Santigold

I don't consider myself an indie liker, and I think she's pretty good.

yeah even i like her! only indie music of any worth this year for sure

how could you forget your beloved Elbow?

i half-liked one song by them in like 2001

man santogold is indie in the loosest sense of the term

~you~ like los camesinos AND bloc party

<3 them

all im saying is santogold is indie in the internet sense of the term cuz she gets blogged next to the hold steady and mgmt but then again so do justice and i don't think a anyone is jumping to call them indie

not that any of that has anything to do with liking her (she's aaaaight-- i actually think the best song is the one with spank rock wtf) but i wouldn't go around touting this as "good" indie music just cuz she is on downtown records

I stayed away from this record for a while because I thought it was like Sublime or something (her name reminds me of "Santeria"), but I picked it up and it's badass. I can see why you'd think it's indie; the first track sounds like Interpol, but the record is all over the place stylistically.[/ obvious]

I'd call her art pop or something made-up like that.

ART POP?!?!?!?!

ok i am gonna give this a listen and then i am going to WEEP at you when it turns out to be COMPLETELY FUCKING COMMERCIAL

idk if im into getting into this with you louis, but why can't the two intersect

i totally call justice indie!

i call santogold indie b/c sonically that's what she is. bit of dub and so on thrown in there but it's essentially straight-up guitar indie music. which is fine, i love how cleanly produced everything is, and her voice really works.

art pop would work as well but then you'd just get people neyr-nyering about how "art pop" = indie! and they'd have a point

anyway i'm going to listen to this on the way to the pub now. or danity kane.

Hmm. IMO, anything that can conscionably append the 'art-' prefix to its method has to actually attempt an original artistic creation. Listening to 'Lights Out', I'm not getting a sense that this is being done as anything other than an exercise in MEGABUCKS. Sorry. It's nice, but it isn't artistic, or interesting.

Oh god, I'm addressing this to probably the last people on earth I'd want to be. Sorry, forget I ever posted here, go back unchallenged to your heroes.

damn lou you are on some 13 year old slipknot fan levels of "NO GOOD ART CAN TRY TO BE SUCCESSFUL" delusion

what a wally. altho re "commercial" it's done surprisingly well considering (#26 in the album chart, single one place lower). must be the indie.

And you are on some preschool point-missing levels of "WHEN SOMEONE SAYS THAT SOMETHING SOUNDS COMMERCIAL RATHER THAN ARTISTIC, HE IS NOT SAYING THAT A DIFFERENT SONG COULD FAIL MISERABLY IN THE CHARTS BECAUSE IT HAS ARTISTIC MERIT" xpost

Obviously I got carried away there and added a "NOT" in the middle. The above quote, then, is my own stance.

IMO, anything that can conscionably append the 'art-' prefix to its method has to actually attempt an original artistic creation.

This is easily the dumbest thing you have ever said.

Think what you're saying there Dan.

(Dumb from the standpoint is that you are criticizing this as if Santogold is marketing herself this way; she's not, you're reacting negatively to someone else's impression of her work and then blaming her for it.)

Hmm. IMO, anything that can conscionably append the 'art-' prefix to its method has to actually attempt an original artistic creation

you imply here that anything that aims to be commercially successful cannot be "art" or at least use the "art-" prefix

Well, I don't know what I'm trying to say. I disapprove of ANY use of "art-" as a musical prefix. But as a short-cut, I think it should only apply to things that attempt originality rather than facsimile.

I'm fucked off with this conversation now, and I'm fucked off with ILM.

Well good for you.

I'm in a fucking bad mood, I'd have never invaded this thread if I wasn't generally angry with more or less everything in my path. Sorry everyone.

When I mentioned "indie", what I meant is that I put artists like Santogold, or Justice, or Crystal Castles, or Hot Chip, or what have you, under the rough label of "indie disco" or "indie dance". Even when their music has nominally the same elements as "proper" (i.e. non-indie) dance music, there's something nervous and wiry and high-pitched and unfunky about them, and they often lack the life-affirming, bass-heavy, soulful and joyful qualities of dance music rooted in funk and disco and house. I think this is the reason indie and rock fans seem to like this sort of music and I often don't, even if it doesn't have any obvious "rock" elements like electric guitars.

LOOK OK FUCK GENRE TAGS

FUCK THEM

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b82/fast1727/CalvinHobbsCalmDown.jpg

Walking by myself down avenues that reek of time to kill

It seems like many of these indie dance acts need to have this edgy/brainy quality in their music to sell it to the intellectual type of indie fans, who might have diffculties dealing with the full-on mindless/physical abandon of proper dance music.

(xxx-post)

hey lets have an argument about if something is indie or not

It seems like many of these indie dance acts need to have this edgy/brainy quality in their music to sell it to the intellectual type of indie fans, who might have diffculties dealing with the full-on mindless/physical abandon of proper dance music.

or maybe they just love both strains equally so naturally want to incorporate elements and influences of both into their sound, gaining and losing in the process. it doesn't mean shit that it's not as funky as James Brown or as housey as Todd Terry as a result.

i love how cleanly produced everything is

this is a potential nightmare (for me) but a bit of expansion on this might be interesting. what is meant by clean? is it just everything in it's place according to your understanding/preferences? it's quite easy to imagine Santogold in a 'lo fi' mode or with a 'messier' sound altho i'm not entirely sure what that would translate as now (more going on within each track/higher density + less space? more chaotic triggering? more abrasive noise/fx?)

or maybe they just love both strains equally so naturally want to incorporate elements and influences of both into their sound, gaining and losing in the process. it doesn't mean shit that it's not as funky as James Brown or as housey as Todd Terry as a result.

Well, it means they lose the interest of people like me, who don't much care for the "indie sound", but on the other hand win those people who don't much care for "proper" dance. I know several people for whom this is basically the only type of of dance music they'll listen to. Not that there's anything wrong with it, of course indie kids can have their own dance if they want to.

Well, it means they lose the interest of people like me, who don't much care for the "indie sound", but on the other hand win those people who don't much care for "proper" dance.

these 'disregard an entire genre/sound/whatever' people are weirdos so good riddance imho

You mean there aren't any genres you'd disregard as a whole? Like death metal? Or polka? Or MOR? Or gabba? I think people who like everything, and for whom there isn't any genre or sound they'd dislike are quite rare among us.

Anyway, I think one of the core audiences of "indie dance" is exactly the sort of people who'd disregard a genre/sound - in this case, "proper" dance - as a whole, and are only willing to accept in an indiefied form.

Like death metal? Or polka? Or MOR? Or gabba?

all of these are pretty dope tuomas stfu

i disregard rave music

i am struggling with death metal tho i must admit.

But like I said, there's nothing wrong with it as such. I'm equally intolerant in my wholesome disregard for indie as a genre and sound. You gotta have aesthetic preferences in the endless land of music.

(xxx-post)

Like death metal? Or polka? Or MOR? Or gabba?

all of these are pretty dope tuomas stfu

I didn't mean their not dope, but lots of music fans dismiss them as whole genres, and I don't see anything wrong with that.

you (intentionally) picked very marginalised genres for your counter-argument anyway.

I don't think death metal is that much more marginalized than indie, at least not in Finland it is.

*crowd goes wild*

For fuck's sake.

hey lets have an argument about if something is indie or not

-- and what, Tuesday, 15 July 2008 18:15 (25 minutes ago) Bookmark Link

^we should have done this instead

I can see why this album is slightly difficult to place but yikes.

http://img155.imageshack.us/img155/2589/458334849cc2b5293c2bim2.gif

Of course indie is more popular than death metal in Britain, its home country, but if you go to places like Germany or Spain, I'm sure you'll find more Slayer than Smiths fans there.