Tootsie: Classic or Dud?

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A beautifully surreal detour...To answer your original question, an absolute classic. I think my two favorite "mainstream" films (whatever that means) of the past 30 years--certainly my favorite comedies--are Tootsie and Broadcast News. I never tire of either. George Gaynes, Coleman, Teri Garr, they're all fantastic. I'm laughing just thinking of the way Garr says "Will I ever see you again?" after she and Hoffmann have sex.

clemenza, Wednesday, 16 June 2010 23:49 (4 years ago) Permalink

"Sex changes things" (looks curiously at her breasts under the cover).

Filmmaker, Author, Radio Host Stephen Baldwin (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Wednesday, 16 June 2010 23:54 (4 years ago) Permalink

I still think that first half hour or so has the most accurate depiction of struggling actors/writers/whatever in a big city i've ever seen; doing shitty jobs, going to reads, having parties, getting nowhere and waiting for a break and suchlike. Going back to it a few years ago i realised i'd forgotten all that section because of the farce/ romance/ etc stuff that comes after.

piscesx, Thursday, 17 June 2010 00:22 (4 years ago) Permalink

it's so distilled removes some of the verisimilitude that would help you buy into the situation

Jesus God.

kind of shrill and very self-righteous (Dr Morbius), Thursday, 17 June 2010 00:26 (4 years ago) Permalink

9 months pass...

for some reason i was convinced for years that ed o'neill was in this movie

cum dude (Princess TamTam), Thursday, 7 April 2011 18:53 (3 years ago) Permalink

2 months pass...

better before dorothy comes along?

It's a pretty creepy stunt for everyone to just get over in the last five mins, i may be asking too much.

Darranzhi MacKhakhala (darraghmac), Monday, 4 July 2011 21:59 (3 years ago) Permalink

The writing and acting are so sharp that the Dorothy stuff works on its own: huffy soap actress falls for young costar.

The Edge of Gloryhole (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Monday, 4 July 2011 22:18 (3 years ago) Permalink

maybe, but i agree with upthread comment- traded punchiness for sentimentality with the emergence of the 'love story' angle.

Teri Garr and Pollock were great in their roles, picked it up whenever they appeared

Darranzhi MacKhakhala (darraghmac), Monday, 4 July 2011 22:42 (3 years ago) Permalink

ha that's not to say the leads let it down, obviously.

Darranzhi MacKhakhala (darraghmac), Monday, 4 July 2011 22:44 (3 years ago) Permalink

I constantly go around saying, "This is a coast too, George. New York is a coast."

The Edge of Gloryhole (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Monday, 4 July 2011 22:50 (3 years ago) Permalink

yeah the throwaways were a cut above alright

Darranzhi MacKhakhala (darraghmac), Monday, 4 July 2011 23:01 (3 years ago) Permalink

8 months pass...

The Les-Dorothy exchanges underrated.

DURNING: Another drink?

DOROTHY: No -- I have to keep my wits about me tonight.

Exile in lolville (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Saturday, 24 March 2012 13:15 (2 years ago) Permalink

1 month passes...

Man he sure is a jerk to Sandy!

Dale, dale, dale (Abbbottt), Sunday, 6 May 2012 19:56 (2 years ago) Permalink

I liked this from an interview w/Terri Garr:

Tootsie (1982)—"Sandy Lester"

TG: I just saw that again recently. I hadn't seen it in twentysomething years. And it's the same thing! Pretty, nice girls being taken advantage of by slimy men. They put a man in a dress, and he's supposed to know what it feels like to be a woman. But of course he doesn't. I think what Dustin [Hoffman] says is, "I realize now how important it is for a woman to be pretty. And I wasn't pretty." God! That's all you realized? Jesus Christ. Oh well. Don't quote me. Actually, quote me.

AVC: You play this very neurotic character who's full of self-loathing, who's desperate for attention, yet somehow, she's sweet and likeable. Was all that indicated in the script, or was that something you brought to the role?

TG: I think that's something that I was or am. Likeable? I guess, yeah. But neurotic, yes. It was right at that time in history when feminism was rearing its ugly head, so I read all these books like The Second Sex, and that's where I got that line, "I know I'm responsible for my own orgasm." [Laughs.] I read that sentence and I thought, "What does that mean?" I didn't even know. I thought that [Sandy] was caught between trying to have a career and trying to be a sexual woman, and it just doesn't work. At least it didn't in that movie, because it was made by sexist men. I can say that now, because Sydney [Pollack] isn't with us anymore. [Laughs.] But he was a fine director.

AVC: But you thought he was sexist?

TG: Oh, yeah! I think so. He just wanted the beautiful, blond, cute, shiksa girls to be nice and shut the fuck up! [Laughs.] God, I'm bad. But that's what he wanted. And that's what the world wants, I think. I'm bitter. Bitter!

Dale, dale, dale (Abbbottt), Sunday, 6 May 2012 19:58 (2 years ago) Permalink

I mean Sandy's a real dipdy-doo in the movie, begging for Seconal after a bad party, but it kinda made me mad that the script lets Hoffman be the only woman in the movie with her wits about her. I liked the movie, it's funny, blah blah my feminist this 1983 just called.

Dale, dale, dale (Abbbottt), Sunday, 6 May 2012 20:00 (2 years ago) Permalink

Also Dustin Hoffman was a hot dude back in the day! Straw DOgs kinda made me forget that bcz of how loathsome he was in it.

Dale, dale, dale (Abbbottt), Sunday, 6 May 2012 20:01 (2 years ago) Permalink

Michael does treat Sandy shabbily but it's to the script and Garr's credit that she's awesome anyway.

Exile in lolville (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Sunday, 6 May 2012 20:08 (2 years ago) Permalink

Hilarious interview, by the way. She's otm about Lange getting nominated in the wrong category.

Exile in lolville (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Sunday, 6 May 2012 20:11 (2 years ago) Permalink

"What a good idea, a socket for a plug."

Dale, dale, dale (Abbbottt), Monday, 7 May 2012 03:21 (2 years ago) Permalink

xpost yeah that was unfair, but tptb felt that Lange was due for an award, and knew that Streep was a shoo-in for Best Actress, so...

nostalgia: this was the last movie our family (parents, 10yo sister and myself) all went out and saw together. my sister was particularly delighted with Murray's "You slut!" and the cattle-prod line.

Race Against Rockism (Myonga Vön Bontee), Monday, 7 May 2012 09:09 (2 years ago) Permalink

Teri Garr on fire all through that interview! She was a doll on "Sonny & Cher" too, even w/ the often crappy writing.

World Congress of Itch (Dr Morbius), Monday, 7 May 2012 15:54 (2 years ago) Permalink

1 year passes...

this is kind of amazing:

some dude, Sunday, 7 July 2013 20:05 (1 year ago) Permalink

the Terri Garr quote a few posts up seems like kind of a retort to possibly when Hoffman said something similar in simpler terms (or maybe she's simplifying/paraphrasing), but still, I like how he puts it there.

some dude, Sunday, 7 July 2013 20:08 (1 year ago) Permalink

whoa! I wasn't expecting that last line.

A deeper shade of lol (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Sunday, 7 July 2013 20:20 (1 year ago) Permalink

I've expressed my love for the film many times. That clip's a little hard to watch in its Bobby Bittmanesque "As a comic, Sammy, in all seriousness"...I'm sure Hoffman's quite sincere in what he says, which is maybe part of why the film's so good: he was making one movie while everybody else worked around him making another.

clemenza, Sunday, 7 July 2013 20:25 (1 year ago) Permalink

wow hoffamn rocks there!

i lost my shoes on acid (jed_), Sunday, 7 July 2013 21:18 (1 year ago) Permalink

I remember seeing that clip when the AFI ran their list show. I think he added something like "I know it's a comedy, but comedy is serious business."

the evening dj there (Eric H.), Sunday, 7 July 2013 21:32 (1 year ago) Permalink

I saw this film once, during its initial release, in a theater. Not since then. My only impression of it was that it was moderately funny, but not hilarious, and the so-called pro-feminist message in it was so watered down, so shallow, so reductionist, that it seemed no different than any other over-hyped mainstream Hollywood movie. But at the time I still had a few intellectual bones in my body. Maybe today I'd laugh like a jackass.

Aimless, Monday, 8 July 2013 04:24 (1 year ago) Permalink

tbh i've never even watched this movie, i just liked that DH interview

some dude, Monday, 8 July 2013 10:49 (1 year ago) Permalink

movie is great. DH clip is amazing, too.

Puff Daddy, whoever the fuck you are. I am dissapoint. (stevie), Monday, 8 July 2013 10:58 (1 year ago) Permalink

But at the time I still had a few intellectual bones in my body. Maybe today I'd laugh like a jackass.

haha this shouldn't be a binary

A deeper shade of lol (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Monday, 8 July 2013 11:02 (1 year ago) Permalink

2 months pass...

"What a good idea, a socket for a plug."

― Dale, dale, dale (Abbbottt), Sunday, May 6, 2012 11:21 PM

first I think it's time I kick a little verse! (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Saturday, 21 September 2013 02:25 (1 year ago) Permalink

10 months pass...

You are exactly why people root for the apes (Eric H.), Friday, 15 August 2014 20:27 (4 months ago) Permalink

this movie is a difficult-to-take mix of reactionary and self-congratulatory, even though it's obvious from the clip above that hoffman's heart, at least, was in the right place. but it's hard to knock the craft with which it was made, by all concerned. for whatever that's worth (less than i'd sometimes like to admit).

I dunno. (amateurist), Saturday, 16 August 2014 10:49 (4 months ago) Permalink

The last scene with Lange was the only one that played self-congratulatory. The other moments of revelation Hoffman and Pollack (literally -- as actors) undercut.

guess that bundt gettin eaten (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Saturday, 16 August 2014 11:35 (4 months ago) Permalink

Also: it's obvious to me that Michael Dorsey and Julie have no chemistry; the last scene played like a gay man becoming buddies with a woman, whereas Dorothy and Julie connected immediately, which Julie acknowledges ("I miss Dorothy").

guess that bundt gettin eaten (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Saturday, 16 August 2014 11:37 (4 months ago) Permalink

Hoffman's performance when he meets up with Charles Durning in the bar near the end as Michael.. an acting masterclass right there. i think if *that* scene doesn't work then the whole thing would be wrecked but it's amazing.

piscesx, Saturday, 16 August 2014 12:31 (4 months ago) Permalink

BR of this should be good! I find the story of the scriptwriting meltdown behind this pretty fascinating. Also in beautiful 4k so Dustin Hoffman can mourn the true depths of Dorothy's pores.

when you call my name it's like a prickly pear (Crabbits), Saturday, 16 August 2014 17:18 (4 months ago) Permalink

I wish I could find the sketchbook from the time when I got really obsessed with trying to draw Dorothy.

when you call my name it's like a prickly pear (Crabbits), Saturday, 16 August 2014 17:22 (4 months ago) Permalink

"I wish Dorothy were prettier."

guess that bundt gettin eaten (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Saturday, 16 August 2014 17:24 (4 months ago) Permalink

"How do you feel about Cleveland?"

You are exactly why people root for the apes (Eric H.), Saturday, 16 August 2014 17:27 (4 months ago) Permalink

"I owe myself a quarter."

guess that bundt gettin eaten (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Saturday, 16 August 2014 17:30 (4 months ago) Permalink

I liked this movie best at a sneak screening the week before it came out

son of a lewd monk (Dr Morbius), Saturday, 16 August 2014 17:58 (4 months ago) Permalink

true cred right there

I dunno. (amateurist), Saturday, 16 August 2014 19:14 (4 months ago) Permalink

3 months pass...

Criterion Blu-Ray out next week:

http://www.blu-ray.com/movies/Tootsie-Blu-ray/44344/#Review

guess that bundt gettin eaten (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Thursday, 11 December 2014 13:07 (1 week ago) Permalink

"*with* the necktie?"

piscesx, Thursday, 11 December 2014 14:39 (1 week ago) Permalink


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