Ned, let's talk about your 136 Albums of the 90s.

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I think it's a good list, strict caucasian-ness aside. There are lots of records I think are on it as they should be, and relatively few I'd say shouldn't. (Few enough I'd say I might be short-shrifting them, even...though I'm not sure I'll be buying any Pumpkins or Goo Goo Dolls records to find out.) Plus it's got Divine Styler, a pick which--like the hair--confirms my privately-held theory Ned is my friend Andy Zax's benign doppelganger.

― M Specktor (M Specktor), Thursday, 30 October 2003 23:12 (twenty years ago) link

Also, where's Gene?

― J0hn Darn1elle (J0hn Darn1elle), Thursday, 30 October 2003 23:28 (twenty years ago) link

DEAD AND BURIED. Oh if only...

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Thursday, 30 October 2003 23:33 (twenty years ago) link

See what I said about the Smashing Pumpkins up there? MattDC said it better here

― ailsa (ailsa), Thursday, 30 October 2003 23:36 (twenty years ago) link

(er, scroll down a bit)

― ailsa (ailsa), Thursday, 30 October 2003 23:37 (twenty years ago) link

DEAD AND BURIED. Oh if only.....

Wish granted, as I haven't heard anything new in ages. Wonder if Martin Rossiter is now struggling in his local KFC?

― Nichole Graham (Nichole Graham), Thursday, 30 October 2003 23:38 (twenty years ago) link

no he's working on his long-awaited triple-CD entitled "Ned Hates Me But I Shall Love Him 'til I Die

― J0hn Darn1elle (J0hn Darn1elle), Thursday, 30 October 2003 23:40 (twenty years ago) link

For Nicole

― ailsa (ailsa), Thursday, 30 October 2003 23:43 (twenty years ago) link

I should start a Gene picture thread, just for Ned.

― Nicolars (Nicole), Thursday, 30 October 2003 23:44 (twenty years ago) link

Only thing wrong with the Afghan Whigs' "Gentlemen" on the list is that it's not in the top 10.

-- J0hn Darn1elle (edito...), October 30th, 2003 4:45 PM. (J0hn Darn1elle) (later)

SECONDED

― mookieproof (mookieproof), Thursday, 30 October 2003 23:44 (twenty years ago) link

Gene proved, on the strength of an album that was never even released in the US, that they still had their fanbase in L.A. at least

...poor dopes.

I should start a Gene picture thread, just for Ned.

Feel free. You'll be receiving your Carrot-Top photos via mail shortly.

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Thursday, 30 October 2003 23:53 (twenty years ago) link

Check out ILE...

― Nicolars (Nicole), Thursday, 30 October 2003 23:59 (twenty years ago) link

I was going to ask "Where's Menswe@r?" and then...

― Aaron A., Friday, 31 October 2003 00:11 (twenty years ago) link

This is the best Top 136 list I've ever seen. The review of Loveless is the best ever. Selected Ambient Works II is there. This is probably the closest Swervedriver's Raise ever came to getting the respect is deserves. I was a little disappointed at the abscence of the early Melvins and Monster Magnet records though after the great reviews on AMG. Not enough love for metal or hip-hop though.

― Johnny Badlees (crispssssss), Friday, 31 October 2003 00:25 (twenty years ago) link

There were 136 new answers in this thread before I posted to it.

― Tim Finney (Tim Finney), Friday, 31 October 2003 00:35 (twenty years ago) link

Genius!

I was a little disappointed at the abscence of the early Melvins

Er, most of those WERE in the eighties...

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Friday, 31 October 2003 00:59 (twenty years ago) link

Yes, but Houdini would have been an easy pick.

― Kenan Hebert (kenan), Friday, 31 October 2003 01:11 (twenty years ago) link

This is probably the closest Swervedriver's Raise ever came to getting the respect is deserves.

One of my top-five of 1991, to be sure.

― Kenan Hebert (kenan), Friday, 31 October 2003 01:12 (twenty years ago) link

Swervedriver were so predictable...Ride + Teenage Fanclub. Loved "Pile Up" and "Feel So Real" but I could never take them seriously.

― Chris Ott (Chris Ott), Friday, 31 October 2003 01:24 (twenty years ago) link

It's weird, when it comes to the Melvins in the 90s, besides the Lysol EP, I'd probably pick Prick. It was so fucking ridiculous!

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Friday, 31 October 2003 01:25 (twenty years ago) link

swervedriver? teenage fanclub? no, no, it's alright, you don't have to share the crack pipe

― the surface noise (electricsound), Friday, 31 October 2003 01:25 (twenty years ago) link

Swervedriver came up with something quite different, IMO. The mood to listen to Ride and the mood to listen to Swervedriver do not intersect. Teenage Fanclub is right out.

― Kenan Hebert (kenan), Friday, 31 October 2003 01:27 (twenty years ago) link

It's shoegaze + obvious, chunky US Indie gutiar riffs courtesy of Mascis, which Catholic Education was celebrating when Swervedriver formed.

― Chris Ott (Chris Ott), Friday, 31 October 2003 01:32 (twenty years ago) link

the Dino Jr i can see, but not filtered through the eyes of Blake & co

― the surface noise (electricsound), Friday, 31 October 2003 01:34 (twenty years ago) link

I don't understand the "obvious" complaint. Chunky US indie riffs are as obvious as anything. I think maybe you just don't like it.

― Kenan Hebert (kenan), Friday, 31 October 2003 01:37 (twenty years ago) link

interesting reading. A lot of records that I am not even familiar with, oddly. Like, I have 5 out of the 136, and I did buy a lot of records in the 90s, really! Guess I was a retro-rockist at the time. I will have to use this list to fill in the missing corners of the collection.

Very much happy to see the Walkabouts' covers LP in there, it's a solid favourite of mine, especially, as Ned mentioned, the Charlie Rich cover, which is sublimeness. Must go listen again, right now, while reading more of the reviews on the list.

― pauls00, Friday, 31 October 2003 01:40 (twenty years ago) link

Obvious is sometimes used pejoratively in criticism. As in this case. What I'm saying is many of their riffs bordered on headbanging laughability, yet they were dead serious about them, unlike say Mascis, who clearly defined and made light of their affected Rock ridiculousness. Compare "Out There" and "Duel".

― Chris Ott (Chris Ott), Friday, 31 October 2003 01:43 (twenty years ago) link

I like sincerity. Wouldn't have my headbanging any other way.

― Kenan Hebert (kenan), Friday, 31 October 2003 01:47 (twenty years ago) link

And besides, "Duel" isn't the best example (and it's not on Raise). "Rave Down" is far more laughable, if that's the way you feel about it, but it's saved by its sincerity, and its volume. Kidding the sound would make it far worse, not better.

― Kenan Hebert (kenan), Friday, 31 October 2003 01:49 (twenty years ago) link

You can't have it both ways, though. Ride is blissing out, doing the wall of sound ("Dreams Burn Down"). "Rave Down" (an *especially* Fanclubby track borrowing also- duh- from Isn't Anything) is wanky riffing with bratty vocals: it's cock rock in indie clothing.

― Chris Ott (Chris Ott), Friday, 31 October 2003 01:55 (twenty years ago) link

You can't have it both ways, though.

Why th' fuck not? Who made up these rules?

― Kenan Hebert (kenan), Friday, 31 October 2003 02:02 (twenty years ago) link

it's cock rock in indie clothing.

And again, you're losing me. Are you accusing them of being too pretentious or too sincere? You prefer Dinosaur Jr's irony, but want your indie rock to be pure?

― Kenan Hebert (kenan), Friday, 31 October 2003 02:05 (twenty years ago) link

Mascis made indie metal for the most part, he's the precursor to grunge. Swervedriver were trying to be a sensitive, blissy indie band but came from a hair metal pedigree. I didn't buy it, they sounded like phonies to me. That late 90s comeback is pretty solid retroactive evidence, too.

http://www.artistdirect.com/Images/Sources/AMGPORTRAITS/music/portrait200/drp000/p001/p00174qmn30.jpg

― Chris Ott (Chris Ott), Friday, 31 October 2003 02:23 (twenty years ago) link

A picture is worth no words, sometimes.

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Friday, 31 October 2003 02:24 (twenty years ago) link

Plus that fucking name...Swervedriver, could you get any more predictable than that in the early 90s? Ned, let's call our band Supertwirl.

― Chris Ott (Chris Ott), Friday, 31 October 2003 02:25 (twenty years ago) link

http://www.magnetmagazine.com/photos/swerve.jpg
There you go Ned.

― Chris Ott (Chris Ott), Friday, 31 October 2003 02:26 (twenty years ago) link

Um, how are they phonies again?

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Friday, 31 October 2003 02:28 (twenty years ago) link

I'm nto trying to convert anyone Ned, it's how I felt then and how I still feel. They were tacky.

― Chris Ott (Chris Ott), Friday, 31 October 2003 02:29 (twenty years ago) link

Hey, no worries.

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Friday, 31 October 2003 02:31 (twenty years ago) link

Supertwirl, man. Supertwirl.

― Chris Ott (Chris Ott), Friday, 31 October 2003 02:34 (twenty years ago) link

Mascis made indie metal for the most part, he's the precursor to grunge. Swervedriver were trying to be a sensitive, blissy indie band but came from a hair metal pedigree.

But we're talking about the same riffs, right? Big cock-rock riffs? Do you like them or don't you? How is it more of a sin to mix shoegaze with metal than anything else? And what's more...

What's blissy in songs about driving and drinking and William Gibson cyberpunk? If anything, Swervedriver took blissy out of the equation. Your Ride comparison made some sense to me at first, but much less now that you've qualified it. The sound has some of the same texture, but none of the same mood.

And now you've got me thinking that you're judging them by their haircuts, or similarly irrelevant criteria, like their "indieness" or lack thereof.

― Kenan Hebert (kenan), Friday, 31 October 2003 02:49 (twenty years ago) link

I had to sit through a Swervedriver gig in the early 90s, opening for some better band that I was there to see. I can't remember who though. SOnic Youth or Soundgarden or something like that. Who did swervedriver tour with? anyway, they were interminable. And I liked Ride at the time!

― Mr. Diamond (diamond), Friday, 31 October 2003 02:52 (twenty years ago) link

I like Smashing Pumpkins, too. And they have a silly name and big cock-rock riffs. That's a better comparison than Ride, I think.

― Kenan Hebert (kenan), Friday, 31 October 2003 02:55 (twenty years ago) link

actually, now that I think about it, I think firehose were on the bill too! It was like, firehose and Swervedriver and "better band", only I can't remember who the better band was. Maybe they weren't that good. It may not have been SY or SG come to think of it. All I remember is that I did not like firehose and Swervedriver.

― Mr. Diamond (diamond), Friday, 31 October 2003 02:56 (twenty years ago) link

Probably Soundgarden, as Swervedriver did open for them on a national tour in spring 1992.

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Friday, 31 October 2003 02:58 (twenty years ago) link

Yeah ... now that I think about it, I'm sure it was Soundgarden...

― Mr. Diamond (diamond), Friday, 31 October 2003 02:59 (twenty years ago) link

"Chemical Wire", "Sometimes", "Song for the Singer of R.E.M."...good fIREHOSE. 1992, bad. Check out their first two records Mr. D, you might be surprised.

― Chris Ott (Chris Ott), Friday, 31 October 2003 03:04 (twenty years ago) link

anyway, they were interminable.

That, I understand. That's what Chris should have said. :)

― Kenan Hebert (kenan), Friday, 31 October 2003 03:09 (twenty years ago) link

chrome by catherine wheel would be my fave cock rock/shoegaze hybrid.and my fave album by them.

― scott seward, Friday, 31 October 2003 03:25 (twenty years ago) link

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