

Plastic, or leather?

could be the hollowish breastplate being tapped? though that's plastic pretending to be metal, fair enough

I absolutely loved that episode, but I do kind of wonder why, having got the Doctor into a metal cube, they can't just pinch off the air hose and let him suffocate in there, or set the Pandorica to liquify or whatever. Maybe they will in the next episode.

WTF is The Big Bang? A British chat show?

***********BIG HUGE FUCKING SPOILER ALERT**************

It's a kind of sausage

Why didn't the code tag keep those multiple carriage returns in?

i believe that's deliberate, to stop people making threads unreadable with lots of whitespace.

we could do with a spoiler tag though that renders things in white on white, or something.

Spoiler removed anyway just in case.

It wasn't really a big huge spoiler tbh.

re why not just kill him - I'd speculate because a) they assume he'd regenerate and b) they don't know exactly what his link to the TARDIS is: maybe killing him will make it self-destruct? Their knowledge of the TARDIS isn't perfect: they think only the Doctor can fly it, after all.

How did the Tardis go from 0 to about-to-destroy-the-universe without him noticing?

This Doctor doesn't notice anything until it's very very nearly too late - it's sort of his thing.

I don't know, this episode didn't really quite make it for me -- maybe because the Doctor seemed a step behind everything else in the story?

See, that's why I liked it. Him not really knowing what was going on made it feel like there was more at stake. I really liked the ending to this one, the villains throwing the Doctor into the Pandorica reminded me a little bit of the ending to the Wicker Man (the good one, not the one with Nic Cage punching out women and being molested by bees).

Just watching The Beast Below again. Liz X is a fantastic character! I would like to see more stories with her in please.

Can't remember if anyone brought up the Cities in Flight similarities first time round.

Also I think the sinister fella with the glasses is The Demon Headmaster.

Weird. I just got finished watching the very same and the Guy Explaining It All To The Voters in the voting booth is a total cipher for David Kelly. I love Sophie Okenedo, she's a friend of an ex of mine and as we got hammered at a party one night a few years ago, she regaled me with stories of being a teenage Royal Court participant (and a few others) while effortlessly taking the piss out of my ex. So, clearly rocks on the screen and off.

Also, yes: Demon Headmaster guy was in this.

Definitely rocks on screen. I don't think she's ever been sexier than in this.

Just sayin', if any of you have the chance to go out on the lash with her, do it. WKIW again.

http://media.nowpublic.net/images//5c/4/5c4fe26a9d28bc5dccd1d64b00c7858a.jpg

HE'S READY

o shit I missed the first 20 minutes. Guess I should just wait for iplayer and ignore this thread.

Nice. Though I want to stick a tuning fork up Murray Gold's arse.

Was a bit Doctor Who's Excellent Adventure, but lolz galore and nicely tied up some stuff.

cant wait for xmas

so FUN!

(the only thing that threw me was assuming that taking river out of the exploding tardis would have an effect on its explosion, given that in the previous episode he'd been all 'ah but the tardis shuts down with no-one in it!' but... apparently not. mind you, it was exploding.)

It did accelerate once she was out.

idk if i liked this...enough :/

too many paradoxy solutions to stuff no? was hoping moffat would do something cleverer than have the doctor tell rory to release him from the pandorica having been released from the pandorica by rory in order to do so. and amy remembering the doctor allowing him to come back into existence? er, isn't that quite weak? still quite confused by it all tho so may be missing something.

Yes, the Amy remembers and thereby solves everything line was a bit pat. Though maybe next series will explain more why she is, as the Doctor keeps saying, "special" and we might get to the bottom of it. Thought the first half was very good - a funny and clever set of self-resolving logic puzzles, kind of mirroring the Pandorica itself. Inevitably, there are the silly holes - like if all the exhibits in the museum were disappearing, why not the museum itself? If everything in the sky had disappeared, why not the moon? How come the Tardis exploding happened to do so in exact synchronisation with what would have been the times for daylight on earth? Had the earth started orbiting round the Tardis? Eh? Etc etc. But it was great teatime telly.

Also, Pandorica opened by Rory with sonic screwdriver - what about the zillion levels of encryption hoo-haa they were on about last week?

Can the doctor starve to death? Does he keep regenerating then starving again?

Blueski otm about how the whole escape got started, too.