"this is intentional"
Now if only she'd drop off the indie stuff and embrace Leila K style dance full on, I might actually fall in love with her.
― Tuomas, Tuesday, 15 July 2008 13:41 (fifteen years ago) link
Her indie stuff is actually fun to listen to, though.
― HI DERE, Tuesday, 15 July 2008 14:10 (fifteen years ago) link
I guess it is if you like indie, yeah.
― Tuomas, Tuesday, 15 July 2008 14:45 (fifteen years ago) link
evidently i went to school with this woman.
― amateurist, Tuesday, 15 July 2008 15:20 (fifteen years ago) link
I don't consider myself an indie liker, and I think she's pretty good.
― chap, Tuesday, 15 July 2008 16:28 (fifteen years ago) link
yeah even i like her! only indie music of any worth this year for sure
― lex pretend, Tuesday, 15 July 2008 16:30 (fifteen years ago) link
how could you forget your beloved Elbow?
― blueski, Tuesday, 15 July 2008 16:37 (fifteen years ago) link
i half-liked one song by them in like 2001
― lex pretend, Tuesday, 15 July 2008 16:38 (fifteen years ago) link
man santogold is indie in the loosest sense of the term
― J0rdan S., Tuesday, 15 July 2008 16:39 (fifteen years ago) link
~you~ like los camesinos AND bloc party
― lex pretend, Tuesday, 15 July 2008 16:41 (fifteen years ago) link
<3 them
all im saying is santogold is indie in the internet sense of the term cuz she gets blogged next to the hold steady and mgmt but then again so do justice and i don't think a anyone is jumping to call them indie
― J0rdan S., Tuesday, 15 July 2008 16:43 (fifteen years ago) link
not that any of that has anything to do with liking her (she's aaaaight-- i actually think the best song is the one with spank rock wtf) but i wouldn't go around touting this as "good" indie music just cuz she is on downtown records
― J0rdan S., Tuesday, 15 July 2008 16:44 (fifteen years ago) link
I stayed away from this record for a while because I thought it was like Sublime or something (her name reminds me of "Santeria"), but I picked it up and it's badass. I can see why you'd think it's indie; the first track sounds like Interpol, but the record is all over the place stylistically.[/ obvious]
― Euler, Tuesday, 15 July 2008 16:45 (fifteen years ago) link
I'd call her art pop or something made-up like that.
― chap, Tuesday, 15 July 2008 16:45 (fifteen years ago) link
ART POP?!?!?!?!
ok i am gonna give this a listen and then i am going to WEEP at you when it turns out to be COMPLETELY FUCKING COMMERCIAL
― Just got offed, Tuesday, 15 July 2008 16:46 (fifteen years ago) link
idk if im into getting into this with you louis, but why can't the two intersect
― J0rdan S., Tuesday, 15 July 2008 16:47 (fifteen years ago) link
i totally call justice indie!
i call santogold indie b/c sonically that's what she is. bit of dub and so on thrown in there but it's essentially straight-up guitar indie music. which is fine, i love how cleanly produced everything is, and her voice really works.
art pop would work as well but then you'd just get people neyr-nyering about how "art pop" = indie! and they'd have a point
anyway i'm going to listen to this on the way to the pub now. or danity kane.
― lex pretend, Tuesday, 15 July 2008 16:47 (fifteen years ago) link
Hmm. IMO, anything that can conscionably append the 'art-' prefix to its method has to actually attempt an original artistic creation. Listening to 'Lights Out', I'm not getting a sense that this is being done as anything other than an exercise in MEGABUCKS. Sorry. It's nice, but it isn't artistic, or interesting.
― Just got offed, Tuesday, 15 July 2008 16:51 (fifteen years ago) link
Oh god, I'm addressing this to probably the last people on earth I'd want to be. Sorry, forget I ever posted here, go back unchallenged to your heroes.
― Just got offed, Tuesday, 15 July 2008 16:52 (fifteen years ago) link
damn lou you are on some 13 year old slipknot fan levels of "NO GOOD ART CAN TRY TO BE SUCCESSFUL" delusion
― J0rdan S., Tuesday, 15 July 2008 16:54 (fifteen years ago) link
what a wally. altho re "commercial" it's done surprisingly well considering (#26 in the album chart, single one place lower). must be the indie.
― blueski, Tuesday, 15 July 2008 16:57 (fifteen years ago) link
And you are on some preschool point-missing levels of "WHEN SOMEONE SAYS THAT SOMETHING SOUNDS COMMERCIAL RATHER THAN ARTISTIC, HE IS NOT SAYING THAT A DIFFERENT SONG COULD FAIL MISERABLY IN THE CHARTS BECAUSE IT HAS ARTISTIC MERIT" xpost
― Just got offed, Tuesday, 15 July 2008 16:58 (fifteen years ago) link
Obviously I got carried away there and added a "NOT" in the middle. The above quote, then, is my own stance.
― Just got offed, Tuesday, 15 July 2008 16:59 (fifteen years ago) link
IMO, anything that can conscionably append the 'art-' prefix to its method has to actually attempt an original artistic creation.
This is easily the dumbest thing you have ever said.
― HI DERE, Tuesday, 15 July 2008 17:00 (fifteen years ago) link
Think what you're saying there Dan.
― The stickman from the hilarious "xkcd" comics, Tuesday, 15 July 2008 17:01 (fifteen years ago) link
(Dumb from the standpoint is that you are criticizing this as if Santogold is marketing herself this way; she's not, you're reacting negatively to someone else's impression of her work and then blaming her for it.)
― HI DERE, Tuesday, 15 July 2008 17:01 (fifteen years ago) link
Hmm. IMO, anything that can conscionably append the 'art-' prefix to its method has to actually attempt an original artistic creation
you imply here that anything that aims to be commercially successful cannot be "art" or at least use the "art-" prefix
― J0rdan S., Tuesday, 15 July 2008 17:02 (fifteen years ago) link
Well, I don't know what I'm trying to say. I disapprove of ANY use of "art-" as a musical prefix. But as a short-cut, I think it should only apply to things that attempt originality rather than facsimile.
I'm fucked off with this conversation now, and I'm fucked off with ILM.
― Just got offed, Tuesday, 15 July 2008 17:03 (fifteen years ago) link
Well good for you.
― HI DERE, Tuesday, 15 July 2008 17:05 (fifteen years ago) link
I'm in a fucking bad mood, I'd have never invaded this thread if I wasn't generally angry with more or less everything in my path. Sorry everyone.
― Just got offed, Tuesday, 15 July 2008 17:06 (fifteen years ago) link
When I mentioned "indie", what I meant is that I put artists like Santogold, or Justice, or Crystal Castles, or Hot Chip, or what have you, under the rough label of "indie disco" or "indie dance". Even when their music has nominally the same elements as "proper" (i.e. non-indie) dance music, there's something nervous and wiry and high-pitched and unfunky about them, and they often lack the life-affirming, bass-heavy, soulful and joyful qualities of dance music rooted in funk and disco and house. I think this is the reason indie and rock fans seem to like this sort of music and I often don't, even if it doesn't have any obvious "rock" elements like electric guitars.
― Tuomas, Tuesday, 15 July 2008 17:07 (fifteen years ago) link
LOOK OK FUCK GENRE TAGS
FUCK THEM
― Just got offed, Tuesday, 15 July 2008 17:09 (fifteen years ago) link
http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b82/fast1727/CalvinHobbsCalmDown.jpg
― The stickman from the hilarious "xkcd" comics, Tuesday, 15 July 2008 17:11 (fifteen years ago) link
Walking by myself down avenues that reek of time to kill
― Euler, Tuesday, 15 July 2008 17:13 (fifteen years ago) link
It seems like many of these indie dance acts need to have this edgy/brainy quality in their music to sell it to the intellectual type of indie fans, who might have diffculties dealing with the full-on mindless/physical abandon of proper dance music.
― Tuomas, Tuesday, 15 July 2008 17:13 (fifteen years ago) link
(xxx-post)
hey lets have an argument about if something is indie or not
― and what, Tuesday, 15 July 2008 17:15 (fifteen years ago) link
or maybe they just love both strains equally so naturally want to incorporate elements and influences of both into their sound, gaining and losing in the process. it doesn't mean shit that it's not as funky as James Brown or as housey as Todd Terry as a result.
i love how cleanly produced everything is
this is a potential nightmare (for me) but a bit of expansion on this might be interesting. what is meant by clean? is it just everything in it's place according to your understanding/preferences? it's quite easy to imagine Santogold in a 'lo fi' mode or with a 'messier' sound altho i'm not entirely sure what that would translate as now (more going on within each track/higher density + less space? more chaotic triggering? more abrasive noise/fx?)
― blueski, Tuesday, 15 July 2008 17:15 (fifteen years ago) link
Well, it means they lose the interest of people like me, who don't much care for the "indie sound", but on the other hand win those people who don't much care for "proper" dance. I know several people for whom this is basically the only type of of dance music they'll listen to. Not that there's anything wrong with it, of course indie kids can have their own dance if they want to.
― Tuomas, Tuesday, 15 July 2008 17:21 (fifteen years ago) link
Well, it means they lose the interest of people like me, who don't much care for the "indie sound", but on the other hand win those people who don't much care for "proper" dance.
these 'disregard an entire genre/sound/whatever' people are weirdos so good riddance imho
― blueski, Tuesday, 15 July 2008 17:22 (fifteen years ago) link
You mean there aren't any genres you'd disregard as a whole? Like death metal? Or polka? Or MOR? Or gabba? I think people who like everything, and for whom there isn't any genre or sound they'd dislike are quite rare among us.
― Tuomas, Tuesday, 15 July 2008 17:27 (fifteen years ago) link
Anyway, I think one of the core audiences of "indie dance" is exactly the sort of people who'd disregard a genre/sound - in this case, "proper" dance - as a whole, and are only willing to accept in an indiefied form.
― Tuomas, Tuesday, 15 July 2008 17:31 (fifteen years ago) link
Like death metal? Or polka? Or MOR? Or gabba?
all of these are pretty dope tuomas stfu
― and what, Tuesday, 15 July 2008 17:31 (fifteen years ago) link
i disregard rave music
― J0rdan S., Tuesday, 15 July 2008 17:33 (fifteen years ago) link
i am struggling with death metal tho i must admit.
― blueski, Tuesday, 15 July 2008 17:33 (fifteen years ago) link
But like I said, there's nothing wrong with it as such. I'm equally intolerant in my wholesome disregard for indie as a genre and sound. You gotta have aesthetic preferences in the endless land of music.
I didn't mean their not dope, but lots of music fans dismiss them as whole genres, and I don't see anything wrong with that.
― Tuomas, Tuesday, 15 July 2008 17:34 (fifteen years ago) link
you (intentionally) picked very marginalised genres for your counter-argument anyway.
― blueski, Tuesday, 15 July 2008 17:36 (fifteen years ago) link
I don't think death metal is that much more marginalized than indie, at least not in Finland it is.
― Tuomas, Tuesday, 15 July 2008 17:37 (fifteen years ago) link
*crowd goes wild*
― blueski, Tuesday, 15 July 2008 17:37 (fifteen years ago) link
For fuck's sake.
― The stickman from the hilarious "xkcd" comics, Tuesday, 15 July 2008 17:41 (fifteen years ago) link